England World Cup thread - the thread of certain disappointment

Or maybe, just maybe, regardless of whatever xenophobic rules you put in place, England just aren't that good?

How many English(WC eligible) players play in Europe's top teams.   

Is the FA # of England eligible players per EPL squad rule going to help by 2018 or will those players only be token gestures?

It is nothing to do with xenophobic rules. It is doing what is best for England. Hang on, there are over 6 million refugees at the moment-- let the UK take them.

Or maybe, just maybe, regardless of whatever xenophobic rules you put in place, England just aren't that good?

Spoken like a true EPL club supporter...

Craig Gardner is from the Midlands and couldn't settle in Sunderland because he was too homesick

Being quite harsh. The two teams that contested the European Cup were Spanish. Yet that nation has done much worse in the World Cup than England. This English team were unfortunate not to do better. Unlucky goal to lose to Uruguay, great strike by Suarez, but unlucky to get that touch. They are a promising young team who need to play together more to figure out what each other's roles are. 

Thank you.

'Arry stirring the pot, still A) Hardly unexpected as particularly at the last word cup none of  the players really looked like they gave a toss and B) great timing from Redknapp and I'm not surprised that he has chosen now to let us in on this "revelation".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27962633

It's taken him 4 years to realise what we all knew? Although he is correct, the same key players have displayed the same attitude.

Nice reply fro Stevie G

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/27969231

Balls in your court Harry: you're the bitter gobshite revealing all; how about some names?

Actually, who gives a monkeys about 'arry  and his view. I find the fact that Lampard will Capt and start v Costa Rica far more alarming. In a perfect world, England would be through to the next round and Hodgson could give Frank Lampard a cap to say " thanks ". However, the reality is that we've been turfed out, it's a dead rubber but we still want TO WIN. Replacing one old, soon to retire midfielder with another is pretty cockeyed thinking. If you HAVE to involve them Roy, use them via the bench after the bright young things have scared you with their " naivete ".

Enger-land, like Espana and a few others (incl Bosnia) now irrelevant. Adios & try harder next time.

Interesting analysis and commentary by Stan Collymore on what's wrong with English football.

If you can get past the probable region-blocking bullshit it's well worth a look/listen:

http://www.sbs.com.au/ondemand/video/285962307847/Collymore-on-Englands-exit

As others have said, the simple truth is that England are not good enough. Since winning the WC in 1966, they have not gone close, apart from taking advantage of a favourable run in 1990. So it shouldn't be a surprise that they never get anywhere, but given that most of ours (and the world's) biggest exposure to football is the EPL, our opinions are coloured by the fact that we are very familiar with the key English players.

I'd like to hear Gerrards take on why he's played so piss poor? Rooneys too for the same reasons. 1 goal in 3 different World Cups from a guy that made scoring a boring pas time. Two key players that for three different world cups, failed to deliver.

Although I do not watch much EPL, my overall impression is that it has little to do with English football. It is a largely multinational business (in terms of ownership) with participants (players) largely from everywhere but England (OK, it is an overstatement), which happens to be physically situated in England. A number of coaches at the top level (EPL) may be English but others here may correct me on that.

So in my own view the only thing that makes EPL related to English football is the paying audience in the stands. That is not going to be enough to take England very far in the World Cup, assuming the FA even care about that.  Contrast that with the composition of the German team majority of who play in the Bundesliga. That may not win them the World Cup either, but it is likely to always get them further than England.

More English national team players play in the EPL than German national team players in the Bundesliga..

They just aren't as good and have a losing culture, rather than a winning one like the Germans.

England team to face Costa Rica

Foster
Cahill
Jones
Smalling
Shaw
Lampard
Wilshire
Barkley
Milner
Lallana
Sturridge

Not surprising to see Hart dropped after to shit games . Could be an opportunity for Forster to stake a claim as Englands number one.
Suprised Rooney has been dropped tbh thought he was one of the only players trying in the last game.

Can't believe he's made nine changes to the team from the Uruguay game. Whilst guys like Barkley, lallana etc need to start, I'm not impressed with Hodgson's tinkering: throwing nine new faces together is not; a " team ", just a collection of individuals. I'm fully supportive of young guys being given a go, but why revert to Lampard? It smacks of sentimentality, not forward planning. Surprised Rooney's been left out too: he can't be impressed with how the coach has mucked him around positionally and now jettisoned him. He was the best Engl player v Uruguay...

It's Lampard's last game after over 100 caps and there is nothing riding on it. Fair enough to let him lead the team out and wear the shirt one last time.

Top nations, like Germany/Netherlands/Brazil, tend top play a style that suits the players they bring in. The coaches know what he has at his disposal, and sets a formation and tactics to match.

England on the other hand, take their best players and then try to squeeze them into an unfamiliar style of play.

When your team is predominantly made up of players from teams who like to attack (Liverpool, Southampton, Man Yoo - last year, Everton) why would you play the way England did?

The style did not suit the players and the mananger, coach, senior players and captain all have a responsibility for not having that discussion at soem point. 

So true, they got in all sorts to try and play a 442 a few years back and it didnt work. It almost smacks of Ricki, how they are playing players out of position.

I agree that it truly sounds like The Nix under Ricki after GM demanded "attacking football".

And Roy gets an OK from the FA for mediocrity. Laughable.

The FA = Pink Gin swillers society.

What England really need is an English manager. Wait what..

brown bags Redknapp  article has a serious flaw

Tottenham players have no connection with the Champions League.

Has the Ox been injured all tournament?

biting again from Suarez

Sure as eggs Uruguay then score

Hilarious stuff

What is it with Suarez and chomping? 

That guy needs help

retrospective ban surely. 

I wonder if  FIFA  can add further sanction for prior form.

And how exactly would a retrospective ban work? FIFA declares that he was banned for the group stages and missed the game against England?

It was nice watching the England team snatch a draw from Costa Rica. 10k per week players at best V a team full of players earning anyehere between 50k - 200k per week. Is Sturridge gonna be the "new" Ashley Young? Dropping down at every chance. 

A couple of nice shots to be fair but oh dear Woy. Is your match plan " just go out there lads and do your thing" ? Because there seemed no game plan other than route 1 and the occassional Gary Owen. Even when "the big guns" were wheeled out with 20 to go, I saw no improvement.

Ummm... retrospective as in retrospectively looking at match footage to determine a future ban... 

Apparently FIFA laws state that a player can be banned for up to two years for biting. He's had 7 games and 10 games for the first two times. Surely they should be looking at something far more serious now. It's disgusting and a poor look for the game having this guy running about as one of it's highest profile ambassadors.

My thoughts - probably no different than any other England supporter.

I remember FrankieMac saying why replace players just for the sake of it if they are no better and it was good to see Shaw and Forster look more composed than Baines and Hart, so I was pleased that Roy did make changes.  Wiltshire looked creative too and Barkley and Milner had good spells. 

You are right about only having one plan. Sort of messy 4-5-1/4-2-3-1 I'm guessing, hard to tell at times.  Playing the ball behind CR's defense and relying on Sturridge to get the goals was a bit limited, but that was not my biggest problem.

The fact is England just cannot handle having the ball a their feet. They don't just lose possession with poor crosses, although they did their fair share, the ball gets taken off them with ease. I saw Barkley x3, Jones, Shaw, Smalling, Lampard, all have the ball taken away from them causing any build up to fall apart. You can see the seconds tick by as an England player has the ball and then decides what to do with it. 

As a whole they don't gel as a team and that was the same in the last World cup. All the teams we've seen appear really comfortable working with each other. I think only Shaw and Lallana actually looked like they knew who each other were. The rest strangers.

The inability to cross the ball from anywhere apart from side to side is frustrating too unless it's knocking it over the head of defense. Or playing it to someone who is immediately likely to get tackled.

I don't get to see much of England or the Premiership these days but by god the team seem to be going backwards. It's been said so many times that the team are great athletes but are very poor technically.  We've listened to Brooking blather on about a national training center for years, now it's here people are talking about it already being a White Elephant.  The Premier clubs are happy to carrying on what they are doing anyway and training their own. They'll always do what they want regardless of what the FA has in mind.  

Can't see us causing much fuss at the next tournament really - we are light years away from playing any better than the teams that have gone through and even some that didn't. Roy "We dominated the match" really should have shut up and the jog across the pitch reminded of  the Wally in the Brolly. The commentator said Pleat but I couldn't remember what incident he was talking about.

The Comedy gold moment was a frankly HUGE Rooney making that attempt to head the ball home, it was slo mo but in real time - how long did he hang in the air? A decade? By the time he hit the ground, the game had finished and the England squad were back home. Please someone make a Gif of that.

England's best performance was their first game and they should have won that. 

They looked fluent and played at pace, much like Liverpool, which was understandable given Johnson, Gerrard, Henderson, Sterling and Sturridge were all playing. They went with a similar pacey attacking style and it worked very well I thought. 

If someone had the balls to drop Rooney and instead someone quicker and less hot-and-cold was playing on the left wing that day - perhaps Oxlade-Chamberlain if he was fit - they may have won the game. In saying that the defence let them down badly for the two goals.

Win that game and the rest of the tournament would've been different. 

They lost themselves a little against Uruguay but even then they were somewhat sucker-punched with the goals. The third game isn't really worth analysis given it didn't matter and they played a completely different side. 

I think England were fairly unlucky in this tournament. Injuries cost them potentially their two best wingers (Walcott and the Ox) and they actually played a style that I felt suited their personnel and could easily have got them to the top of the group with a bit more luck. 

A lot of the more negative reflections above seem to be based on their previous failings than what actually transpired in the last couple of weeks...?

No I don't think they have progressed that's all, unlike many other countries.

I'm not sure how you expect progression between tournaments when the team has undergone such a changing of the guard. The bulk of their squad is new, they are in a period of transition. I feel they did well to qualify as easily as they did in the first place. 

In their strongest eleven I count two players who have been heavily involved in their last few failures - Gerrard and Rooney. 

For me this tournament was the setting down of a marker with which to start their progression. 

Unfortunately the marker has been set low... but with some luck it could've been better. 

Next tournament Gerrard will be gone and it wouldn't surprise me to see Rooney gone too. 

The rest of them will have had a couple more years experience. I expect to see progression then. I think that must be how the FA sees it too since they've asked Hodgson to carry on.

If they expected progression from the last tournament he'd have already been sacked.

Don't mean to incite a riot with this but perhaps England fans have unreasonable expectations?

So Martin in hindsight was it bollocks?