NZFC Problems (now with answers - Page10)

276 replies · 19,971 views

over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I guess we need the overseas players to fill the gaps cos the auckland teams knicked all our local players?

but bringing them in of course helps raise the standard of football too.

Um i may be shot for this but should/could TW become a feeder team for the Phoenix?
Putting it out there. I know its not as simple as that and this will effect local players getting a chance at the highest level in NZ football that live in the wellington region etc etc.

Or atleast have access to players? just thinking bout our lack of a youth team, although it may be sorted out by next season so this may well be irrelavant.

Ok wheres my bulletproof retro ricki

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Sorry Special One. Been done a thousand times on here.

Problems with players playing in New Zealand vs Australia AND with them being in an amateur league vs a professional one.

All sorts of rules prevent it unfortunately.

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Gladding sez ooooh yes !st thing monday ....or by end of Mon ....welll its Tuesday and the NZFC site is barren as always...

Perhaps we should all FOCUS on cricket?

Is Incompetance a NZS requirement???

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

It isnt just the leaders are NZF that seem incompetent. Somehow all the clubs wish the competition to be average so they can have a chance. When did competition become a dirty word.

Very sad if you ask me.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Interesting to see the retiring chairman of canterbury United suggesting a salary cap as one solution to the problems of the NZFC.

Difficult I would have thought in a supposedly amateur competition ?

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Absolutely ridiculous that it should be at the point where it is suggested for an amateur competition... it's just embarrassing.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Na they should all have the same salary cap as Waikato might give us a chance

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

chubbs wrote:

Interesting to see the retiring chairman of canterbury United suggesting a salary cap as one solution to the problems of the NZFC.

Difficult I would have thought in a supposedly amateur competition ?

Well . . . a salary cap can be as high as it could as well as low as it could be. . . even in amateur competition believe it or not. But what I think he may have mean is that the the Marquee player can have a cap so that there is even up of the richer Auckland teams to the poorer regional teams who can't finance a good payout on a Marquee. But the rest of his suggestions are very much on the money, you could say. A draft system, etc can help spread the extra talent in Auckland.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

No he doesn't, what he means is a ridiculous amount of money is spent on player payments for what is meant to be an amateur competition... 'marquee' players have nothing to do with it.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I think we should offer the competition to the royal family of Dubai. Tell them that we're a nice little country with lots of water and grass and football competition ownership presents a good foothold into the hearts and minds of the nation. Then we wouldn't have to worry about the money till the oil runs out.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

We should sell the whole country to Dubai then we could play in Asia - problem solved!

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Christo wrote:

I guess we need the overseas players to fill the gaps cos the auckland teams knicked all our local players?

but bringing them in of course helps raise the standard of football too.

Sorry how many players have ACFC or Waitak signed from Otago?
FA i think

Do you know what nemesis means

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Hard News wrote:

No he doesn't, what he means is a ridiculous amount of money is spent on player payments for what is meant to be an amateur competition... 'marquee' players have nothing to do with it.

they would never have a salary cap as that would mean it aint a Amateur comp
and if it isnt an amateur comp then of course the Phoenix would'nt be the only "Pro" team in NZ
i'm sure that would course a few problems for Phoenix?

Do you know what nemesis means

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

happyted wrote:

Hard News wrote:

No he doesn't, what he means is a ridiculous amount of money is spent on player payments for what is meant to be an amateur competition... 'marquee' players have nothing to do with it.

Not really, its not the club branding itself as the country's only pro team. Its Sky TV.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

happyted wrote:

Christo wrote:

I guess we need the overseas players to fill the gaps cos the auckland teams knicked all our local players?

but bringing them in of course helps raise the standard of football too.

Sorry how many players have ACFC or Waitak signed from Otago?
FA i think

Er ..how many from Manawatu, Canterbury, Wellington, Hawkes Bay and Waikato then?

We Still Love You Colin We Do!

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Oh dear.."Trouble at mill" down Park Island way...two players have apparently 'walked out' on the club-one a regular and went to China....

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Oh dear.."Trouble at mill" down Park Island way...two players have apparently 'walked out' on the club-one a regularwho went to China....

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Isn't that great - just when you want a bit of stability and to "push on" into the new season. Still I hear YoungHeart are still looking for players (he says in typical mercenary, to hell with the others fashion).

We Still Love You Colin We Do!

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Jason Hayne, Luis del Monde and Commins Menapi are looking for a club...

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Wasn't Commins looking to go to Canty?

I let my guitar speak for me

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

happyted wrote:

Christo wrote:

I guess we need the overseas players to fill the gaps cos the auckland teams knicked all our local players?

but bringing them in of course helps raise the standard of football too.

Sorry how many players have ACFC or Waitak signed from Otago?
FA i think

oh boy i guess being a bit facetious doesn't translate very well over the net.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Ok Smithy, what the gossip?

I heard you spoke to a few that said it was possible to have the Nix youth team in the NZFC.

Come on, spill it out.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

What I want to know is how will this affect teams who have got their act together and organised sponsorship, season tickets, signed players etc to be ready for a 21 Round season. The decision seems to punish them. I wouldn't like to see Welly and Waikato out of the league but they have let everybody down badly in my opinion.

We Still Love You Colin We Do!

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

They were just the public ones, sounds like Manawatu, Canterbury and Otago weren't in great nick either.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Manawatu were/are just bl**dy disorganised - haven't heard anywhere that they were on the verge of pulling out though. Mind you they haven't had their AGM yet so that may be a little more revealing.

We Still Love You Colin We Do!

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Post subject: Waikato FC press releasse on Edmondson

Edmondson to coach Waikato

Dave Edmondson has agreed to coach a new look Waikato FC for its 5th NZFC season. Edmondsonï¿½s return to Waikato comes after the club and Kevin Fallon agreed to part company as a result of some major budgetary cost cutting.

ï¿½Kevin has been disappointed but understanding as we have worked through this process,ï¿½ said board chairman Keith Ward.

ï¿½Having Dave offer to take the team for no fee was a terrific gesture and having him onboard sends a clear signal that the club intends to be as competitive as possible this season.ï¿½

Edmondson has arguably been the regionï¿½s most successful coach this season; leading Ngaruawahia to third in the Northern region First Division while taking Hamilton Boys High to their first National final in years and Claudelands women to third in the Northern Premier League womenï¿½s competition.

ï¿½Things were looking doubtful for us for a while but Dave and a number of players, supporters and administrators have put their hands up to really help retain the Waikato franchise this season. You canï¿½t say enough about the character and support of the Waikato football community,ï¿½ said Development Manager James Raffan

ï¿½Dave knows the region and this club and we are confident that he will begin to deliver the success that Waikato aspires too.ï¿½

The appointment of Edmondson is expected to be the first in a number of changes that will be announced during the next fortnight.

Has Waikato pulled off the biggest Football shake up in the History of NZ Football in dictating what structure the National League will take.

There is a rumour that this was all pre plannned and that the board and general manager new well in advance that they were going to be short of cash for the up coming season.

So they put together a cunning plan that would allow them to save Waikato footbal and start afresh with a waikato based coach, players and training facilities, and home ground.

The press release gives us food for thought , dont you think!!!!!

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

AllWhitebelievr wrote:

Ok Smithy, what the gossip?

I heard you spoke to a few that said it was possible to have the Nix youth team in the NZFC.

Come on, spill it out.

Has been bandied about for a while. Complicated though.

Essentially the idea is that you let a group of players registered to the Phoenix to play in the NZFC.

Sounds simple, right.

I think the professional/amateur issue is probably manageable - a change to the NZFC rules that specifically allowed it would do the job.

What I'm not so sure would fly is that all those players would have to hold professional player registrations to be available for the Phoenix. One person I spoke to seemed to think that the stand down could be removed and that the FFA have done that so that VPL and NSWPL players can come in and out of A League teams without standing down. If so then that hurdle can be overcome.

Leaving just the fact that those registrations would be with the FFA. So somehow there'd have to be a way to allow an AUSTRALIAN team (Phoenix B) to play in a Kiwi league (NZFC).

That, I'm fairly sure, is the major difficulty.

Discuss...

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Problem with the NZFC is there is no leadership from the league manager Glyn Taylor and that there is no draw for anyone (let alone the players, clubs, officials and media) to even get excited about.

You have to wonder what other competitions our 'NZF Competitions Manager' is involved in right now (and yes I'm serious)

I think there is more collective activity in this forum over the NZFC than there is over at NZF at the moment. Yeah there is a World Cup on, but they have their own committee for that one so don't get why its not status quo... oh hang on.
Agent 472008-10-30 23:06:35

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Smithy wrote:

Has been bandied about for a while. Complicated though.

Essentially the idea is that you let a group of players registered to the Phoenix to play in the NZFC.

Sounds simple, right.

I think the professional/amateur issue is probably manageable - a change to the NZFC rules that specifically allowed it would do the job.

What I'm not so sure would fly is that all those players would have to hold professional player registrations to be available for the Phoenix. One person I spoke to seemed to think that the stand down could be removed and that the FFA have done that so that VPL and NSWPL players can come in and out of A League teams without standing down. If so then that hurdle can be overcome.

Leaving just the fact that those registrations would be with the FFA. So somehow there'd have to be a way to allow an AUSTRALIAN team (Phoenix B) to play in a Kiwi league (NZFC).

That, I'm fairly sure, is the major difficulty.

Discuss...

The easiest way around it is as thus.
The FFA need to grant their youth or 'B' side permission to play in an alternate competition not hosted in Australia say like the A-league teams playing in the AFC championship. The team is an Australian team with Australian registered players, its just that they can play in an alternate competition much like Waitakere and Auckland City play in the O-League. They are NZ teams that play in an alternate competition not hosted in NZ

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Here is my take on the NZFC goings on...

http://www.yellowfever.co.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7512&PN=1

Normo's coming home

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Agent 47 wrote:

Smithy wrote:

Has been bandied about for a while.ï¿½ Complicated though.Essentially the idea is that you let a group of players registered to the Phoenix to play in the NZFC.Sounds simple, right.I think the professional/amateur issue is probably manageable - a change to the NZFC rules that specifically allowed it would do the job.What I'm not so sure would fly is that all those players would have to hold professional player registrations to be available for the Phoenix.ï¿½ One person I spoke to seemed to think that the stand down could be removed and that the FFA have done that so that VPL and NSWPL players can come in and out of A League teams without standing down.ï¿½ If so then that hurdle can be overcome.Leaving just the fact that those registrations would be with the FFA.ï¿½ So somehow there'd have to be a way to allow an AUSTRALIAN team (Phoenix B) to play in a Kiwi league (NZFC).That, I'm fairly sure, is the major difficulty.Discuss...

The easiest way around it is as thus.The FFA need to grant their youth or 'B' side permission to play in an alternate competition not hosted in Australia say like the A-league teams playing in the AFC championship. The team is an Australian team with Australian registered players, its just that they can play in an alternate competition much like Waitakere and Auckland City play in the O-League. They are NZ teams that play in an alternate competition not hosted in NZ

Actually you have my views on this in this thread.http://www.yellowfever.co.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7271

My views are that technically, Wellington Phoenix are still a New Zealand club which is different to the NZ Knight which is an Australian Club based in Auckland because of the A-league Licence being handed to NZF after 2005-6 season. So having a reserve/youth team in the NZFC is never a problem for the club as they belong to the NZF association as the sub-licence is given to WP from the NZF.

BTW Auckland City and Waitakere United play half their O-league games in NZ as to the Wellington Phoenix play half their games in Wellington, NZ, Oceania so it cannot be billed as an" alternative" competition. They are would be classified as an international competition restricted to Oceania confederation. The A-league clubs playing in the ACL competition is in an international competition restricted to Asia confederation.

Also the A-league competition is an international competition for the Phoenix as half of their game is in NZ and the other half is in Australia, whereas for the Australian A-league clubs, it is Australian competition as most of their games are played in Australia.

A totally different picture is painted for the Phoenix as an invited international NZ club forwarded by the NZF to the FFA's bidding to enter the Australian A-league competition.AllWhitebelievr2008-10-31 02:48:09

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Napier Phoenix wrote:

I'd think the solution lies somewhere within the US system. Some points to remember with the Us systems though:

The teams are mainly privately owned.

The teams actually own the leagues they compete in.

They operate to salary caps and the law allows them to do that.

In the NFL case (at least they used to) the salary cap was linked to the amount of TV revenue they received - the equally shared income was the salary cap).

They operate a draft for new players.

Almost without exception they play in large stadiums that are sold out every week.

All of these little matters help make their leagues a success but there are many lower tier semipro/pro leagues that might be a better comparison for us.

Your sorta right, many of the stadia are privately owned but rented to teams eg Pepsi Centre in Denver, reneted to the Nuggets and Avalanche and as for selling out, when I saw the Galaxy open the season at Colorado Rapid's home ground they had their biggest ever crowd... it was... wait for it....18,000 and was still relatively empty, and there must have been two chicks to every dude and it was only three quarters fill.

A very nice stadium though, just right for the Phoenix etc capacity about 22 thou

Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Bruce Holloway wrote:

Wayne Bates was Melville captain for the winter season. Melville coach Steve williams also named him as melville's player of the year.

He has never played at national League level. He is not a technical player, and there are question marks about his pace, but he is a fine leader, with a big heart. And reputedly New Zealand's top caravan salesman.

iMy spies tell me, co-incidentally, he is also thowing some money in the waikato pot. Are we entering the era of the player-sponsor?

if wayne does play, he will bring a whole new tribal roll-your-sleeves-up feel to the place. He is a great club man, and may just pull in some others. Be good if he pulled in melville team mate matt williams. (derek, if Che Bunce is our Rolling Stone, could Bates be our Beatle?)

I imagine an announcement on what is happening on the coaching front will be made soon, but the words "deja vu" spring to mind.

if Waikato are loooking for a new nickname, perhaps: "The Volunteers". There have been suggestions a couple of Aucklanders may still travel. We'll see.

Waikato will definitely be weaker without the Aucklanders. But in some other respects, they may end up being a bit stronger for the experience.

I played with Wayne is school, he's from Ngarra's so would have huge interest in the developments there, pretty agricultural but a big hearted, local lad

Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Daikiwi wrote:

You still don't get it do you. The bloody thing fails because those who want to be in it, can't afford it period. No amount of wishing for dollars is going to change that. And you can compare it to rugby because they to struggle to maintain a geographical league at any level, because the costs of doing so in a nation of 4 million are prohibitive of doing so. The league in the seventies worked brilliantly, before they started expanding it, and diluting the talent, and turning it from a workable semipro league to a glorified park team league.

I only said play six teams is because that is all you would have had for this season if those two floundering clubs had dropped out. Eight is the magical number, but eight teams that can afford to be in there, not in there by charity and dragging the league and other teams down with it.

Dai Kiwi are you a JAffa by chance, to say that Welli, Waikato and Chch, very strong domestic player bases should be allowed to do die just shoes you're auckland-centric feeling that only burns bridges. The NZRFU is struggling becuse of their conviction to rope in places such as The Horophenua etc, not big provences like Waikato or Auckland.

I do agree with you though that there should be a team from Gisbourne. I feel that They have been hard done by out there.

Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Gisborne were unable to compete in the Central League even when they were bankrolled by a business man (who has since departed the club leaving them in a bit of a hole) and playing with a team of aucklanders. Not sure if they have ever even put in a bid out there?

Normo's coming home

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

Gisborne were unable to compete in the Central League even when they were bankrolled by a business man (who has since departed the club leaving them in a bit of a hole) and playing with a team of aucklanders.ï¿½ Not sure if they have ever even put in a bid out there?

Yes they did have a weak bid to enter NZFC with Fallon announced as coach but of course YHManawatu was back. However as you mention their situation has changed for the worse financially wise in recent times.

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

"The returning Andy Barron cracked in a direct free kick from the edge of the box after just three minutes, as Waitakere keeper Richard Gillespie left a gaping, and inviting hole, to his right hand side that Barron gratefully filled."

- http://www.nzfc.co.nz/index.php?id=536

*tee hee..!*

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