Referees

The BEST explanation.

I'll get my coat..

LOL guys, that was not close to the worst ref decision, he actually got that right coz it was off-side... Safire2012-02-13 15:28:33

Good god, if referee's carded players for waving their arms at the refs, most games would end up at 5 aside...

No game can finish 5-a-side, as 7 is the minimum number of players a team must have on the field in order to keep playing the game.

Just for future reference.

+1

And I thought our game was meant to be the simple game because we had few rules

Ah yes, I did know that - I was being facetious

I had no idea that there was an offside flag involved! That does make a difference.
djtim30002012-02-13 15:58:16

Just to clarify the point I'd made about the waving of hands at the referee, from the LotG:

A player is cautioned and shown the yellow card if he commits any of the
following seven offences:
� unsporting behaviour
� dissent by word or action
� persistent infringement of the Laws of the Game
� delaying the restart of play
� failure to respect the required distance when play is restarted with a corner
kick, free kick or throw-in
� entering or re-entering the ? eld of play without the referee�s permission
� deliberately leaving the ? eld of play without the referee�s permission

I don't have a problem with Durante being carded for dissent, I just wish referees were consistent about it.

And some advice for Durante, from FIFA's instructions to referees on how to deal with dissent, appended to the LotG:

A player who is guilty of dissent by protesting (verbally or non-verbally) against a referee�s decision must be cautioned.
The captain of a team has no special status or privileges under the Laws of the Game but he has a degree of responsibility for the behaviour of his team.el grapadura2012-02-13 16:04:52

Well, they do it - players do get booked for dissent by action.

But I agree that there is not a lot of consistency in the way the law is applied, and one of the reasons for it may well be that they get crucified by fans and media alike when they do it. Soft yellow cards apparently.

This

Someone asked me at the weekend how could improve the quality of referee's in the A-League, my comment was:

Clamp down severely on dissent. The biggest cause of people dropping out of reffing is the abuse, and because it seems to be tolerated to an extent at the top level (a la Man Utds crowd the ref en masse technique) players in the lower levels of football follow suite. Getting the abuse of officials out of the game, will mean a larger pool of ref talent staying with the game, meaning a higher standard of ref at the top level.

I recall seeing Durante walking a fair way in the direction of the linesman and waving his arms around and clearly (even tho seen from behind)  giving him stick for something. I remember thinking he had better watch it and then the ref went across and gave him the yellow. Seemed fair to me. He lost it. You need a captain to stand up for the team, but not like that

Ooh you devil,every vowel in a goddamn row - nasty!

Amazing syzygy there. Junior822012-02-13 17:14:00

Ah, if that is the case I withdraw and apologise.

I agree to a certain extent, but to do it inconsistently and in isolation only makes the fans reactions worse.

The only way to change this (and I think this is desperately needed) is for it to be a FIFA (or FFA if just for the A-League) edict that ALL dissent will be strictly policed from this point on. I would imagine the first few games would end up with a number of red cards (every single person running at the ref after a decision bar the captain IF he approaches calmly should/would be booked to start with) but players would soon learn, and it would be a much more pleasant game to watch.aitkenmike2012-02-13 20:04:56

That was just poor rhythm there Junior!   

Yeah but the fans would be the first one to whinge about referees killing the game for needless yellows for dissent when tackles go unpunished. Which is worse, dissent or a bad tackle?

You have to be careful not to devalue the yellow card cause then it means nothing. If you get 10 dished out a game, and 5 for dissent, then gobbing off is just as bad as a tackle. You'll then destroy player safety because the players see no deterrent value in a yellow card. Then the clubs will complain to the FFA, the viewership will drop cause 'referees are detroying the game with silly yellows' and the FFA will be forced to back down. Who do you think really runs the game in England where referee abuse is generally recognised as the worst, the Premier League or the clubs? You know the answer to that when nothing is done about player behaviour towards the referee. Same thing here. The FFA/Premier League get their money to run the leagues from the TV deal. The clubs know without them or reduced quality, there is less/no money. Who holds the power?
Jeff Vader2012-02-13 20:26:22

At the risk of playing devils advocate.....

Can I suggest that if Durante knew he was sitting on 4 yellows with one game to go until the automatic suspension gets put back and a tough road home to the playoffs then perhaps this was one game he probably should have kept his mouth shut and arms to himself?

Can I suggest that after a series of baffling/questionable decisions cascading one after another Durante could be forgiven for being incredulous,just a little pissed off, and wanting some answers?

So if its obvious the ref was having a stinker, then why tempt fate?

It is usually not what you say but how you say it.

I still think that if it was well announced so everyone knew it was coming, and applied strictly and (the key part) consistently teams would learn very quickly, and fans would understand - i'm sure most are sick of the disgraceful behaviour. The reason it wouldn't devalue yellow cards is that a 2nd yellow still sees you being sent off - instant value.

This. If we consistently keep getting rubbish referees we need to learn to deal with it. The captain should know better.

Has diving stopped since they announced they were going to crack down on it? Has kicking the oppositions key player stopped since they changed the interpretation around tackles and removed the word intent? Nothing will change.

....Totally agree, as the season has progress the refs are all falling off the pace...Too many are having a huge effect on the games result with doubtful decisions [ eg our 1st home set the standard ]...and many of these decisions you would expect a Capital 1 ref too get right....Most of these officals are Fifa standard??????....who will ref the FINAL...MAYBE THEY WILL FLY SOMEONE IN...because no one on the A- League panel derserves to ref it....as for the Assitances..NO COMMENT

Slight sidenote, but diving should be reviewable by the Match Review Panel. Maybe only in clear-cut cases, but surely it wouldn't be hard to do and would be a far better way to crack down on the problem

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/soccer-football/news/article.cfm?c_id=86&objectid=10785423

A-League defends referee standards

The head of the A-League's referees is defending the standard of officiating in this year's competition.

The Wellington Phoenix have criticised the refereeing in the league following the club's loss to the Brisbane Roar.

Director of referees Mark Shield says while there's always room for improvement, the officiating has been very good this year.

Shield says they have someone monitoring every single refereeing decision and 93 per cent of their decisions have been correct.

Shield says they're currently reviewing the Phoenix-Roar match and he's open to talk to the Phoenix once it's completed.

Phoenix skipper Andrew Durante has questioned why he was yellow carded for dissent when he wasn't abusive towards the linesman.

Shield says the captain doesn't necessarily have any special privileges to question an official's decision.

He says while they haven't reviewed that particular incident yet, if there are visible signs of dissent the referee is supposed to take action.

Safire2012-02-14 10:13:14

To be fair if you are getting 93 out of 100 decisions correct, thats a very good success rate. What footballer would boast a 93% success rate across passes, tackles, headers... It comes back to angles, distance, perhaps the wrong signal from the lino. I think if you are wanting a better figure then 7 more decisions across 100 is the difference between perfect and what we have. I'd say thats a very poor demand if thats not good enough. Even 95% is only 2 more.... The difference is nothing. Jeff Vader2012-02-14 11:21:06

As Safire points out that 93% figure is almost meaningless unless broken down into what types of decisions.

Problem with being a referee is that you can get 99.9% of decisions correct, but it's the one you get wrong which will be the one which bites you in the ass.

As I said, it would need to be applied strictly and consistently across the board, and the referees would need to be backed up by the board every time that fans get on their back, which I agree would be inevitable early on in the process. I maintain that it would only take a few weeks of it being consistently applied before behaviour would change, and if fans saw the consistency they could deal with it.

On the 93% thing - if that includes simple decisions like obvious goal kicks/throws, then I would expect the ratio to be a lot higher.

93% correct calls - Good on the Refs.
How bad are the 7% they got wrong? Those are the ones that people remember

So far since I've been watching the a-league i've found the refs have remained at a constant level, while the tactics/ skills/ play has improved. Therefore forming a gap between ref level of ability and players level which is why there have been mistakes due to an increased tempo etc...

Surely the target ought to be 95%?

The way that Broich continually falls over seems to make him the biggest cheat in the competition, or is there someone worse.