Wellington Phoenix Men

R6 vs Adelaide United | Saturday 15th Nov | 7:00pm | SS4

477 replies · 28,509 views
over 11 years ago

james dean wrote:

james dean wrote:

martinb wrote:

james dean wrote:

martinb wrote:

Ah the grumpy old men squad are here. 

I see a young team who defended with all their bloody heart and when they made interceptions like Shermy did, got calls against each other.

How about Malik- all that BS about Roly (who by the way had two cheap shots on his knee) two late tackles in professional foul position?

Sure we made some bad challenges, but we also tracked, ran and shut them down time and time again. How many really good chances did they have? Not many. We have had some appalling displays in Hindmarsh and I remember every bloody one of them and this was not one of them.

Did Adelaide deserve to win? No they did not. 

Problem is if you give the ball away like we did, offer basically no attacking threat and rely only on defending you give up chances and good teams will take them.

We got away with it against Central Coast, we didn't here.  The referee didn't help with the goal but if they'd scored with one of the other three or four good chances we'd have had no complaints.  

Shermy looked scared of the ball.  Lia is Lia, Rodriguez is the new Lia.  And our best attacker, the only guy who looks a threat on the break, got subbed, leaving Cunningham and Krishna, neither of whom have any sense of how to keep the ball up front. Very strange decisions from Ernie.

sure. So could we have scored on the counter 2 or 3 times. Those are the tactics and the risks. Worked against WSW, didn't work against Victory and almost and should've worked here. 

Shermy was absolutely exhausted. Cos he'd slogged his guts out all game. and made a good challenge in the dying minutes.

Ernie played the hand he had. It almost worked. And At 92 minutes deserved to.

We had about 30% possession in that half. That's not tactics, it's rolling the dice



Are you serious? If Adelaide have got a high press on us we would have to be borderline retarded to try and play possession, all we'd end up doing is getting the ball picked off in our own half (as we did). When they have numbers forward like that there is less people at the back, hence your best bet is to stick your two quickest players up top and lump it over the top. 

You can't create pressure if you don't keep the ball.  The ball over the top is a pretty basic tactic that rarely works at this level because it's far too easy for defenders.  We need to be able to get the ball down and play even when we're under pressure, you can beat a press in different ways but one thing you need is your guys up front to keep hold of the ball to get you up the pitch.  And there wasn't much of that once we were left with Cunningham and Krishna out there.



Yeah sure its basic but the thing is when the opposition are that high up there is space in behind, Im not talking lumping it to a centre forward to hold up, Im talking putting it over the top into the space between the centre halves and the goalkeeper and letting two of your fastest players run onto it. The fact is we tried to play out but when there are that many players swarming in your half there is no space to play, and if you lose it its game over. Not only is it safe but it forces the centre halves to drop and chase, this brings back there centre mids, wingbacks and playmakers. This in turn forces their forwards to drop. Now at very least they have to break our defence again. Not only that but everytime their team drops they will tire and further take the pace out of the game. If we try to play out and we lose the ball they are already on top of us and often its only one ball before they are in on goal again. Im not suggesting playing Ricki from the start of the game but if they are playing THAT higher press, we have to atleast everynow and then lump it over the top and force their team to drop
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over 11 years ago

It doesn't matter who reffed this match, we didn't deserve to even draw. They had soo many good chances, they should've buried us. We had pretty much nothing apart from the goal we got.

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over 11 years ago

I hear a lot of people say we didn't deserve to get anything out of this game but in football it's not always about what you deserve.

We took the lead and then did well to hang on for so long - Away from home against the now league leaders.

The overall impression I got from this game was that we looked a lot more likely to get something out of a game at Coopers Stadium than we did the last couple of years we went there.

We've got more depth and attacking edge and a midfield that is more dynamic.

However as many people here have already pointed out, we didn't keep the ball well enough especially towards the end of the second half. It's got to be a concern if we cant string together 2 passes for over 45 minutes...

Also yes the Ref was an idiot but we give away far too many free-kicks by rushing in and making challenges we don't need to make, not only in this game.

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over 11 years ago

Also yes the Ref was an idiot but we give away far too many free-kicks by rushing in and making challenges we don't need to make, not only in this game.

We didn't do ourselves any favours but all I ask is that the ref be an idiot to both sides.   

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 11 years ago

There is no way you create any pressure playing that way.  At this level no striker can make up 5-10 meters on a defender.  It's just giving a team who are good at building attacks from deep the ball back and giving them another chance to attack.  If an A-League team conceded a goal from a direct simple ball over the top there would be an inquest

If you're worried about a press then you need quick accurate forward passes out of defence and you need players in front of the ball to hold it up to allow you to get up the pitch.

Normo's coming home

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over 11 years ago

The thing is we know that a few individuals in our team are up there in terms of quality, but everyone seems to just lack composure on the ball and are prone to panic. Yet we try and play it out from the back, almost suicidally.

Adelaide are at another level to us in terms of passing and tempo, but should they be? Our back four might not be the most technical of players, but most of the rest of the team are supposed to be.

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over 11 years ago

james dean wrote:

There is no way you create any pressure playing that way.  At this level no striker can make up 5-10 meters on a defender.  It's just giving a team who are good at building attacks from deep the ball back and giving them another chance to attack.  If an A-League team conceded a goal from a direct simple ball over the top there would be an inquest

If you're worried about a press then you need quick accurate forward passes out of defence and you need players in front of the ball to hold it up to allow you to get up the pitch.

Which is why you actually need a quality striker. I would be happy if we had a striker who scored 8 goals a season but was a proper target man that Burns and McGlinchey could feed off.

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over 11 years ago

james dean wrote:

There is no way you create any pressure playing that way.  At this level no striker can make up 5-10 meters on a defender.  It's just giving a team who are good at building attacks from deep the ball back and giving them another chance to attack.  If an A-League team conceded a goal from a direct simple ball over the top there would be an inquest

If you're worried about a press then you need quick accurate forward passes out of defence and you need players in front of the ball to hold it up to allow you to get up the pitch.

We didn't lose 6-0 mate, we were beaten 2-1 by the league leaders with a goal scored in the last minute. 
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over 11 years ago

Adelaide had at least 3 chances that they could/should have scored from but didn't (the one that hit the post and rebounded back to Moss, that one where it pinballed around and just snuck past the post, and the one where he missed from about 5 yards) so we were fortunate to be still level in the 94th minute anyway. People saying we restricted their chances or that we deserved a draw are entitled to that opinion but I just don't see it. We got absolutely smashed by them, especially in the 2nd half. We were awful. The ref was bad, but that's a red herring really. 

Also, after all these years have we still not worked out that you need to mark guys when you're defending a set piece?

People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis. You can't trust people.

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over 11 years ago

My impression of the game was that we played the first 20 or so very well and were pretty good value for our lead.  From that point on through til about the 70 min, our midfield simply couldn't keep the ball to string attacks together.  It was all Adelaide at that point and we were just hanging on.

I actually thought the subs they made helped us re-establish some control and Ridenton & Rufer did well when they came on.  The pace went out of the game and at that point I actually thought we looked more likely to win.  The only way in which they were going to score after those subs was from a set piece which a combination of some panicking defending and some dodgy referring gave them.  

Overall Adelaide were the better side, but it was still a kick in the teeth to lose the game like we did.

This formation of Ernie's (adjusted midfield diamond or whatever) seems to make it difficult for opposing teams to breakdown, but I'm not sure if it is that great for us going forward.  Was also surprised that when Kenny came on he went into midfield and Roly stayed up front instead of dropping back deeper.

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over 11 years ago

My impression of the game was that we played the first 20 or so very well and were pretty good value for our lead.  From that point on through til about the 70 min, our midfield simply couldn't keep the ball to string attacks together.  It was all Adelaide at that point and we were just hanging on.

I actually thought the subs they made helped us re-establish some control and Ridenton & Rufer did well when they came on.  The pace went out of the game and at that point I actually thought we looked more likely to win.  The only way in which they were going to score after those subs was from a set piece which a combination of some panicking defending and some dodgy referring gave them.  

Overall Adelaide were the better side, but it was still a kick in the teeth to lose the game like we did.

This formation of Ernie's (adjusted midfield diamond or whatever) seems to make it difficult for opposing teams to breakdown, but I'm not sure if it is that great for us going forward.  Was also surprised that when Kenny came on he went into midfield and Roly stayed up front instead of dropping back deeper.

I agree with this pretty much 100%

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over 11 years ago

Adelaide are a better side than us. I thought we would lose 3 - 0, so I think we did well, although how many times do we lose in the last minute...

I like tautologies because I like them.
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over 11 years ago

Cosimo wrote:

Adelaide are a better side than us. I thought we would lose 3 - 0, so I think we did well, although how many times do we lose in the last minute...

Not any more than every other team id say

 I

a.haak

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over 11 years ago

We were always going to be up against it. According to one of the commentators, Adelaide had the SAS playing for them.

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over 11 years ago

AJ13 wrote:

It doesn't matter who reffed this match, we didn't deserve to even draw. They had soo many good chances, they should've buried us. We had pretty much nothing apart from the goal we got.

True. They were very unlucky a number of occasions and we took the only chance we got. People seem to forget that this is the A League. The refs are shite. Always have been.



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over 11 years ago

Win, lose or draw, I often watch the game the next day after things have cooled down. It is amazing some of the things you miss.I had another look today and this is what I think.

We gave away too many free kick, too many offsides and we really need a player like Malik. He was the  major difference in the game last night.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 11 years ago

I think we were very lucky that Djite wasn't playing or he would have buried a few of those chances.

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over 11 years ago

Leggy wrote:

Win, lose or draw, I often watch the game the next day after things have cooled down. It is amazing some of the things you miss.I had another look today and this is what I think.

We gave away too many free kick, too many offsides and we really need a player like Malik. He was the  major difference in the game last night.

I agree Malick is a very good player, better than some of the current Socceroo selections in my opinion. But it's an easy game for a defender when you've got almost all the possession and a frontline and midfield as devastating as Adelaide's. Hell, even Boogaard looks good these days and he is a rubbish defender. 

For our part I thought Durante put in another top quality performance. The defence was blameworthy for their failings at setpieces but their job was made extremely difficult by the complete inability of the midfield to hold the ball for any length of time. It was hard to watch that 2nd half when time and time again we simply surrendered the ball and then committed stupid fouls. Even so, I felt we were worth the point because considering all this Reds were actually quite lethargic and unimpressive, as though they just assumed they would get the winner in the end. 

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over 11 years ago

Leggy wrote:

Win, lose or draw, I often watch the game the next day after things have cooled down. It is amazing some of the things you miss.I had another look today and this is what I think.

We gave away too many free kick, too many offsides and we really need a player like Malik. He was the  major difference in the game last night.

I thoiught he was sensational. 



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over 11 years ago

nufc_nz wrote:

Leggy wrote:

Win, lose or draw, I often watch the game the next day after things have cooled down. It is amazing some of the things you miss.I had another look today and this is what I think.

We gave away too many free kick, too many offsides and we really need a player like Malik. He was the  major difference in the game last night.

I thoiught he was sensational. 

Why?
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over 11 years ago

nufc_nz wrote:

Leggy wrote:

Win, lose or draw, I often watch the game the next day after things have cooled down. It is amazing some of the things you miss.I had another look today and this is what I think.

We gave away too many free kick, too many offsides and we really need a player like Malik. He was the  major difference in the game last night.

I thoiught he was sensational. 

Why?

I did not think he was sensational but he reads the game well,  broke up our attack and played excellent balls to his team mates. Compare him to Siggy and to some extent Durante who hump the ball forward.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 11 years ago

But he tackles like Manny.

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 11 years ago

Junior82 wrote:

But he tackles like Manny.

And twice as good.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 11 years ago

I don't doubt it, Ned Zelic made sure of that.

He was so good that he should have finished the game early around the 75-80 minute mark.

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 11 years ago · edited over 11 years ago · History

Junior82 wrote:

But he tackles like Manny.

But Manny is better at picking up a second yellow. He is by now a pro at that (not last night though), while Malik clearly can't reach those levels yet despite trying his hardest.

Actually, getting outplayed quite a bit these days

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over 11 years ago · edited over 11 years ago · History

Also all the tactical analyses were talking about the space given to the CB as a result of there not being a forward to press them, giving them a lot more time on the ball. Not sure what part that played.



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over 11 years ago

Leggy wrote:

nufc_nz wrote:

Leggy wrote:

Win, lose or draw, I often watch the game the next day after things have cooled down. It is amazing some of the things you miss.I had another look today and this is what I think.

We gave away too many free kick, too many offsides and we really need a player like Malik. He was the  major difference in the game last night.

I thoiught he was sensational. 

Why?

I did not think he was sensational but he reads the game well,  broke up our attack and played excellent balls to his team mates. Compare him to Siggy and to some extent Durante who hump the ball forward.

I was obviously taking the piss on Ned Zelic. Were you not listening to him last night?



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over 11 years ago

Got this on the Fever FB page today. Nice work those over there. 

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over 11 years ago · edited over 11 years ago · History

Merrick on refs "I've found that when you're at the Phoenix it's pretty tough, I found that when I was at the Victory I had a better run, I have to say."

please note, I've cherry picked this quote- he doesn't blame the ref for the result.

Burns played with a corked thigh.



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over 11 years ago

Ernie also did mention that Malik should've picked up a second yellow for doing the exact same thing he did to obtain his first, but the referee wasn't consistent on that .

That's why the ref was terrible . That and he didn't see Shane Smeltz get kicked in the face during our Brazil qualifying game against New Caledonia last year .

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over 11 years ago

Interesting to see Nix change of shape side by side. WSW game on left. Adelaide on right.

 

Krishna playing deeper to give JBS cover to counter Mabil. Which was largely effective. right FB outlet high not there at all.

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over 11 years ago

I thought JBS actually had a decent game.

Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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over 11 years ago

Jeez, look how deep we were and how compressed that midfield was. Also demonstrates just why Burns was so ineffectual - he's not the right sort of player to be playing as an isolated striker

People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis. You can't trust people.

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over 11 years ago

Shit ref and to many stupid fouls. The ref we can't fix but the fouls must stop.

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over 11 years ago

Seen a few comments on facebook from people claiming FFA have cited Strebre. Cannot find any credible sauces though

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over 11 years ago

Burns was off side all 2nd half.

Oi Oi Edgecumbe... lets have a clean sheet

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