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Women's Central League

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12 days ago

Simon B wrote:
LT01 wrote:
Will Phoenix stay in this league with their U18s and have their reserves in the national league?
I don't know the answer but to my mind that would make sense. NZF were pretty clear the new NL would have the Nix and AFC Ressies for both men and women, so unless the Participation Agreement with Capital Football changes I'd expect the Wāhinix U18s to stay in the WCL and the Phoenix Thirds to take the Weenix's spot in whatever the MCL looks like next year (trial by fire but hey, equal opportunities).

Why would the participation agreement need to change and why are the different to anyone else?

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12 days ago

Feverish wrote:
Why would the participation agreement need to change and why are the different to anyone else?

Yeah that's my point - my understanding is the PA guarantees a Nix spot in the WCL and MCL (recognising that the current MCL isn't a federation league), so when the two Reserves teams move up the U18s/Thirds are the obvious contenders to take those spots.

But with the changes coming in 2027 who knows what the MCL in particular will look like. At least with the WCL retaining roughly the status quo seems like the cleanest path forward, from the outside anyway (Cap Football staff may be laughing at my naivete as I post this).

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12 days ago

Simon B wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Why would the participation agreement need to change and why are the different to anyone else?
Yeah that's my point - my understanding is the PA guarantees a Nix spot in the WCL and MCL (recognising that the current MCL isn't a federation league), so when the two Reserves teams move up the U18s/Thirds are the obvious contenders to take those spots.

But with the changes coming in 2027 who knows what the MCL in particular will look like. At least with the WCL retaining roughly the status quo seems like the cleanest path forward, from the outside anyway (Cap Football staff may be laughing at my naivete as I post this).

They aren’t guaranteed spots in any league apart from NL I thought.

Founder

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12 days ago

Feverish wrote:
They aren’t guaranteed spots in any league apart from NL I thought.

That was my read of the CF regulations, although the PA isn't published as far as I know so it may tell a different story. The WCL/MCL2 Regs state:

11.5 For the WCL, the Wellington Phoenix FC will be granted entry via their Participation Agreement with Capital Football.

But now I look closely the 2025-vintage MCL/NL Regs only say "these Regulations shall be read in conjunction with the Wellington Phoenix FC and Auckland FC Participation Agreement between NZF and Wellington Phoenix FC/Auckland FC". So maybe I'm wrong and the Weenix were never guaranteed an MCL spot after all?

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12 days ago

Simon B wrote:
Feverish wrote:
They aren’t guaranteed spots in any league apart from NL I thought.
That was my read of the CF regulations, although the PA isn't published as far as I know so it may tell a different story. The WCL/MCL2 Regs state:

11.5 For the WCL, the Wellington Phoenix FC will be granted entry via their Participation Agreement with Capital Football.

But now I look closely the 2025-vintage MCL/NL Regs only say "these Regulations shall be read in conjunction with the Wellington Phoenix FC and Auckland FC Participation Agreement between NZF and Wellington Phoenix FC/Auckland FC". So maybe I'm wrong and the Weenix were never guaranteed an MCL spot after all?

I assume that means that they can be in it given their club status. They are subject to promotion and relegation when the agreement was done at least initially (still the one published)

Founder

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11 days ago

On the Phoenix' inclusion in the Women's Central League. Their U18 team will essentially be a reserve team for the Phoenix Women's National League Team so its a bit on the nose if Club's aren't afforded the same pathway. Having National League players drop players into the Women's Premier League would be a bit of a joke. You could even put similar restrictions on any clubs that have both a National League team and a team in the Women's Central League as the Phoenix have (ie U20 or U18). Now would be the time to do it of course.

Thinking out loud, it could also help to mitigate future issues when a team being relegated down into the Women's Central League. On the cards is a scenario where a team is relegated from the National League, and no one in the Capital Federation gains promotion to the National League. This would either prevent teams from being promoted for an entire season, or you would end up with 2x teams being relegated from the competition. If the current rule remained that there is to be only 1 team per club in the Women's Central League, then the relegated National League team would automatically bump their own team down.

Food for thought!

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11 days ago

Reserve teams need to be kept out of WCL, this is a non-negotiable for me. I'd be ok with the Nix U18's being in there, but that's it.

I expect the league will be an NINE team league. Nix U18, Petone, PNU, Seatoun, Miramar, Vic Uni, Marist, Napier City Rovers (promoted from Central Fed League), & Te Kotahitanga (promoted from Cap Prem).

It'll be initially 9 teams, because I suspect there are some serious fears about Marist not having a team to enter. I'm not a Palmy local, but the rumour is they're losing more players this season (a few are moving cities I believe). I was told their academy players probably aren't ready for WCL either, so unless they can convince the veterans in their "Mayhem" social team to step back into Central League, their firsts are in serious trouble.

In other words, it'll be a nine team league to cover the risk of Marist withdrawing.

Also, I'm not sure any other club is ready to step to WCL. The next highest Fed League team is Moturoa, who pulled out end of last season and have a 2 year ban in place as a result, while below them is New Plymouth Rangers in 3rd. They'd probably say yes to promotion, but is their squad good enough for it? From Cap Prem, next highest eligible team is Wairarapa United in 5th (North Wellington could move ahead into 5th on the final day though). Both of those teams have HALF the points Te Kotahitanga do though....not sure they'd be ready for the league either. Unless we accept there will be one season of "adaptation", where the bottom 2 or 3 might might be some distance off the rest?

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11 days ago

With the National League coming in, the Women’s Central League is no longer the top league available to players. I’d much rather see a competitive team included than promote another side purely because it is a “first team” only for them to be significantly outmatched or at risk of withdrawing. It also does the Women’s Premier League a disservice having National League Players dropping into that space.

I also understand that the Phoenix may not continue in the WCL if the National League clubs aren’t involved, as it may no longer be worth their while.

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11 days ago

Unknwn Quantity wrote:
With the National League coming in, the Women’s Central League is no longer the top league available to players. I’d much rather see a competitive team included than promote another side purely because it is a “first team” only for them to be significantly outmatched or at risk of withdrawing. It also does the Women’s Premier League a disservice having National League Players dropping into that space.

I also understand that the Phoenix may not continue in the WCL if the National League clubs aren’t involved, as it may no longer be worth their while.

It's still a pathway league. Imagine if we include Wellington United and Karori Reserves, and they finish 1st and 2nd. Neither can take a promotion, and I doubt the club finishing 3rd would be offered the chance. So all we've done, is blocked our region from potentially adding another team to National League.

I also worry that including Reserve teams encourages those NL clubs to hoard players, selling players a false dream of playing for the NL side one day. We should be encouraging our best players to play for a First Team, not a reserve team.

Keep those Reserve teams well away from Central League thanks.

Oh one other point - PNU lost 12-0 to the Nix U18's in their first season, now look at them. I think it's ok to give clubs a chance.

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11 days ago · edited 11 days ago · History

I understand the worry about having Reserve teams in Central League, particularly that Wellington United and Karori could potentially hoard players and sell them a false hope of eventually playing for the National League side.

That said, the Premier League this season has shown that both Karori and United, whose squads are predominantly U18 players, are currently the 2nd and 3rd best teams. So I think there could be a happy medium rather than ruling Reserve teams out completely.

One option could be putting an age restriction on Reserve teams in Central League. For example, making the squad U18-eligible, with an allowance of a maximum of three over-18 players on the matchday team.

That would keep the teams genuinely development-focused, maintain a competitive league, and eliminate the incentive for older players to jump ship to a Reserve team rather than playing First Team football.

I also think we need to consider the effect this could have on the rest of the Premier League. If both United and Karori Reserves remain in Premier League while being able to drop National League-quality players into the competition, it could create a pretty horrible playing experience for the other teams, particularly if they are clearly the strongest teams in the league.

Making sure Central League is as competitive as possible is important too. You get better by playing against the best, and having strong teams competing at that level benefits everyone.

For me, the U18 restriction could be a good safeguard. It still gives clubs the opportunity to develop their younger players at a higher level, while making sure all the best players don't simply flock to one or two Reserve teams.

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BiUn

11 days ago

Top first team enters playoffs, encourage players to play where their development is best and they are comfortable, nine team league lol.

Founder

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11 days ago

Whatever they do, let’s hope they don’t have an uneven number of teams…

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11 days ago

Feverish wrote:
Top first team enters playoffs, encourage players to play where their development is best and they are comfortable, nine team league lol.

Bedt thing I have read in the last couple of months - players play where their development is best and are comfortable.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. Karori and United have a responsibility to be honest with players and allow them to move to another club without prejudice. I’m
Not saying they have specifically done this in the past….. but it definitely happens in Wellington

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10 days ago

Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Top first team enters playoffs, encourage players to play where their development is best and they are comfortable, nine team league lol.
Bedt thing I have read in the last couple of months - players play where their development is best and are comfortable.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. Karori and United have a responsibility to be honest with players and allow them to move to another club without prejudice. I’m
Not saying they have specifically done this in the past….. but it definitely happens in Wellington

Got an example?

Founder

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10 days ago

Feverish wrote:
Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Top first team enters playoffs, encourage players to play where their development is best and they are comfortable, nine team league lol.
Bedt thing I have read in the last couple of months - players play where their development is best and are comfortable.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. Karori and United have a responsibility to be honest with players and allow them to move to another club without prejudice. I’m
Not saying they have specifically done this in the past….. but it definitely happens in Wellington
Got an example?

Examples of players being pressured by coaches to hang around in reserves squads with the promise of first team football in the future…. Multiple examples every season

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10 days ago

Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Top first team enters playoffs, encourage players to play where their development is best and they are comfortable, nine team league lol.
Bedt thing I have read in the last couple of months - players play where their development is best and are comfortable.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. Karori and United have a responsibility to be honest with players and allow them to move to another club without prejudice. I’m
Not saying they have specifically done this in the past….. but it definitely happens in Wellington
Got an example?
Examples of players being pressured by coaches to hang around in reserves squads with the promise of first team football in the future…. Multiple examples every season

Ok so no then.
A coach would get found out if they handed out guarantees . Players would walk and reps ruined. Earning your stripes through the grades is a rite of passage in football. Every player goes through it and it’s a good thing. The men’s amateur (yet contracted game) is losing this which is sad.
You seem to have a bee in your bonnet so I’ll leave you to your nine team league

Founder

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10 days ago

Feverish wrote:
Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Top first team enters playoffs, encourage players to play where their development is best and they are comfortable, nine team league lol.
Bedt thing I have read in the last couple of months - players play where their development is best and are comfortable.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. Karori and United have a responsibility to be honest with players and allow them to move to another club without prejudice. I’m
Not saying they have specifically done this in the past….. but it definitely happens in Wellington
Got an example?
Examples of players being pressured by coaches to hang around in reserves squads with the promise of first team football in the future…. Multiple examples every season
Ok so no then.
A coach would get found out if they handed out guarantees . Players would walk and reps ruined. Earning your stripes through the grades is a rite of passage in football. Every player goes through it and it’s a good thing. The men’s amateur (yet contracted game) is losing this which is sad.
You seem to have a bee in your bonnet so I’ll leave you to your nine team league

Have you seen the number of players who change clubs each season? Part of that is absolutely down to players being given false promises. I know of a number of young lads who have moved to Wellington when they finish school, and get all sorts of offers that never get fulfilled. Those players then get left in a Reserve team with little support for their development. If those boys hadn't been misled and sold the idea of "you'll be in the First Team at our Central League club", they would have gone to another club and got the required support for their development as a player.

Yes players should "earn their stripes", but they also need to be supported in their development as players. You only improve through getting match minutes at the right level, AND being given decent coaching.

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10 days ago

2027 WCL Competition Structure confirmed:

1. Petone
2. PNU
3. Phoenix U18
4. Miramar
5. Seatoun
6. Vic Uni
7. PNM
8. TK
9. Central Qualifier

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10 days ago

BigRed49 wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Top first team enters playoffs, encourage players to play where their development is best and they are comfortable, nine team league lol.
Bedt thing I have read in the last couple of months - players play where their development is best and are comfortable.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. Karori and United have a responsibility to be honest with players and allow them to move to another club without prejudice. I’m
Not saying they have specifically done this in the past….. but it definitely happens in Wellington
Got an example?
Examples of players being pressured by coaches to hang around in reserves squads with the promise of first team football in the future…. Multiple examples every season
Ok so no then.
A coach would get found out if they handed out guarantees . Players would walk and reps ruined. Earning your stripes through the grades is a rite of passage in football. Every player goes through it and it’s a good thing. The men’s amateur (yet contracted game) is losing this which is sad.
You seem to have a bee in your bonnet so I’ll leave you to your nine team league

Have you seen the number of players who change clubs each season? Part of that is absolutely down to players being given false promises. I know of a number of young lads who have moved to Wellington when they finish school, and get all sorts of offers that never get fulfilled. Those players then get left in a Reserve team with little support for their development. If those boys hadn't been misled and sold the idea of "you'll be in the First Team at our Central League club", they would have gone to another club and got the required support for their development as a player.

Yes players should "earn their stripes", but they also need to be supported in their development as players. You only improve through getting match minutes at the right level, AND being given decent coaching.

You know this thread is the “Women's” Central League thread right?

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10 days ago

A 10-team/20-game league would’ve been nice, but oh well…

I know it’s a long way off but have they decided what pro/rel looks like at the end of ‘27? For example can we expect playoffs at either end of the table, or will that only be firmed up once NZF see how the new NL is going?

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10 days ago · edited 10 days ago · History

Simon B wrote:
A 10-team/20-game league would’ve been nice, but oh well…

I know it’s a long way off but have they decided what pro/rel looks like at the end of ‘27? For example can we expect playoffs at either end of the table, or will that only be firmed up once NZF see how the new NL is going?

The nine-team structure provides a clear competition pathway for 2027, with a direct promotion opportunity from each federation and no requirement for a promotion play-off

for entry to the 2027 Women’s Central League.

If this stance continues to next year, I take that as a relegation and two promotions. Later in the correspondence it states that reserves teams could get promoted.

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10 days ago

Simon B wrote:
A 10-team/20-game league would’ve been nice, but oh well…

I know it’s a long way off but have they decided what pro/rel looks like at the end of ‘27? For example can we expect playoffs at either end of the table, or will that only be firmed up once NZF see how the new NL is going?

(A ten team league is 18 games)
They’ve done as badly as expected

Founder

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10 days ago

Feverish wrote:
(A ten team league is 18 games)

And this is why I shouldn’t post while cooking dinner…

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9 days ago

Nine team league....I called it. I hate that I was right though!

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9 days ago

there will be challenges to this and other decisions.
9 team league is so so stupid!

Queenslander 3x a year.

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9 days ago

Rovers bills are going up with MNL, CL2, WCL

Founder

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9 days ago · edited 9 days ago · History

isnt this the kind of thing the mllions from WC qualification are supposed to be funding?

Queenslander 3x a year.

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9 days ago

theprof wrote:
isnt this the kind of thing the mllions from WC qualification are supposed to be funding?

Fed travel budgets? Maybe, but not the clubs directly as such,.

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9 days ago

I guess, but if NZF wants these clubs not to go bankrupt or to pull out of comps because they cant afford the travel then it stands to reason that NZF should at least be providing funds for travel expenses.

Queenslander 3x a year.

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9 days ago

Interesting that Central want to help their NL side (Napier men) but Cap Footy don’t

Founder

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9 days ago

theprof wrote:
there will be challenges to this and other decisions.
9 team league is so so stupid!

It's a nine team league right now...lets see if Marist are still in when round 1 kicks off in 2027...

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9 days ago

BigRed49 wrote:
theprof wrote:
there will be challenges to this and other decisions.
9 team league is so so stupid!
It's a nine team league right now...lets see if Marist are still in when round 1 kicks off in 2027...

Very good point. Apparently the majority of the Marist team seems to be heading to United next year so don't be surpsied if it becomes 8 before the season starts.

Apparently the reasoning behind making it 9 teams instead of 8 is that they wanted more games. 14 games isn't really viable for teams.

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9 days ago

How would it become 8? It is a 9 team league

Founder

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9 days ago · edited 9 days ago · History

Feverish wrote:
How would it become 8? It is a 9 team league

If you read the last couple of posts, we're suggesting Marist may pull out, and won't be replaced.

Edit: my original reply was un-necesarily snarky. Sorry.

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9 days ago

BigRed49 wrote:
Feverish wrote:
How would it become 8? It is a 9 team league
If you read the last couple of posts, we're suggesting Marist may pull out, and won't be replaced.

Edit: my original reply was un-necesarily snarky. Sorry.

Yeah but you define a league (nine teams), someone pulls out, you replace them.

Founder

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9 days ago · edited 9 days ago · History

Feverish wrote:
BigRed49 wrote:
Feverish wrote:
How would it become 8? It is a 9 team league
If you read the last couple of posts, we're suggesting Marist may pull out, and won't be replaced.

Edit: my original reply was un-necesarily snarky. Sorry.
Yeah but you define a league (nine teams), someone pulls out, you replace them.

Sorry yeah, terrible wording from me. I meant that don't be surpised if Marist pull out before the season starts. I fully expect that someone like North Welly or Wairarapa would love the chance to move up if asked.

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9 days ago

Feverish wrote:
Interesting that Central want to help their NL side (Napier men) but Cap Footy don’t

They are… They have changed the regulations to allow reserves teams to be promoted. Have just decided to do it Merit based and not piss off every non-NL club.

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9 days ago · edited 9 days ago · History

Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Interesting that Central want to help their NL side (Napier men) but Cap Footy don’t
They are… They have changed the regulations to allow reserves teams to be promoted. Have just decided to do it Merit based and not piss off every non-NL club.

They have said it is a first team competition
Otherwise if say PNM pulled out Karori would be promoted as they finished 16 points higher than Rapa!

Founder

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9 days ago

Feverish wrote:
Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Interesting that Central want to help their NL side (Napier men) but Cap Footy don’t
They are… They have changed the regulations to allow reserves teams to be promoted. Have just decided to do it Merit based and not piss off every non-NL club.
They have said it is a first team competition
Otherwise if say PNM pulled out Karori would be promoted as they finished 16 points higher than Rapa!

Capital Football remains open to National League reserve teams being eligible for promotion playoffs and future seasons. This will be considered after we have assessed the impact of the 2027 winter National League on the women’s competition pathway.

I’m reading between the lines - reserves teams will be able to qualify next season, if they’re good enough.

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9 days ago · edited 9 days ago · History

Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Bigboot wrote:
Feverish wrote:
Interesting that Central want to help their NL side (Napier men) but Cap Footy don’t
They are… They have changed the regulations to allow reserves teams to be promoted. Have just decided to do it Merit based and not piss off every non-NL club.
They have said it is a first team competition
Otherwise if say PNM pulled out Karori would be promoted as they finished 16 points higher than Rapa!
Capital Football remains open to National League reserve teams being eligible for promotion playoffs and future seasons. This will be considered after we have assessed the impact of the 2027 winter National League on the women’s competition pathway.
I’m reading between the lines - reserves teams will be able to qualify next season, if they’re good enough.

Either way - irrelevant to the point I made

Edit - how much fence sitting mumbo jumbo is that btw!

Founder

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