WPM 2023/24 Squad Speculation, Confirmation and Mutual Termination

If Salas is signed that's makes quite a cluster of central midfielders. Especially if Conchie is also promoted into the senior squad. 

Rufer to CB? Maybe he's asked Chiefy to go back there, given he's currently more likely to be a long term AW as a CB. That 2026 WC squad will be a huge lure.

Not particularly excited by our current defensive midfielders so if this guy is real quality then I think it is the perfect signing. Dependent of course on also getting someone reasonable as a local or an ausi at the back, but that should be possible. Smith or the guy playing for Sligo. Surely the a league is a step above his league and he could make the same or more here? Expect he wanted to stay in Europe to make it there but at the age of 24 and in the Irish league, he would have made it by now if it was going to happen

Who is the guy at Sligo?  Cannot remember.

AucklandPhoenix

Not particularly excited by our current defensive midfielders so if this guy is real quality then I think it is the perfect signing. Dependent of course on also getting someone reasonable as a local or an ausi at the back, but that should be possible. Smith or the guy playing for Sligo. Surely the a league is a step above his league and he could make the same or more here? Expect he wanted to stay in Europe to make it there but at the age of 24 and in the Irish league, he would have made it by now if it was going to happen

The fact you don't bother to know Pijnaker's name, makes any following comments a bit rubbish. Nando will be on the radar of a few clubs, especially lower league in the UK. Just named Sligo's Player of the Month for April.

Rumoured that the Nix reached out to him when they sold Waine and wanted a CB replacement, but he wasn't keen. Again a rumour. They signed N Boxall of course.

coochiee

AucklandPhoenix

Not particularly excited by our current defensive midfielders so if this guy is real quality then I think it is the perfect signing. Dependent of course on also getting someone reasonable as a local or an ausi at the back, but that should be possible. Smith or the guy playing for Sligo. Surely the a league is a step above his league and he could make the same or more here? Expect he wanted to stay in Europe to make it there but at the age of 24 and in the Irish league, he would have made it by now if it was going to happen

The fact you don't bother to know Pijnaker's name, makes any following comments a bit rubbish. Nando will be on the radar of a few clubs, especially lower league in the UK. Just named Sligo's Player of the Month for April.

Rumoured that the Nix reached out to him when they sold Waine and wanted a CB replacement, but he wasn't keen. Again a rumour. They signed N Boxall of course.

The Kiwi CB we reached out to that didn’t want to move to Wellington could’ve been any of Pijnaker, Adams, Smith, Stanger, Reid, Themi or Brotherton.

Pijnaker would be an excellent pick up though. Incredible left foot and very solid and dependable for his age. Only question would be his leadership/marshalling skills.

coochiee

AucklandPhoenix

Not particularly excited by our current defensive midfielders so if this guy is real quality then I think it is the perfect signing. Dependent of course on also getting someone reasonable as a local or an ausi at the back, but that should be possible. Smith or the guy playing for Sligo. Surely the a league is a step above his league and he could make the same or more here? Expect he wanted to stay in Europe to make it there but at the age of 24 and in the Irish league, he would have made it by now if it was going to happen

The fact you don't bother to know Pijnaker's name, makes any following comments a bit rubbish. Nando will be on the radar of a few clubs, especially lower league in the UK. Just named Sligo's Player of the Month for April.

Rumoured that the Nix reached out to him when they sold Waine and wanted a CB replacement, but he wasn't keen. Again a rumour. They signed N Boxall of course.

Pijnaker (and Kyle Adams) both had a whole year on their contracts at Sligo and San Diego, so I doubt it was them approached in February, it was likelier an Australian player. That is of course unless the Phoenix wanted to pay a fee, but I doubt that, as Pijnaker would have no reason to turn it down as he'd be playing in a better league, closer to home and probably for more money. I don't think anywhere it was said to be a New Zealand player, just a 'local'.
 
If he does leave Sligo but wants to stay up north, continental Europe is probably more likely than UK given he has a Dutch pass not British. Top tier team in Finland or lower level team in Scandinavia maybe.

respect? I didn’t type his name out of respect because I would have fudgeed up the spelling. 

Lower league clubs? League 2? maybe 1?

If that is his level then we should be on his radar

AucklandPhoenix

respect? I didn’t type his name out of respect because I would have fudgeed up the spelling. 

Lower league clubs? League 2? maybe 1?

If that is his level then we should be on his radar

Remember all that clammer for a recall for Steven Old? No? He was playing regularly in League two. Couldn’t get in the AWs squad, let alone be a starter. Bit embarrassing if we think the best we can get to follow Nelsen, Reid, Hay, Smith and Boyens is someone playing in the Irish league. 

In terms of playing in Europe, especially if he’s got the passport, a good spell at the Nix isn’t going to hurt him. But if his level is similar to or worse than Laws or Payne, it might in that he’d get found out against Leckie/ Cummings and co. 

That seems to be what that argument breaks down to- the A league is a tougher league than these feeder leagues and it’s easier to get embarrassed by Craig Goodwin and have a bunch of folk closer to home write you off. 

Is there still that type of overseas (non European?) player exemption, whereby if you play 75% of your country's games in the last 2 years, you can get a UK work permit?  Dependent on your country's FIFA ranking? Pijnaker would meet the 75% of AWs games criteria.

Pijnaker is ex Ole alumni & an Aucklander. I seriously doubt he wants to leave Europe yet, for a NZ return.

And apparently it was a Kiwi CB turned down the Nix earlier this year.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/a-league/131152412/wellington-phoenix-pushing-to-get-deal-done-before-transfer-window-closes

Wellington Phoenix are still hopeful they can get a new signing over the line before the transfer window closes, after a deal for an undisclosed New Zealand centre-back fell through at the 11th hour.

Prior to the game, Talay revealed the Phoenix were “very close” to signing a new centre-back, only for the player to have second thoughts about moving to Wellington.

Someone not Niko from the local league? Musa? 
Seems unlikely they’ll be in reckoning in the future unless they’re on their way up…which could be Pijnaker. Though there’s been a few of us hoping Musa might return and show us some career pro skills, after he showed potential when he got thrown in very young for us. 

My point is that there is a lot of movement back and forth between the A league and Europe if the player is good enough. That’s a key barrier. Sail was almost there, right?

Bit different for Aussies though. Not happening for them in Europe can head all the way home and sign for an ALM club. That doesn’t work there’s the comfort factor, of still 11 aother ALM clubs they might sign for as a local.

For returning Kiwis it doesn’t work out at the Nix, what then? The agent gets busy trying to find another European/USL club, so a player yo yos between the hemispheres. They are almost better in their mid 20s to stay in Europe or the USL (30 plus teams) where there are many options. Less risk, less job stress. I think Musa is at his 4th or 5th USL club. Kyle Adams maybe at his 3rd. Deklan Wynne is at his 4th USL/MLS team. Collier at least his 4th.

An Auckland team might actually help the Nix in this regard, doesn’t work out for a returning Kiwi in Welly, try Akld and vice versa.

None of Mcgarry, Lewis, Payne or N Boxall left Europe directly for the Nix. They all came back to the NZ domestic leagues first. Same may happen to Francis de Vries

Italiano shoots down speculation on Youstin Salas:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/a-league/300896135/wellington-phoenix-cool-on-roy-krishna-comeback-keen-to-keep-oskar-zawada

Wibblebutt

Italiano shoots down speculation on Youstin Salas:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/a-league/300896135/wellington-phoenix-cool-on-roy-krishna-comeback-keen-to-keep-oskar-zawada

So from that we aren't upgrading our attack at all - which failed to do much at the end of the season. 

Our midfield is set (minus an academy dude). Which i feel its a downgrade on last years....

We may improve our D though so thats a plus for sure. 

Anyway, I must admit im a bit worried about next year at this point. But ill trust the process though and give it time..... 

Elemenop

Wibblebutt

Italiano shoots down speculation on Youstin Salas:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/a-league/300896135/wellington-phoenix-cool-on-roy-krishna-comeback-keen-to-keep-oskar-zawada

So from that we aren't upgrading our attack at all - which failed to do much at the end of the season. 

Our midfield is set (minus an academy dude). Which i feel its a downgrade on last years....

We may improve our D though so thats a plus for sure. 

Anyway, I must admit im a bit worried about next year at this point. But ill trust the process though and give it time..... 

Goals weren't a problem at the start of the season and bar Zawada they did struggle to score later on but nearly the whole team struggled for form. Could have been something behind the scenes, eg players, coach leaving. We often did enough to win but defence let us down again, hopefully that will be fixed this season. Change of formation may also make a difference. 

We might play Kraev more centrally and in a more attacking role. If he's scoring and Zawada is scoring then we'll go well. I think, though, that we are missing that bench option with a bit of pace to come on late in games. Kosta hasn't been that player, Krishna might be but he also has to be slowing down as well.

Despite what Chief says, by my count an import centre back brings us up to 15 players so we've got at least another 5 players to sign to get to squad minimum. I'd expect a left back, a right back, a goalkeeper, and at least one attacking option.

With all this speculation it's very odd that the press would link Salas to us, we're reasonably obscure, so there must have been some sort of discussion.

Chiefytheman

Elemenop

Wibblebutt

Italiano shoots down speculation on Youstin Salas:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/a-league/300896135/wellington-phoenix-cool-on-roy-krishna-comeback-keen-to-keep-oskar-zawada

So from that we aren't upgrading our attack at all - which failed to do much at the end of the season. 

Our midfield is set (minus an academy dude). Which i feel its a downgrade on last years....

We may improve our D though so thats a plus for sure. 

Anyway, I must admit im a bit worried about next year at this point. But ill trust the process though and give it time..... 

Goals weren't a problem at the start of the season and bar Zawada they did struggle to score later on but nearly the whole team struggled for form. Could have been something behind the scenes, eg players, coach leaving. We often did enough to win but defence let us down again, hopefully that will be fixed this season. Change of formation may also make a difference. 

A difference at the start of the season is we had Waine. Waine and Zawada is much better than Zawada and Van Hattum. We need another striker or at least an attacking player with pace.

Missing a closer or two on the bench: preach!

But that was necessary under Uffie’s formation. Maybe talent will be able to be utilised better by having a player more in the Riera type role, with the other midfielders able to push further forward? Wait and see I guess…

Maybe the plan is for Rufer to play a Gündogan role and score all our goals. Kevin De Pennington should notch a few as well.

I agree that solving the puzzle of how to play Kraev better is the key, especially if Zawada stays for at least part of the year (if not the whole season). 
On a related note, I would actually prefer Zawada to leave halfway through the season to a European club than play here whole next season and then move to Macarthur or some such at no fee to us.   

Last night while i was watching the Central Coast Mariners i was comparing our players to theirs....we are miles off it ae. They are a small club and have it all right with locals, imports and some athletic players. They have a style that all players can play...always feel like we have some static guys mixed in with some guys that want to run...we are a mess compared to these top sides.

It comes down to the coach - knowing his style and what players needed for that. And as Central Coast have shown you don't need to blow the budget.

Really hope our new Gaffer can do better than the last. I don't want to be a mix and match side. We need to sort ourselves out. Clear out and start again. And im sorry player s like Rufer Barberouses etc time to play local leagues

i was reflecting after the GF too. I was just thinking about the last four years and how the media and fan narrative was how amazing ufuk was as a coach. We only ever saw glimpses of what many a-league sides have done, without having better budgets. Rudan was praised heavily too and we were all seething so hard when he left us, implicit in that is the suggestion that we lost an amazing coach, why would we care if we thought he was average? I just hope going forward there is a more realistic appraisal of how we are doing and how much credit the coach deserves. is it because the few journos interested in the nix are so matesy with the staff there?

Showtime Nixie

Last night while i was watching the Central Coast Mariners i was comparing our players to theirs....we are miles off it ae. They are a small club and have it all right with locals, imports and some athletic players. They have a style that all players can play...always feel like we have some static guys mixed in with some guys that want to run...we are a mess compared to these top sides.

It comes down to the coach - knowing his style and what players needed for that. And as Central Coast have shown you don't need to blow the budget.

Really hope our new Gaffer can do better than the last. I don't want to be a mix and match side. We need to sort ourselves out. Clear out and start again. And im sorry player s like Rufer Barberouses etc time to play local leagues

I think most of us celebrated when Rudan left. When the first rumors surfaced of course people didn't want him to go, but then he showed his true colors and we were glad to be rid of him. If he'd stayed it would have ended up being a shambles.

But in Ufuks first season we were by far the best team in the comp and had all the momentum with us when covid hit. That team was well balanced and played to its strength and probably should have won it. You need a good team, a good coach, and a bit of luck, and in that first season luck was against us.

Season two and three were fully covid impacted so it's very hard to blame that on anyone. This season is the only disappointing one in Ufuk's tenure and even then we were fighting for second place at one point

Agree with a lot of that but it’s wrong to say in Talay’s first season we were clearly the best team. We sat 3rd pre Covid and though in form Sydney & City were probably still better teams. Took Uffie ages to ever get a win over Sydney from memory

But that first season we had 5 quality visa players all firing leading into Covid, and yes had a real shot at winning the toilet seat. Considering the massive obstacles of the following 2 seasons, the credit Talay got was mostly deserved

Showtime Nixie

Last night while i was watching the Central Coast Mariners i was comparing our players to theirs....we are miles off it ae. They are a small club and have it all right with locals, imports and some athletic players. They have a style that all players can play...always feel like we have some static guys mixed in with some guys that want to run...we are a mess compared to these top sides.

It comes down to the coach - knowing his style and what players needed for that. And as Central Coast have shown you don't need to blow the budget.

Really hope our new Gaffer can do better than the last. I don't want to be a mix and match side. We need to sort ourselves out. Clear out and start again. And im sorry player s like Rufer Barberouses etc time to play local leagues

We had a positive head to head against CC this season and that result was where I expected us to be. 

coochiee

Agree with a lot of that but it’s wrong to say in Talay’s first season we were clearly the best team. We sat 3rd pre Covid and though in form Sydney & City were probably still better teams. Took Uffie ages to ever get a win over Sydney from memory

But that first season we had 5 quality visa players all firing leading into Covid, and yes had a real shot at winning the toilet seat. Considering the massive obstacles of the following 2 seasons, the credit Talay got was mostly deserved

We had a slow start, once we got going we went something like 10 games unbeaten and had collected a massive amount of points.

Nix were unbeaten in 4 games heading into Covid. They were in form, had climbed up to 3rd, and it will always feel like a big opportunity lost, but any narrative they were certain champions is BS. 

I think the time for everyone including nix supporters to blame everything on covid and what ifs, has now finished. 

Many businesses and people knuckled down and got on with it and came out the other side in a better space.

After having a season and a bit holed up living together in ausi, I thought one benefit would be that this club would have developed a great mentality and would be tight. That hasn’t turned out to be the case and we need a serious reset.

Agreed. I also think that the only way you could give Ufuk more credit than would otherwise be due for doing averagely in covid times is if there had been a marked improvement once things were back to normal. But there wasn't. It isn't like it matters now but Ufuk was bang average and no better, and I hope Chiefy has ambitions of far outdoing what he did, though in the press after his appointment he talked as though he couldn't have thought any more highly of Ufuk so probably thinks losing in the first round of the playoffs is an amazing achievement. Would be nice to hear some ambition - we want to win this competition, we believe we can etc 

imanixsupporter

Agreed. I also think that the only way you could give Ufuk more credit than would otherwise be due for doing averagely in covid times is if there had been a marked improvement once things were back to normal. But there wasn't. It isn't like it matters now but Ufuk was bang average and no better, and I hope Chiefy has ambitions of far outdoing what he did, though in the press after his appointment he talked as though he couldn't have thought any more highly of Ufuk so probably thinks losing in the first round of the playoffs is an amazing achievement. Would be nice to hear some ambition - we want to win this competition, we believe we can etc 

Is it not possible to be complimentary of an old colleague of yours while still wanting to do better than they did? If he didn't want to improve it he wouldn't be in the coaching role.

Being nice and respecting the work of others costs you nothing and I think the Phoenix as an organisation would hate having the current head coach bagging the old one as if there was some internal drama going on. 

There is a lot of lessons to be learned from CCM win in the GF last Saturday night.  One of them was that budget size helps, but it is even more important to know what to do with it.  Another one was that - I suspect - the fact that Nick Montgomery is an ex CCM player might have also added the "commitment" factor to their performance.  The next one was seeing two current All Whites perform well on the field and yet not hearing a peep in the RNZ sports bulleting about the ALM GF (but hearing all about the EPL which was galling example of their cargo cult mentality).
Lastly, despite doing rather well all season, Melbourne City had no answer to CCM that night (they did not seem likely to win even before the time the two penalties were awarded against them), whereas I expected a far more even game. Clearly, every opponent seems to have their Achilles's heel, and CCM was able to find the one in their opponents that mattered on the night.  I suspect the reason we could not buy a win the second half of the past season is that other teams worked out early enough what ours was, and we did not have a plan B that was well rehearsed and smoothly implemented. This could be a sign that Talay was good for a young (as in "new") inexperienced manager, but has not improved / developed / at the same rate as other Australian coaches of his generation.
Edit:  agreed that Roux and McGarry are not current AWs.

" not hearing a peep in the RNZ sports bulleting about the ALM GF (but hearing all about the EPL) which was galling example of their cargo cult mentality. "

Does "cargo cult mentality" here mean Eurosnobbery?

Minor correction, McGarry last (and only caps) played for the AWs in 2019, and Roux was last in the AWs squad against Socceroos in 2022, after being a long time absent. Only really in the squad because Kirwan had done his knee. Could change this week, but neither agruably current (and certainly not high profile) AWs.

But yes your point stands. Watch/hear the blanket media coverage of the NRL Final later this year which will yes likely have a few Kiwi internationals involved past & present.

ALM GF certainly huge news back in our OFC neighbours Vanuatu. They had their PM there, watching their boy Kaltak.

coochiee

Minor correction, McGarry last (and only caps) played for the AWs in 2019, and Roux was last in the AWs squad against Socceroos in 2022, after being a long time absent. Only really in the squad because Kirwan had done his knee. Could change this week, but neither agruably current (and certainly not high profile) AWs.

But yes your point stands. Watch/hear the blanket media coverage of the NRL Final later this year which will yes likely have a few Kiwi internationals involved past & present.

ALM GF certainly huge news back in our OFC neighbours Vanuatu. They had their PM there, watching their boy Kaltak.

Yep the NRL GF will have a lot of kiwis in it because the warriors will be there! Our year!

Doloras

" not hearing a peep in the RNZ sports bulleting about the ALM GF (but hearing all about the EPL) which was galling example of their cargo cult mentality. "

Does "cargo cult mentality" here mean Eurosnobbery?

It is not uncommon they open the sport bulletin with whatever EPL game was played overnight.  They certainly do not ignore football as long as it is EPL. They may mention a significant European cup game (or Champions League etc). But  they studiously ignore ALM despite the fact that it is the arena where many of NZers play; although I concede they provided erratic, uneven, reporting of Nix game results through the season (usually only once a day and then none in a subsequent bulletin). 
The ALM GF was an important game and yet they covered EPL results only on Sunday. So either it is Euro-snobbery on part of RNZ, or it is an RNZ view that this is not a competition that should matter to New Zealanders.

If you have a complaint about RNZ, call the RNZ complaint number or the broadcasting standards authority. They claim to present news in a fair and balanced way. If you don’t consider coverage of ALM or ALW is fair or balanced, that’s a legitimate reason. Until they have been told it is of interest they have no obligation to cover it. Once an official complaint is received however, they need to justify any lack of coverage by demonstrating interest doesn’t meet a minimum threshold. 

Normally it's at least mid July before we start talking about RNZ's official complaint policy on the transfer speculation thread. Off-season boredom has come particularly early this year hahaha

I'm always disappointed when my teammates can talk to each other about EPL games or even English Championship games, but when I talk about how I'm influenced in my penalty-stopping style by Andrew Redmayne, I get blank looks

Jazzy Jeff

Normally it's at least mid July before we start talking about RNZ's official complaint policy on the transfer speculation thread. Off-season boredom has come particularly early this year hahaha

Well, my whinge belongs to the old season, as it was the GF of the 2022-2023.   I had an unused whinge quota from last season and did not want to waste it, so got in just before it expired.

Doloras

I'm always disappointed when my teammates can talk to each other about EPL games or even English Championship games, but when I talk about how I'm influenced in my penalty-stopping style by Andrew Redmayne, I get blank looks

Can even drop a reference to Andrew Redmayne for the penalty rule changes.

that's a point of pride for the A-League; incubated a goalkeeping tactic so effective it got banned