Manchester United

Have they found Pogba yet?

Yep. As much as I am not a fan of the likes of Zlatan, they are winners.

Ref signals 3 minutes of added time. At least one substitution in stoppage time. Ref ends the game exactly 3:00 when United wins a corner because logic.

Terrible display from us though. Made much easier when you give just foul anyone.

Mourinho has to address the balance of this squad. Need a bit of guile to go with the brutes. And a proper, singular holding midfielder to give freedom to other midfielders. And I'm afraid Rooney is upsetting the balance. Need to play more of a 4-1-4-1 without Rooney. He should back up for Zlatan and that's it.

Y u screw up my multi?

I've wanted them to lose as long as I've been a fan - just this once, they couldn't help me out? Haha...in saying that, if losing the bet was the price of United losing, money well spent. 

Special One, Watford Three.

Turns out selling all our youth, spending a bunch of money, rebranding to become Real Madrid, playing Fellaini in midfiield, signing a manager who drove a champions winning squad into the ground, etc etc, isn't actually going to go that well for us.

Oh, and Michael Oliver was complete and total wank and that was a blatant foul in the leadup to their first goal.

And finally, Zlatan is a good player and obviously a goal scorer. But Rashford is wasted on the wing. Either play Zlatan deeper and drop Rooney, or drop Zlatan. Rashford needs to play upfront. My biggest fear is that we waste this kid because of some big name pensioner.

Watched the whole game while keeping a eye on my multi.

Ibra got zero service, Rooney was awful (what was his pass success rate?) and Martial has dropped off hugely - kid seems to have some issues.

Two shining lights for me were Rashford and Shaw - Shaw has done so well to come back from that injury.

I think playing Rashford and Zlatan as a partnership would work, with Pogba. Mata, and Herrera (or Carrick for him) in behind them with Young switching wings.

It says a lot for United's buying over the last half dozen years that Ashley Young appears to be our number 1 winger.....

If Rooney drops any further back, he will have to take the gloves of De Gea!

From watching the replay's I'd agree with you on that; the only challenge is that between Oliver's angle on the foul & the direction the ball went it could look legal. I think it's moments like that the crowd definitely helps the situation by getting excited rather than booing.

I thought a tactical mastermind like Mourinho would be able to set up a midfield to prevent the same thing happening twice in a match. Especially against a panifully average Watford side.

Carrick or Herera would've shut that space down

Or Schweinsteiger

You've just got no mobility with Rooney, Zlatan, and Fellaini on the pitch at once. It makes it too hard to press, too slow to counter attack, and too sluggish in movement off the ball for an incisive passing game. Drop Rooney and Fellaini and you could have a reasonably dynamic lineup with Zlatan as a target man.

Gee, this is horrid defensive positioning. Strange for a Mourinho team.

Is Rooney's time finally up? Is there a position on the field for him? Serious question, not a piss take.

I think Rooney on the pitch in general may be somewhat of a problem

The passing from United was pretty poor in general. They'd be on a break and when they passed to the wing the ball was to the player or slightly behind him rather than in front and Rooney was guilty of this on many occasions. Pogba continues to underwhelm but I'm reluctant to judge yet as he's only 4 or 5 games into his life at United. 

Rooney's lack of speed and effectiveness is also making him careless with a lot of frustrated tackles and mouthing off at the ref - slippery slope. 

If only Man Utd had Marchisio, Khedira, Vidal, and/or Pirlo c2014 to play around him...

Should be Schweini with Herrera/Schneiderlin and Pogba. Then Mkhitaryan, Rashford/Zlatan and Mata/Martial

In relation to the general tactical chit-chat; Zlatan is too slow. But I think he'd be pretty decent behind Rashford, and he's happy to run, shoot, take players on, and generally do everything Rooney can do but better. Rooney is too slow and massively lacks confidence. It is bizarre, he always takes an extra touch before doing anything.

Fellaini can run around and play enforcer all he likes but that means absolutely nothing when compared to players like Carrick and Blind. Their sheer positional awareness completely trumps what Fellaini can offer bullying players. Gary Neville says it better than I. Going forward Fellaini is again slow, always takes an extra touch and simply not good enough.

We will never break teams down because Fellaini and Rooney are not fast enough on the counter - both in decision making, ball playing ability and raw pace. At the same time we cannot break teams down methodically because players like Zlatan, Rooney and Fellaini lack energy and the latter two can't move the ball fast enough.

Meanwhile we're screwing around with Pogba making him play as virtually a centre back. That's like asking Yaya Toure to defend. Waste of time for all involved.

Some tough decisions to be made, personally I do not think you can have Pogba and Rooney playing in the same midfield. Definitely not when CM number 3 is Fellaini.

For fudge sakes just drop Fellaini and Rooney you silly pie.

/stillbitter

edit: and while you're at it why don't you teach some of our players the mental side of the game so they don't get outwitted by Watford.

Jose continued to play under preforming players when he was at Chelsea, I don't see him suddely changing. 

I forgot about Mkhitaryan - even though injuries haven't helped, he's in danger of becoming a square peg in a round hole

So Rooney seems to be able to play in 3 positions - striker, a no.10, or a deeper lying midfielder.

When I look at the ManU squad, I don't see him as the best option in any of those 3 positions, not even the 2nd best option to be fair. At striker I'd have Ibra or Rashford any day. At no.10 I think you'd be better with Mata, Mikhataryan or even Pogba in that role. And as a midfielder, I mean, take your pick, he just looks terrible there. Surely Carrick, Schneiderlin or Herrera would be better options. 

On the other hand, I don't think Rooney is ever going to work as a squad player. He's just too high profile, too highly paid, and the media frenzy would make life way too difficult for Mourinho. 

To me the only real answer is just to get rid. But I can't see Mourinho having the balls, even though he isn't one to frighten from a tough call in the past.

An injury would probably work well for all parties right now, as silly as it sounds.

Spot on really.  I think Rooney himself could accept that he has aged, is past it, and could contribute from the bench. I reckon Rooney would probably even play better of the bench, as he wouldn't have the weight of trying to carry Manchester United on his shoulders. But I think you're right that the media would absolutely hound him for it.

But then if you got rid of him, which I don't personally think is the best option, I have no idea where he would go. He wouldn't leave England.

Everton - he might even get to play Champions League again ;-)

Sunderland, they desperately need someone to help stave off their annual relegation battle.

Rooney hangs over the team like the shadow of Sir A hangs over every manager. 

But why? Is he really that marketable?

Of course he is not what he used to be, but as I mentioned months ago the team is still short of quality players. Rooney is still better than Fellaini, Memphis Mata and one or two others. If you look at the young blokes like Rashford and Martial they have skill,pace but no football brains. Lingard  is overrated. 

Jose has not got the right combination and he may have to drop Rooney to achieve this. 

The defense is the problem as Smalling was one reason Watford scored as was Mata and Pobga and Shaw. 

All the hysteria about Utd losing the last three games and blaming Rooney is ridiculous as he did not play in all three.

I don't actually think many people are blaming Rooney. 

It looks kinda like two separate discussions - picking over the three defeats is one (although in my opinion, only the Watford defeat is of huge significance, an away tie in the Europa League and a loss to a pretty great Man City side on the day are not major issues), and whether or not Rooney is good enough anymore is another.