What is this obsession with a target man?

We seem to be packing it with right sided midfield players. Ifill, Troy and Leo, although Leo can play both sides he is happier on the right.
Agree that we need more people on the score sheet this year and we seem to be getting more firepower.

Any of our wingers can play either side, but yeah, like most teams most are right footed.

I wish we could somehow get Fabiano. Honestly is the best at winning headers from long balls and he sits on the bench at Melb most of the time. Is a more complete striker than either Archie or Allsopp.

Its just the trend in the premier league right now. Premier league gets the most exposure, so more people jump on the bandwagon. how things might be different if Spanish football got more coverage here! (or Italian, i wonder what premier league club woulda picked short stuff Cannavaro as a world-class central defender when he was young!)

Coveny was tall..

Sign him up! quick, before Gold Coast try and take him.
WillyB2009-07-23 21:31:04

Just out of interest, who? Apparently Ifill isn't great in the air, neither is Costa (although TBF his onlt A-League goal was a headder). Not sure about Greenacre...

Fair call

you've convinced me Oska. Ifill is a turtle

Oska2009-07-23 22:19:31

Well there is a place for a targetman in some games because the whole idea is not just to hold the ball and lay it but to draw defenders away and make running gaps for the other players direct for goal. If a defender comes in and is drawn to the targetman with his back to the goal then a gap appears just behind that defender for someone to diagonally slip through to the goal as the defensive line is broken. If a defender does not drawn to the targetman then it leaves too much space for the targetman to turn and have a shot at goal.

On the upshot of it, when a targetman player has the ball near the edge of the box, the defence has to be organised to allow a defender to pin the targetman so he does not turn and shoot or slip a ball behind the defence but also to draw itself more central to close the gap run on by other players that he lays off or cleverly slip a ball. This means that the defence has to pull back to the establish line and becomes more central, therefore null the central attack, but then opens up the wide attack to the goal line if the ball is moved quickly enough.

What we lack last season, is mixing in some central attacks. We had plenty of wide attacks that didn't amount much as well as predictable long crosses that was defendable. We do need to mix the attack up and keep the defence guessing so a variety of attacks are needed as well as having a targetman to disrupt the defences so they are caught in two minds.

I can't see having a targetman being a problem really. However I take your point FM about having talent and skills as important in which most players can temporary find themselves as a targetman in an attacking movement. But then a decent targetman has plenty of skills to offer as well. He is not always going to be the targetman all game, he will have to be able to turn and shoot and do some different runs as well. It's just a type of default pattern to initially work from. A tall guy pulling an extra defender to mark on a free kick or getting one of the better defender to do an assignment on him can open up other types of attack for the other players. Sometimes a big guy is very tough to mark and is need to place pressure at the right area. Even for a big guy being a targetman, it still takes skill to be in the right place and time and able hold a ball and release. That is not alway physical work but also takes skill and timing and not many players can make it look easy. There are physical type defenders in the A-League so its natural to have a player that can just simply bump off a few challenges.

It was something that we couldn't pull out much last year with some confidence.

Having said that, I think we have recruited enough to allow creatively in the central midfield that allows better use of the targetman this season compare to last season. A targetman does not always have to be at an end of a long cross form the wide attack. but also the short passes through the centre. His purpose is not necessary to be the end of the attack but the link in the attack rather. Occasionally, a targetman finds himself at the end of an attack so he gets to have a shot at goal, but really he is fairly good optional attack.

A targetman does not a big lad. For an example Peter Beardsley for Liverpool in the 80s did a wonderful job and he was a small runt with vision, passing skills and a bit of dribbling when needed. His main job was as a targetman.

However for many teams, when there was not enough players with such skill factor that a big targetman was found to be able to fill that basic requirement to set balls up for other in a physical way without losing the ball.

A big player usually has long legs compare to most. And long legs can drag the ball a long sideways on the second touch to shoot in such amount of space with a long stride, making it hard for a defender that is right on him to react to defend. Plus a big player does dominate a slightly larger than normal personal space, that it is difficult to get right around the player as a defender without fouling the guy. In a crowded space, it is easier for the passer of the ball to give him the ball because of this.

A centre forward can have that role of course, but a big player does offer that physical dominance, trying to cover a big boy with long stride takes a bit of initial acceleration for smaller guys to cover.

It is a cheaper way to get the same results. Any player that has the skill factor to achieve the same if not more attack options, then they would be realistically out of our price range, tbh.

Frankie Mac2009-07-23 23:32:40

The game has changed in the last 20 years...

You dont even need a targetman anyone can do it.. pin up against the defender and then set back or foward whatever is best its as easy as that

It is at Gigg Lane.

I am not sure that there is that much of a scream, but it was what Ricki wants so thats what he wants. A centre forward is usually a targetman and a big guy is more likely to be seem as a bonus rather than the exception.

However, like I said, it is a cheaper option on the scale of things. If a big guy can do the basic job plus a few extra things, then there is not really much a defensive player can do, if he does a tidy job. A targetman is a pressure front player and sometimes being a big boy has it's advantages and disadvantages.

In Rugby, Jonah Lomu was targeted by the defence but it only open up the other players into the attack. [it's a different game bah bah, but you get my point] A big guy can draw more than just the one player if used well.

Again we just don't have the money to get a classy striker with the skills when a big lad can achieve as least the basic need at this level.

I have no problems either way.

Completely subjective opinion: big centre forwards mean boring football. Get little speedy blokes on.

Like Jonti Richter?

I don't think anyone watching football after the 1970's appreciates physical attributes over skill and talent.

The lack of creative and skillful footballers has been identified by many people as the main factor in England not winning anything in recent, (almost living memory ), years.

The crappy thing is that this issue is still not being addressed.

I think the call for a target man came from the often one dimensional attack that the Phoenix used last year. The wide attack and then wack it into the middle. It was only partially successful so people thought if you had a big guy in their as a better target then you would up your percentages.

Ah, no.

The call for a tragetman came from Ricki saying after he signed Greenacre "I'm looking for a traget man to complement Greenacre".

exactly. It was the coaches preference. He never said anything about size or style of play apart from he wanted someone our players can aim to give the ball to.
Well thats how I see it.
playwithFire2009-07-25 00:37:01

scribbler2009-07-25 14:57:59

Costa Barbarouses

Tony Pignata to fill the target man void