But rivalry with a team from another competition you never play?
Waitak vs City rivalry, yes but City vs Phoenix?
The reasons for the Spanish thing is clearly detailed above Reg. It's aimed at a small group that delight in claiming that the Phoenix are failing NZ football by not fielding 16 kiwi's every week yet see nothing wrong with City starting a side with a similar number of NZ players (let alone Aucklanders).
Auckland always dominated the old league in team numbers which diluted the player quality
Now with only 2 teams the player quality is greater.
I know 1 team, the other is Spanish!
Ok have a pop at Auckland City for being spanish...however why dont you call Waitakere Pommy United? Auckland City on the weekend had 3 Spanish players on the field. I know of atleast 3 Englishman on the pitch for Waitak and there couldve been more. So you want to declare we have no Kiwi auckland team?
Kiwis: Robinson (If you are counting Danko or Corrales then Danny has just as much right since he has been here a while) Rowley, Myers, Pearce, McKenzie, Butler, De Vries, Adams
Fijian: Krishna
English: Bullock
Welsh: Bale
Bench: Feni
You started with 4 imports and had Tade on the bench (depending on how you view Corrales).
http://www.asbpremiership.co.nz/index.php?id=1579
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
But rivalry with a team from another competition you never play?Waitak vs City rivalry, yes but City vs Phoenix?
No, but I think the FFA would call that a RRRRRRRRRRRRRRivalry.Fuck this stupid game
Permalink
Permalink
But rivalry with a team from another competition you never play?Waitak vs City rivalry, yes but City vs Phoenix?The reasons for the Spanish thing is clearly detailed above Reg.� It's aimed at a small group that delight in claiming that the Phoenix are failing NZ football by not fielding 16 kiwi's every week yet see nothing wrong with City starting a side with a similar number of NZ players (let alone Aucklanders).
didn't know there were such strict rules in place about rivalries...
vancouver vs toronto anyone?
phoenix are there doing it, waitak may well wish that they were, seems valid enough to me
definitely negative however; not my cuppareg222011-11-15 22:34:39
Permalink
Permalink
Thought this was a Waikato thread. Typical Jaffas, always making it about their teams. Imnteresting to read on stuff that decalns priority is to get Matt Williams on the park and to sign Aaron Scott in the december transfer window. I heard out of Hamilton Matt is interested in playing. Will be interested to see what happens.
Permalink
Permalink
I believe Aaron is injured at the moment and that is why he is not playing. Add in that he just became a Dad and I guess that may be more of a priority than football - it was for me many years ago.
I would like to know why Williams is not playing. He is a good footballer and his experience and graft would be ideal. May not be the most outstandingly skilled footballer on the pitch but he will give his all and make that team better.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
He was ruled out of the first match with injury - still has it I assume
Permalink
Permalink
Aaron scott is one of nz footballs most overrated players
Permalink
Permalink
When and where is the next Waikato game?
Wouldn't mind heading along for a watch. Never been to an ASB Prem game but have always been meaning to.
Wouldn't mind heading along for a watch. Never been to an ASB Prem game but have always been meaning to.
Permalink
Permalink
Waitakere next weekend, at Porritt
Not good...
Permalink
Permalink
Objectively, the team has conceded 13 goals and sloted 1 penalty (and looking at the replay, they were lucky to get it) which really is pretty bleak reading.
Are they going to keep conceding like this or improve at some point?
Are they going to keep conceding like this or improve at some point?
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
They improved last week from the week before by only being hit for 3.
So will we see a continuation of this upswing in form and lose 1 nil to Waitakere.
So will we see a continuation of this upswing in form and lose 1 nil to Waitakere.
Permalink
Permalink
Optimistic! I predict another trashing, but i shall reserve my judgement to the next game, because anyone could coach this side and not get a result v Waitak
Permalink
Permalink
So Edge is now referring to Ang Postecoglou and Brisbane Roar as a reason to back him and his youth team...
Well Postecoglou took over mid season, inheriting a team from someone else, not hand picking his players who he had been training twice a day for the last 2 years for starters..
And his results were:
Loss (1 day after taking over)
Loss
Draw
WIN
Loss
WIN
Draw
Loss
WIN
WIN
Loss
Loss
Loss
Draw
Win
Loss
Loss
Hardly disasterous and certainly not 3 Losses by a total of 13-1.. and as I said with a side inherited from the previous coach not a handpicked academy of players training twice a day under his guidance..
Once again a RAGING EGO even considering himself and his side as a Brisbane Roar... PLEASE WFC SORT THIS OUT!!!!!!
PS has Matt WIlliams had a nose job, as that is what it sounds like in the media reports? :)
Permalink
Permalink
I also laugh when people hold up Ange as some messiah of youth policy when his whole front line is imported apart from Nichols who was developed well before his time.
Permalink
Permalink
Hello. What Edge was saying was he saw similarities in the process of change.
It has nothing to do with ego, as far as i can see. He has set out principles of play he believes in, and like any coach, has selected the players he feels best fits - bearing in mind the restrictions he works within of having 80 per cent Waikato players , a nil budget, and for that matter less than satisfactory training arrangements and running a ship with next to no assets.
After seven years of existence, Waikato Fc has, basically, nothing. The coach ain't the fundamental problem, but possibly might be part of the solution, long term.
One of the fundamental problems in the Waikato is the people who talk the loudest about what is right and wrong have been very reticent in stepping forward to grapple with the challenges of elite football and as a result our development at ASB level has been remedial.
Ultimately coaches are always judged by their results. Those who judge Edge will be those who are putting hard work or money into Waikato. I would suggest there are only a handful of such people - and they will probably assess the scenario far more soberly.
But if you are that outraged, I suggest you pluck up the courage to stand for the Waikato board, do a bit of work yourself and then have a voice in the future. For someone who obviously feels so offended by Edge's execution of his duties, it's probably not a bad idea, is it?
Matt Williams had a nose operation to correct a problem and its nature is such that if it is damaged it will need to be re-operated on.
hope this helps.
Permalink
Permalink
I have no problem with what Declan is trying to do. What I have a problem with is the personnel he picks. I believe twice this year he has picked his son Harry to travel away and left players like Mark Jones and the Frishneckt boy behind. Harry has made every match squad, he should be playing in the youth league insteading of letting his dad embarrass him. Unfortunately Harry is no more footballer than I am (lawn bowls). I have seen Mark and Daniel play a couple of times in Auckland during the winter and can't under stand Declans logic. I believe there are the players around the Waikato but wonder if they got approached or had an option to trial. Melville must have some senior players available considering they had a quite good year this winter.
Permalink
Permalink
If by Frishneckt you mean Fish, then I have to agree. I am baffled that this kid has not had a run because he looks to have a bit about him.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Frishy is a scrappy poacher-type, probably not Waikato FC level, but definately deserves a go ahead of Harry Edge. A good bench player to have, someone who'll pop up and score. Lacks a bit of technique but makes up for it in height and poaching
Permalink
Permalink
Hello. What Edge was saying was he saw similarities in the process of change.
It has nothing to do with ego, as far as i can see. He has set out principles of play he believes in, and like any coach, has selected the players he feels best fits - bearing in mind the restrictions he works within of having 80 per cent Waikato players , a nil budget, and for that matter less than satisfactory training arrangements and running a ship with next to no assets.
After seven years of existence, Waikato Fc has, basically, nothing. The coach ain't the fundamental problem, but possibly might be part of the solution, long term.
One of the fundamental problems in the Waikato is the people who talk the loudest about what is right and wrong have been very reticent in stepping forward to grapple with the challenges of elite football and as a result our development at ASB level has been remedial.
Ultimately coaches are always judged by their results. Those who judge Edge will be those who are putting hard work or money into Waikato. I would suggest there are only a handful of such people - and they will probably assess the scenario far more soberly.
But if you are that outraged, I suggest you pluck up the courage to stand for the Waikato board, do a bit of work yourself and then have a voice in the future. For someone who obviously feels so offended by Edge's execution of his duties, it's probably not a bad idea, is it?
Matt Williams had a nose operation to correct a problem and its nature is such that if it is damaged it will need to be re-operated on.
hope this helps.
The way how you described current Waikato FC situation, it sounds like "mission impossible".
The thing is, young players should really be developed by playing in Northern league, not ASB for two reasons: Firstly, if they train twice a day, 6 times a week, they will get frustrated with not getting anything in return i.e. loosing every game, and secondly, it makes the ASB league to look like "mickey mouse " league.
Permalink
Permalink
Hi Bruce Some points you make
"has selected the players he feels best fits "- Best fits his own interests.
"The coach ain't the fundamental problem, but possibly might be part of the solution, long term."-He is unable to work with anyone outside his system or make concessions, has the arrogance of a list MP and the hide of a rhino
"Ultimately coaches are always judged by their results." I may be the exception but can accept the losses if effort and honest selection are apparent.
"I suggest you pluck up the courage to stand for the Waikato board" Who are the current board members?
After watching a few games of both the youth and prem side, my selection of academy players would be (on form)
1 Konnings
2 Ewert
3 Green
4 Awad
5 Drake
6 Thomas
7 Boyd
8 Edge J
Interested in other's selections, particularly yours Bruce
Permalink
Permalink
And you forgot that he thinks he is Bono
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Down 4-0, with 2 own goals, and who scores....... Harry Edge. Good goal too. So whatever you say about him, he is the only Waikato player to score from open play this season :)
Permalink
Permalink
Down 4-0, with 2 own goals, and who scores....... Harry Edge. Good goal too. So whatever you say about him, he is the only Waikato player to score from open play this season :)
Well, that achievement goes straight in the history of NZ Football:
"In 2011/2012 season young Harry Edge, scored the first goal for Waikato FC from open play. Currently Waikato FC played 4 games and lost all 4 with the goal difference 2 for and 17 against. That's all right as this long term project so Waikato develops their own players. The success is expected in season 2018/2019."
N-Bomb, you seems to be a nice guy, and nothing wrong with supporting your team, but it doesn't look good....
Permalink
Permalink
Ventured to the Tron yesterday for a lookie at the footie. Waitakere in total control and it would have been more if they didn't take the foot of the pedal at halftime due to O league this week. Is going to be a long year for Waikato FC, be interesting to see how they go against HB, Manawatu and Otago. They could posssibly compete.
Permalink
Permalink
Looking at Manawatu yesterday, its not unreasonably to think they might score another goal. Especially if they go up the right hand flank.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Waikato vs Manawatu could possibly the worst game with the worst players on display the national league has ever seen. It scares me to say this but i think Waikato maybe even pip them!
Permalink
Permalink
Down 4-0, with 2 own goals, and who scores....... Harry Edge. Good goal too. So whatever you say about him, he is the only Waikato player to score from open play this season :)
Well, that achievement goes straight in the history of NZ Football:
"In 2011/2012 season young Harry Edge, scored the first goal for Waikato FC from open play. Currently Waikato FC played 4 games and lost all 4 with the goal difference 2 for and 17 against. That's all right as this long term project so Waikato develops their own players. The success is expected in season 2018/2019."
N-Bomb, you seems to be a nice guy, and nothing wrong with supporting your team, but it doesn't look good....
Permalink
Permalink
Waikato is a joke this season. How the f**k is Ryan Thomas in the squad. Hes about 3 apples tall and Decklans got him playing Centre Mid? Waikato f**k around with the ball in stupid areas and get punished for it. His backline play way to high to start with. Decklan can dismiss talks about teams who play the long ball are rubbish all he wants but the fact is is that its highly effective againest his backline. You could practically walk faster than Jesse edge and Raymond could run. Mikey is the only defender with some pace but even he is dodgey at times and gives away stupid freekicks in dangerous areas. *******[watch your language please poster: YF]*********. Harry edge is good.. for a youth league player. He cant play NZFC look how skinny he is. A gust of wind could blow him over. Thats one of the worst things about Decklans academy is that hes teaching his players to dive. Tyler Boyd and Adam Thomas are great at showing this grabbing their ankels straight away every time they go down. With all the step overs Boyd is doing this season someones bound to get annoyed and break his leg before the end of the season. Adam thomas as captain? hes like 19/20. If he wasnt fast he would be a very average player. Jason deserves to be captain more than him. Atleast hes making chances for himself and getting decent shots on goals. Weir Rose Bell kids have better finishing than Adam.
Im pretty sure the only pre-requisites for waikato this season was that you were able to play a 1-2.. because thats all his squad is good at.
Nuff said already. I could bag the whole waikato squad all day.
Feverish2011-11-30 21:59:08
Permalink
Permalink
It's posts such as the above which do much to destory the credibility of fan forums such as this.
I am all for disucssion/debate with fellow Waikato fans, and football is a subjective business where we all have our own ideas.
But if you are to argue a proposition, it must at least be based around fact or empirical data.
I hereby nominate intheknow for the award for the most mis-labelled pseudonym ever used here. Her post does not deserve a response.
Permalink
Permalink
Bruce Your last match report on the ASB website was almost embarassing and more akin to a forum debate posting. You've repeatedly defended mr Edge in respect of his approach to youth but have avoided questions directed to you, we are yet to hear whether you support the individual selections he has made at the age group level. Mr Edge has, over the years, turned away from the sport, far more, both talented and for the fun and love of sport players and their families, with his foul mouthed abuse of officials and youngsters (around the age of 12 and younger, in days gone bye) than those who have benefitted from his undoubted commitment and passion. The board of the FC must surely have known what the outcome of his selection would ulimately be, discontent and a lack of unity by the local football supporters and probably worse, dishonesty in selection by the coach. In a week where we hear the local council will not support the areas hosting of the upcoming WC games, a handful of supporters at games, how does the board expect to retain the best local players and critically, attract sponsorship. If this was a school a commissioner would have been appointed to sort the mess out. One thing I agree with Mr Coker on, is that it's vital to retain a team in the ASB.I assume you are a member of the FC board Bruce, appologies if not 3bob2011-11-29 21:56:07
Permalink
Permalink
What part of my post is not fact? Decklan picked his favourites for Waikato this season and hes paying the price. They are technically gifted dont get me wrong.. Absolutly class touch, Can kill the ball dead and drill a long ball with either foot etc.. But thats only going to get them so far. His younger players are too small, weak and slow to keep up with the senior players. They are the weak links and the other teams know this and exploit this weakness. Go on youtube and watch the footage from the games.. Auckland City and Wellington have a field day againest them.
Permalink
Permalink
I aint gonna read all this, but can I ask that posters don't get personal about players/coaches, and dont make sweeping statements about how sh*t someone/somthing is without trying to make it as part of a sensible argument.
THe more you rant and rave - the less credibility your posts get
Founder
Permalink
Permalink
3bob, if you have an issue with my professional work, you should take it up with the authorities concerned. My brief is to provide an overview of games, adding comment, as well as reporting the post-match views from both camps.
I don't have any major issues with Waikato's age group selections, and don't see that putting my own individual preferences forward for the dissection of a bunch of anonymous haters was going to advance discussion about the key issues the Waikato franchise faces.
I'm not convinced there is any more disunity or lack of support in the game now than there was 12 months ago. Sunday's crowd actually appeared bigger than at the same time last year. the chairs of Waikato's three top clubs all support Waikato, however there is still much that can be done to grow the game. For instance, i wish more members of my club would actively support Waikato.
I would similarly support U20 WC matches in Hamilton. I don't see a direct link with Waikato's core issues, but would be interested to hear what you think should be done on this front.
I can't recall a Waikato team fielding a higher component of local Waikato players. But bottom line is you can only start 11 and play 3 subs, and selection is the perogative of the coach. a farmer doesn't bark at his sheep.
Waikato's core problem is not its players, or player selection, but a dearth of finance, assets, and core personnel. In my view there has been no development of the franchise or continuity across a 7 year span. Indeed, Waikato has concentrated on just staying afloat. having said that, i absolutely respect the often single-handed efforts of Brendon Coker in keeping Waikato alive.
If you want things to change, I suggest you roll up your sleeves, have the courage of your convisions, and get involved.
Permalink
Permalink
Actually, I'm not sure intheknow has ever played football before. I was in Hamilton on Sunday and the team didn't perform anywhere near as badly as you portray it. What I would like to know is what the short and long term goals are for WaikatoFC. If the short term goal is to keep a team in the NZFC and get themselves financial with the log term plan being to win the league in 3-5 years time then they are ultimately going about it the right way. From an Aucklanders perspective, WFC have a lot of younger players, but my question is, who do people think is capable of playing for Waikato who are of a more mature nature?
Bruce, from what I have heard you are the only one from your club flying the Melville flag.... Sounds to me some long serving members consider themselves bigger than Melville. Shame really.
Permalink
Permalink
Hi SBW,
Bruce Holloway2011-11-30 12:48:58
Waikato will be stronger when Matt Williams is back on deck, and David Samson is back from injury. Mike thompson was stood down because he arrived late to Saturday's match, but I understand his availability was always going to be short-term. Jason Chewins is unavailable and Ceri James off home. Eugene Heerschap may have been useful, but is overseas (and was one of Declan's lads anyway, so no doubt that also would have offended some of the haters here). I will leave it to others to comment on who from other clubs might have been in the mix.
But I understand a former Waikato FC player may be about to shortly re-sign.
Meanwhile it would be unfair to say i was the only one from Melville flying the flag. A majority of our 2011 (pre-AGM) management committee supported moves to accommodate Waikato FC training at Gower Park, while there was agreement to also host the Waikato youth team home matches, and a senior match in March.
However it is also be true to say there has been robust internal debate about what relationship my club should have with Waikato and my own views are by no means representative of all the club's key figures.
I can respect the dissenting views insofar as they are largely fueled by a desire to concentrate the club's energies on building a top class football facility at Gower park, in the wake of completing our major floodlighting project this year, using the old Eden Park lights. So it is not all bad, and it is good in football to have a debate around visions.
I would further defend those people within Melville who have little interest in backing Waikato FC by saying they are at least putting huge time and energy into the game at their chosen level.
Further terrace seating development is taking place as we speak, while clubrooms renovations are also about to occur. If everyone here had the same can-do attitude and gumption, the game would flourish regardless.
Permalink
Permalink
Hi Bruce
Your passion is quite obvious and good on you for putting your name to your opinion and standing by it. I have a point about the Waikato set up which for me I cannot get my head around. If the stated goal (or unstated) is not about today but about tomorrow then at least the colours are up and pinned to the mast.
That said, and its generally accepted that most of these footballers are from Declans academy, if Declans academy is designed to get these kids into pro football, and if they are successful in achieving that goal, how is that a payback for Waikato FC when in the future they will be at a 'better' or pro club? These kids wont be here to payback that investment to Waikato FC or make them a better club. Now this is a best case scenario I admit because these kids have to believe they are going to get into a pro club or otherwise why parttake into Declans academy if you do not believe.
This is the one thing I cannot see. The alternative is that these kids will not be good enough to get a pro contract and wil end up staying in the province. Are they then likely to be much better footballers? For the experience, yes, but to be competitive? The ones that have talent will probably get lured away to the big 2
Jeff Vader2011-11-30 14:23:51Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Hi Bruce I've continued to follow this thread and have to agree with 3bob. Declan, at the time of his appointment stated he had always been a Waikato FC man. Why then, for the past two seasons has he discouraged (at best) his academy players from being involved. The question of, "does he receive renumeration by players for his academy training", also comes into question. Anonymity is a given on forums, if putting a name on postings was mandatory or meant the content was of more worth then we may as well direct our opinions to the local papers (I doubt WaiFC would be keen on that). You continue to slate posters who may have a differing opinion to his support as being "haters". The forum isn't a cheerleaders club. I have great difficulty supporting a representative team that is selected on any other grounds other than merit.While good results are important it is more important to, as my old Dad used to say " Not only should you do the right things, you need to be seen to do the right things", You are obviously a mountain man at melville, the club is no doubt grateful for the contribution you've made there and all credit to you for that effort however your support of Declan is misguided. These are of course only my humbug opinions.
Permalink
Permalink