Wellington Phoenix Men

R7 vs Sydney Sat 23rd 7:30pm

573 replies · 24,970 views
over 12 years ago

A fair result in what was an even game against Perth. We probably edged the first half, but the tempo we played at was far too slow to exploit any advantage we had in the game. Maybe the travel is taking is starting to take its toll on the players? A general lack of pace in the starting eleven is really hurting us too, especially in the attacking third, and we definitely haven’t figured out our best formation or our best starting lineup.

I thought Huysegems was one of our better players in the first half of today’s game. His hold up play and his ability to bring others into the game with nice little touches really stood out. Disappointingly, he disappeared in the second half and I just don’t think he offers enough of a goal threat to justify his place up front alongside Brockie.  Personally, I think the Phoenix should be playing one up front, and because Huysegems doesn’t offer enough of a goal threat, that position should be filled by Brockie.

With only one up front, I’d be bringing Cunningham back into the side to play down the right. He’s been unconvincing so far, but he needs to be given a chance and he would provide us with some much needed pace. I’d also bring Hicks into the side and play him on the left as it’s noticeable that our play in the final third improves whenever he comes on due to his distribution and his willingness to make himself available for the pass.

Having a couple of wide players in the starting eleven also gives us a more balanced side and would provide more support for our fullbacks on both defence and attack. In particular, the two wide players would prevent the opposition fullbacks from getting forward and exploiting our defensive vulnerability out wide. At the moment there’s no point playing Caira and Fenton (who should be stuck with for now) because they aren’t great defenders and neither of them is able to get forward without exposing our flanks when we lose the ball.

If Hicks comes into the starting eleven, then one of our midfield trio has to go. Riera had a great game today (why was he taken off for Ifill?) and he should be a regular from now on. Not only does he take up good positions on the field for a defensive midfielder, but he’s also the best at bringing the ball out from the back. That leaves Muscat or Lia and for me it has to be Lia who goes. While Lia was the better of the two today, Muscat has been the better of the two so far this season and he doesn’t give the ball away in dangerous areas of the pitch like Lia does.

Obviously Hernandez takes his place in the side just behind Brockie. It was great to see him get on the ball more in the first half today, even if he only had an okay game. The Phoenix will be better off in the long run if he continues to get a lot of touches. However, I hope Merrick has a plan in place to ensure that he doesn’t get worn out by the end of the season. He’s disappeared in the back end of the second half in a few games already this season and we definitely rely on him to be our playmaker.

This would be my starting lineup for our game against Sydney:

MOSS

FENTON; SIGMUND; DURANTE; CAIRA

RIERA; MUSCAT

CUNNINGHAM; HERNANDEZ; HICKS

BROCKIE

Thoughts?


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over 12 years ago

Was this not similar to the start of the season and it did not work?

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago

Siggy and Brockie would be lucky  to get on the bench.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 12 years ago

Not really. Adams was at right back, Lia was in midfield and Stein was up front against Brisbane. Against Wanderers we started Bertos at right back, Lia in midfield and both Brockie and Stein up front. Against Newcastle we started Bertos at right back, Lia in midfield and Brockie, Ifill and Stein in a front three.

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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History

I was really meaning the 4 up front and 2 DMs. That's 4-2-3-1 which Ernie would like to play but does not really work for us (if we had a monster DM....)

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago
Leggy wrote:

Siggy and Brockie would be lucky  to get on the bench.



Sigmund has been good overall this season.

Not being around here much I can see you don't like Brockie. That is fine. The fact is though that Brockie gets goals - about 50% of all of our goals. If you don't pick  him then you need to replace his goals. Stein just doesn't get enough goals to be a sole striker. If we only pick one striker then it has to be Brockie.
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over 12 years ago

I must admit I prefer Stein to Brockie however what I prefer and what works are very different

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago
Leggy wrote:

Siggy and Brockie would be lucky  to get on the bench.

I have a feeling after our mid week fixture in a certain Central American chit hole, many people may be echoing this before the Sydney fixture.
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over 12 years ago
Jeff Vader wrote:

I must admit I prefer Stein to Brockie however what I prefer and what works are very different


This is so true in so many ways and levels

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 12 years ago
Jeff Vader wrote:

I was really meaning the 4 up front and 2 DMs. That's 4-2-3-1 which Ernie would like to play but does not really work for us (if we had a monster DM....)


I think 4-2-3-1 can work for us. So far we've only tried it with Manny and Lia as our defensive midfielders. The problem with playing both of them is that we can't maintain possession and defend effectively at the same time. If you replace either of them with Riera I think we would find it much easier to maintain possession. If Hicks plays down the left we don't lose anything defensively either as he can take up a narrower position when we don't have the ball as he demonstrated against Wanderers when he subbed on for Stein.
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over 12 years ago
Junior82 wrote:
Jeff Vader wrote:

I must admit I prefer Stein to Brockie however what I prefer and what works are very different


This is so true in so many ways and levels



I want to like Stein, but no matter how well he plays he doesn't provide the same goal threat as Brockie. Say what you will about all the other aspects of their respective games, but the main purpose of playing as a striker is to score goals and that's something Brockie proved he can do on a regular basis last season.
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over 12 years ago
AJ13 wrote:
Leggy wrote:

Siggy and Brockie would be lucky  to get on the bench.

I have a feeling after our mid week fixture in a certain Central American chit hole, many people may be echoing this before the Sydney fixture.

Game is actually the Saturday after the return fixture in Wellington..all Nix AWs players may be tired/hungover/depressed not just those two.

A small town in Europe........looking to bounce straight back up....well that aint going to happen

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over 12 years ago

You are correct.

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over 12 years ago

Richie -


how about this for a wacky lineup:

Moss

Manny, Dura, Boxall, Caira

Fenton, Reira, Hicks,

Carlos

Brockie, Ifill

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over 12 years ago
RichieRich wrote:
Junior82 wrote:
Jeff Vader wrote:

I must admit I prefer Stein to Brockie however what I prefer and what works are very different


This is so true in so many ways and levels



I want to like Stein, but no matter how well he plays he doesn't provide the same goal threat as Brockie. Say what you will about all the other aspects of their respective games, but the main purpose of playing as a striker is to score goals and that's something Brockie proved he can do on a regular basis last season.


Spot on. I would have Brockie start first any time.
Stein had one of his better games on Saturday for the Nix, harried well, did some good things, but I don't think at any stage he threatened the goal.
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over 12 years ago
hepatitis wrote:
RichieRich wrote:
Junior82 wrote:
Jeff Vader wrote:

I must admit I prefer Stein to Brockie however what I prefer and what works are very different


This is so true in so many ways and levels



I want to like Stein, but no matter how well he plays he doesn't provide the same goal threat as Brockie. Say what you will about all the other aspects of their respective games, but the main purpose of playing as a striker is to score goals and that's something Brockie proved he can do on a regular basis last season.


Spot on. I would have Brockie start first any time.
Stein had one of his better games on Saturday for the Nix, harried well, did some good things, but I don't think at any stage he threatened the goal.


Stein didn't take a single shot against Perth.


Stein has taken 6 shots (4 shots on target, 2 shots off target) in 348 minutes this season, whereas Brockie has taken 9 shots (2 shots on target, 7 shots off target) in 357 minutes. That's an average of one shot every 58 minutes for Stein and one shot every 40 minutes for Brockie.

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over 12 years ago

I think that just shows that we are really struggling to create good scoring opportunities.

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over 12 years ago

Chances are there but they are difficult ones to be fair. How close and how many times have we hit a post? Nice to have met you by the way.

Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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over 12 years ago

Likewise LG. Top work on the Hard News masks.

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over 12 years ago

Would it not be round 7 vs Sydney? Mods take control!

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago

I watched the game this arvo, HN made a few appearances. there in spirit I guess. Mind you, he also made more of an effort to get involved than the locals sadly.

Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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over 12 years ago
Jeff Vader wrote:

Would it not be round 7 vs Sydney? Mods take control!

I don't know what you're talking about...

Yellow Fever - Misery loves company

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over 12 years ago

Sydney Under Farina: Home W8 D2 L2, Away W1 D3 L8.

Gonna be a tough ask.

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over 12 years ago

Using the shots per game stat is silly IMO.
In fact using those exact numbers posted earlier, you will see that shots on target completely changes things

Average mins per shot on target:

Stein 87 mins
Brockie 178 mins

Brockie does have a hell of a lot of pot shots that go nowhere near the goal often. Can't remember Stein ever doing that.


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over 12 years ago

I'm indifferent between Brockie and Stein, i mean, Stein didn't shine under Ricki and it's only early stages this season so can't judge as yet.

Brockie played 2116 mins last season, 24 games, 24 starts, 78 shots, 36 on target, 16 goals.

0.681 goals per game (90min), 0.205 goals per shot, 0.444 goals per shot on target

Stein played 1368 mins last season, 23 games, 17 starts, 24 shots, 12 on target, 5 goals.

0.329 goals per game (90min), 0.208 goals per shot, 0.417 goals per shot on target

In terms of "goal threat" in think they are both good.  I think Stein hit the post 3-4 times last season as well...and he might be affected by the style of football we played last season.

But we know there is a 20% of scoring, everytime they pull the trigger.

 

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over 12 years ago
el grapadura wrote:

I think that just shows that we are really struggling to create good scoring opportunities.


+1


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over 12 years ago
Safire wrote:

I'm indifferent between Brockie and Stein, i mean, Stein didn't shine under Ricki and it's only early stages this season so can't judge as yet.

Brockie played 2116 mins last season, 24 games, 24 starts, 78 shots, 36 on target, 16 goals.

0.681 goals per game (90min), 0.205 goals per shot, 0.444 goals per shot on target

Stein played 1368 mins last season, 23 games, 17 starts, 24 shots, 12 on target, 5 goals.

0.329 goals per game (90min), 0.208 goals per shot, 0.417 goals per shot on target

In terms of "goal threat" in think they are both good.  I think Stein hit the post 3-4 times last season as well...and he might be affected by the style of football we played last season.

But we know there is a 20% of scoring, everytime they pull the trigger.

 


You do need to take into account that Brockie was on pens last year.  You've got to score them but it does help his stats.

I'm also the same in that I like Steyn, and he's definitely a better player than Brockie, but we're not creating the type of chances that he needs.  Brockie is a very unsophisticated player, he makes pretty bad runs, he doesn't get involved in the build up play, he pretty much can't play back to goal and he's not effective coming from out wide.  But he does get goals and I'm not sure that even if we were creating more chances that Huysegemes would outscore him.

I don't think they're an effective partnership though and we're desperate for some width.  I think you've got to give Cunningham some game time, even if its off the bench, and try and get him up to speed because without him we lack pace and penetration.

Normo's coming home

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over 12 years ago

100% agree JD

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago
james dean wrote:

I don't think they're an effective partnership though and we're desperate for some width.  I think you've got to give Cunningham some game time, even if its off the bench, and try and get him up to speed because without him we lack pace and penetration.


The issue for me here, does Cunningham actually have genuine pace? That was what we were told when he got signed up, but on the evidence of his performances so far, I haven't really seen it. He has had a few niggles, so that could play a part in that, but if this is the best he's got, we ain't going nowhere fast.
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over 12 years ago
james dean wrote:

I'm also the same in that I like Steyn, and he's definitely a better player than Brockie, but we're not creating the type of chances that he needs.  Brockie is a very unsophisticated player, he makes pretty bad runs, he doesn't get involved in the build up play, he pretty much can't play back to goal and he's not effective coming from out wide.  But he does get goals and I'm not sure that even if we were creating more chances that Huysegemes would outscore him. I don't think they're an effective partnership though and we're desperate for some width.  I think you've got to give Cunningham some game time, even if its off the bench, and try and get him up to speed because without him we lack pace and penetration.


I've been wondering over the last 2-3 rounds while watching the Brockie- Stein combination whether it would be feasible to consider dropping Waffles back (ie. as a midfielder - playmaker). I am sure it is not his instinctive place etc, but he may be of more use pairing off Carlos in midfield? And he would not get tangled up with Brockie so much.

Actually, getting outplayed quite a bit these days

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over 12 years ago

Stein frustrates me sometimes because I think he relies on his left foot too much when using he right would be a better option. 

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over 12 years ago
Jtoml3 wrote:

Stein frustrates me sometimes because I think he relies on his left foot too much when using he right would be a better option. 



Waffles has a right foot? ;)
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over 12 years ago


Yes, the one he's scored a few times with.

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over 12 years ago
el grapadura wrote:
james dean wrote:

I don't think they're an effective partnership though and we're desperate for some width.  I think you've got to give Cunningham some game time, even if its off the bench, and try and get him up to speed because without him we lack pace and penetration.


The issue for me here, does Cunningham actually have genuine pace? That was what we were told when he got signed up, but on the evidence of his performances so far, I haven't really seen it. He has had a few niggles, so that could play a part in that, but if this is the best he's got, we ain't going nowhere fast.


Absolutely - I just think unless he fires what we have won't be enough this season.  Therefore, I'd play him and give him the opportunity to get up to speed in the first half of the season in the hope he can deliver in the second half.  I didn't think he looked lightening fast but he does look strong and he's definitely different to what we already have.

Normo's coming home

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over 12 years ago
james dean wrote:
el grapadura wrote:
james dean wrote:

I don't think they're an effective partnership though and we're desperate for some width.  I think you've got to give Cunningham some game time, even if its off the bench, and try and get him up to speed because without him we lack pace and penetration.


The issue for me here, does Cunningham actually have genuine pace? That was what we were told when he got signed up, but on the evidence of his performances so far, I haven't really seen it. He has had a few niggles, so that could play a part in that, but if this is the best he's got, we ain't going nowhere fast.


Absolutely - I just think unless he fires what we have won't be enough this season.  Therefore, I'd play him and give him the opportunity to get up to speed in the first half of the season in the hope he can deliver in the second half.  I didn't think he looked lightening fast but he does look strong and he's definitely different to what we already have.

 

I can't believe that we signed him without actually seeing that he has pace, just does not make sense. Not Benji pace, but the ability to keep the ball at speed/use power, beat players and create chances, you know pace! When I first saw him play I thought "WTF? That's pretty average" but Vickmeist said he was carrying injuries.

I'm sure it's got to be niggles or confidence he surely can't be a tugboat?

 

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over 12 years ago
el grapadura wrote:
james dean wrote:

I don't think they're an effective partnership though and we're desperate for some width.  I think you've got to give Cunningham some game time, even if its off the bench, and try and get him up to speed because without him we lack pace and penetration.


The issue for me here, does Cunningham actually have genuine pace? That was what we were told when he got signed up, but on the evidence of his performances so far, I haven't really seen it. He has had a few niggles, so that could play a part in that, but if this is the best he's got, we ain't going nowhere fast.

 

I keep hearing that Cunningham has loads of pace but im assuming that he's playing this skill very close to his chest because I havent seen any evidence of yet..so quite right el grap

" If you only have a hammer you tend to see every problem as a nail" - maslow

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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History

Still remember cunningham failing to outgas old broichy :/

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over 12 years ago

After yesterday's game i feel so lucky that RH is gone, otherwise we might see Christie partnering Lia in this game...

Just saying...

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over 12 years ago

We want 7?


"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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