Wellington Phoenix Men

Australia Cup vs Nunawading City FC | Sun 10th Aug | 5:00pm | YouTube

235 replies · 12,402 views
7 months ago
Wasn't a great watch but jeez that was a shockingly bad surface. A bit of a leveller when you are up against a lower league outfit who play and probably practice on that kind of pitch week in week out. First half I think we were trying to be over-elaborate with a ball that was barely controllable; 2nd half we were much better and NC had to sit deeper. Credit to the home team, they defended brilliantly even if there is a hint of the pop gun about our attack.

Good to see some of the younger players get some more valuable experience. Loke looks promising. I can understand the angst about the upcoming season. We look short of a quality playmaker, an experienced CB, a reliable goalkeeper and another robust screening mid to compliment Rufer. Apart from that we are fine!
7 months ago
Outpost
Wasn't a great watch but jeez that was a shockingly bad surface. A bit of a leveller when you are up against a lower league outfit who play and probably practice on that kind of pitch week in week out. First half I think we were trying to be over-elaborate with a ball that was barely controllable; 2nd half we were much better and NC had to sit deeper. Credit to the home team, they defended brilliantly even if there is a hint of the pop gun about our attack.

Good to see some of the younger players get some more valuable experience. Loke looks promising. I can understand the angst about the upcoming season. We look short of a quality playmaker, an experienced CB, a reliable goalkeeper and another robust screening mid to compliment Rufer. Apart from that we are fine!

Big this. The bumpy pitch definitely played a part in trying to play any flowing football. Shark pitches are always a bit of a leveller, and makes it a bit harder to judge what level of poor the Nix were. No doubting they weren't great.

There were alot of positive vibes are the Perth win, but you are only as good as your lsst game.

Firmly agree with others that a high ALM creative midfielder is the best use of the final visa spot. Last season's cameos with either Rojas or Chico we showed signs of playing decent football. Without them it was that horrible turgid soup.

WSW or even Heidelberg will be a proper litmus test. Heidelberg beat Nundawading 5-0 in this year's Dockerty Cup semi finals (Victorian state Cup comp). They are currently 2nd in the VIC NPL, on GD from Avondale (1st).
They must be a chance of upsetting the Wanderers.
7 months ago
Outpost
Wasn't a great watch but jeez that was a shockingly bad surface. A bit of a leveller when you are up against a lower league outfit who play and probably practice on that kind of pitch week in week out. First half I think we were trying to be over-elaborate with a ball that was barely controllable; 2nd half we were much better and NC had to sit deeper. Credit to the home team, they defended brilliantly even if there is a hint of the pop gun about our attack.

Good to see some of the younger players get some more valuable experience. Loke looks promising. I can understand the angst about the upcoming season. We look short of a quality playmaker, an experienced CB, a reliable goalkeeper and another robust screening mid to compliment Rufer. Apart from that we are fine!

Theoretically, superior technique kicks in on a bad surface.

The pitch was a step down in standard for both teams. Furthermore, it was wide, usually an underdog will decrease dimensions is they want to level things.

360footballnews.com

7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
reg22
Outpost
Wasn't a great watch but jeez that was a shockingly bad surface. A bit of a leveller when you are up against a lower league outfit who play and probably practice on that kind of pitch week in week out. First half I think we were trying to be over-elaborate with a ball that was barely controllable; 2nd half we were much better and NC had to sit deeper. Credit to the home team, they defended brilliantly even if there is a hint of the pop gun about our attack.

Good to see some of the younger players get some more valuable experience. Loke looks promising. I can understand the angst about the upcoming season. We look short of a quality playmaker, an experienced CB, a reliable goalkeeper and another robust screening mid to compliment Rufer. Apart from that we are fine!

Theoretically, superior technique kicks in on a bad surface.

The pitch was a step down in standard for both teams. Furthermore, it was wide, usually an underdog will decrease dimensions is they want to level things.
.
7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
In theory maybe. But the big negative with a bad surface is it slows the game down.
You have to wait and watch a ball the whole way before it comes to your foot, if you don't trust at what height or speed it will arrive. Just more difficult to play at a high pace, especially when you are otherwise training day in day out on the NZCIS billiard table pitches.

Don't get me wrong, the Nix were poor. And I only saw the last 30 mins when it seems they were at their best. Move on, and judge later if is a reversion to last season's sharke or a bad game hiccup enroute to things improving. Again positives are that Payne, Armiento and Eze who are all likely ALM starters got their first mins.
7 months ago
You know what was the worst thing to watch?? That sharkty TV camera coverage. It was like watching a game through reversed binoculars. If it wasn't for a Nix fan standing behind the goal and filming it, I'd never have seen how it went in. 2 Sharkty cameras and not one was really showing a closer to the action type of picture.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

7 months ago
yeah the TV camera was either really zoomed in or giving the wide angle shot, I guess this is always going to be the case though when you take games to the smaller parts of Aussie football.

Queenslander 3x a year.

7 months ago
Couldnt give two sharks re: performance

Terrible pitch, we avoided the banana peel, and get another pre season game to gel in

a.haak

7 months ago
Outpost
Wasn't a great watch but jeez that was a shockingly bad surface. A bit of a leveller when you are up against a lower league outfit who play and probably practice on that kind of pitch week in week out. First half I think we were trying to be over-elaborate with a ball that was barely controllable; 2nd half we were much better and NC had to sit deeper. Credit to the home team, they defended brilliantly even if there is a hint of the pop gun about our attack.

Good to see some of the younger players get some more valuable experience. Loke looks promising. I can understand the angst about the upcoming season. We look short of a quality playmaker, an experienced CB, a reliable goalkeeper and another robust screening mid to compliment Rufer. Apart from that we are fine!
Just going through the livestream again and wow yeah.

Was so frustrated by how we were playing that I didn't even notice that there were multiple times throughout where the football was bouncing like a toy rubber bouncy ball.
7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
reg22
Outpost
Wasn't a great watch but jeez that was a shockingly bad surface. A bit of a leveller when you are up against a lower league outfit who play and probably practice on that kind of pitch week in week out. First half I think we were trying to be over-elaborate with a ball that was barely controllable; 2nd half we were much better and NC had to sit deeper. Credit to the home team, they defended brilliantly even if there is a hint of the pop gun about our attack.

Good to see some of the younger players get some more valuable experience. Loke looks promising. I can understand the angst about the upcoming season. We look short of a quality playmaker, an experienced CB, a reliable goalkeeper and another robust screening mid to compliment Rufer. Apart from that we are fine!

Theoretically, superior technique kicks in on a bad surface.

The pitch was a step down in standard for both teams. Furthermore, it was wide, usually an underdog will decrease dimensions is they want to level things.

Not making an excuse for a garbage performance, but I really disagree with this. And football would be better in NZ if we accepted that bad pitches = bad football. 

A bad pitch is the ultimate leveler. When you're on a bobbly pitch things you could do in one touch now take three. You can't hit firm passes to each other. You have to follow balls all the way to your feet (harder to get your head up earlier). Etc. Etc. These are things that make a good player good. Lesser players just do the same.

Bad pitches make good technique less useful.
7 months ago
Mainland FC
mjp2
McCarron aside, I'd say we started tonight with six still at best fairly inexperienced youngsters who ideally should not be A League starters.  So six of ten outfield players were youngsters:
Conchie, Sheridan, GSR, LBS, Loke and LKH.

Sure LKH has started the better part of a season's worth of games now. But who of you would be telling me he's yet an ideal starter? Sheridan a somewhat similar case. And the other guys have got reasonable playing time, sure, but don't tell me they are guys you want to see playing 70+ minutes of every A League game as starters - yet. Just no. 

So we started with six outfield youngsters. Seven counting the keeper.

LBS was subbed by Supyk, another non-starter. Retre replaced Payne, keeping us at six outfield non starters. Then Armiento replaced LKH fairly late and and a brand new to the team Eze replaced GSR.  So for only the last 20mins did we finally have a team with arguably six out of ten outfield players who were what I'd expect to be our outfield starter level. With Sheridan, Conchie, Supyk and Loke still on.

And most of the senior players I am classing as bonafide experienced starters aren't fully fit yet or were having their first minutes with the team this game. 

If we were to start with Armiento and Eze we would immediately get to six outfield starters to four younger players, instead of six youngsters dominating the outfield. Makes a heck of a difference. Add Rufer (and move one of Nagasawa, Retre, Ishige further forward) to replace another youngster, then we are at 7 starters and three youngsters.

Then sign the CB and midfield players who we are looking for as new starters, one a visa. And we would finally be looking at a seasoned team of 9 legitimate senior starters. Plus one of the better youngsters. 

It just seems to me we are starting with more than half an outfield of younger players and the other half senior players who mostly aren't fit yet. And six younger outfield players on together is not going to be anywhere near a starting A League level performance and will play less structured, less well directed and less controlled aka the sort of messy play we saw for much of tonight. And last game.

As Retre coming on and impacting the game from a central deep position showed, we'll be a lot better once the senior players are all back and fit.  Ditto for the period with Eze and Armiento also on.

The last twenty of minutes or so when we had six senior outfield players on was more like the standard we can expect to be at with starter quality, more experienced senior A League players. And we were totally all over Nunawading for that period.



Regarding this part above from mjp2:
"McCarron aside, I'd say we started tonight with six still at best fairly inexperienced youngsters who ideally should not be A League starters.  So six of ten outfield players were youngsters: "Conchie, Sheridan, GSR, LBS, Loke and LKH."
I would not call Sheridan "an inexperienced youngster who ideally should not be A League starter".   There is a difference between being young (Sheridan is 21) and experience.  Definitely in his previous season he was very much work in progress with few appearances, but the last season had him turn out for the first team quite a lot, unlike the other five players mentioned in that paragraph.  
OK, so I may be a low-key Sheridan fan, as he is a local lad from Christchurch and all that.  But he was a solid player last night in a team where the Nix defence did all the right things.  
In contrast, it is our attack that showed last night that is either inexperienced (GSR, LBS, Loke) or outmuscled (Ishige, the goal aside). Hence the addition of Armiento and possibly Eze is promising.  Both have a bit of athleticism, and Armiento needs very little adjustment time to A-League environment.    

Chuckles, I'm fine with one eyed cantabrians. ;)

My point wasn't particularly to criticise any of the young guys.  They've all got potential and, to varying degrees, are not entirely inexperienced.

I've just tried to point out, probably too verbosely, that six of the ten outfielders were young.  Right up to the last 20minutes.  And, despite potential and some degree of experience, you are not going to get the same drive and organisation and dominance out of six young men that you should get out of seasoned, very experienced, physically mature quality starting pros.  It is just too much collective youth.

Same as we saw for large chunks of last year when these kids did a job for us, but had to because Marco, Cola, Payne, Rufer, Sutton, and various others were injured or incapacitated together for large chunks of the season. The younger players are simply not going to boss any team of seasoned hard-nosed A League pros.  They might have done better vs Nunawading, but they didn't, but the big boys coming on made enough of a difference that we did boss Nunawading for the last 20.

Admittedly we tactically changed it up a bit as well.

I don't think the negativity is justified based on watching a bunch of the younger guys gain some more experience (on a difficult pitch).  The starting 11 we turn out in the A League should be a whole different beast.  We got a clear signal of that for the last 20 mins.

We weren't terrific.  We were a heck of a lot better with just a couple more senior guys on.  Auckland looked terrific with pretty much their entire starting team from last year.  We can't expect that from this squad at this stage.

It's terrific we are making a bit of an Australia Cup run and getting some useful pre-season games.   

7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
If we’re crap and have deficiencies I’d rather know now and have us work on them and sign players to help with that, than halfway through the season and then take another 6 weeks attempting to fix it and have that attempt go tits up.

Also if the grounds are lumpy a superior side will react to that. If you continue to try to play like you’re on a billiard table that shows poor captaincy and coaching. More passes in the air etc.

I do agree with this, but:
Outpost said:
We look short of a quality playmaker, an experienced CB, a reliable goalkeeper and another robust screening mid to compliment Rufer. Apart from that we are fine!

I think that if we want a team challenging to win the league that’s definitely the case. We’d replace Retre and Nagasawa with their younger selves. 

However, I’m hopeful that with a couple more signings yet to come and this cup run we might be in top 5 or 6 shape by the start of the season, and that by the time the season has reached the finals series the freedom that properly performing senior players gives to Sheridan, Roa Conchie, Smith, GSR, LBS, Loke and others might see them begin to contribute towards table topping performances. 

Sheridan has shown the ability to run like a dog and throw in the odd amazing pass or shot. LBS is good with ball at feet and Loke has shown why he’s been promoted. Conchie should be a senior player at this point and maybe will be by season’s end. 

It relies on at least two more good signings and limited injury impact this season. If we can manage 3-4 good signings as above (don’t think we’ll be replacing any keepers though, but we might see McCarron or Albie giving Josh a spell/challenge at some point) we could be better than that. 


7 months ago
imanixsupporter
Our team is just quite low on quality I think. There is a lot of unjustified optimism about our youngsters. We have two players who we know would make it into a starting XI of most top 6 A-League sides in Rufer and Payne. Jury still out on Eze but nobody else in our entire squad is good enough and that isn't even debatable. 

Edit: maybe Armiento could too, I don't know, but harsh to judge him when I havent ever really watched him 

I think if most of our youngsters were at British clubs (L1 & 2), they would have been let go by now.
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

7 months ago
Marto
imanixsupporter
Our team is just quite low on quality I think. There is a lot of unjustified optimism about our youngsters. We have two players who we know would make it into a starting XI of most top 6 A-League sides in Rufer and Payne. Jury still out on Eze but nobody else in our entire squad is good enough and that isn't even debatable. 

Edit: maybe Armiento could too, I don't know, but harsh to judge him when I havent ever really watched him 

I think if most of our youngsters were at British clubs (L1 & 2), they would have been let go by now.

I've been negative about the game, but even I think that the above is a little harsh.

LKH is 19, Sheridan 20, Hughes 21 - i don't see those 3 being dropped. Conchie maybe, he's 21/22.

GSR and LBS would be ok as well. Maybe still in the youth, but good enough. 

Sypuk has been disappointing. His miss yesterday was poor, but he did make some better runs in the game.

The problem is we have too many young players in the squad, which has been acknowledged by the club.
7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
Marto
imanixsupporter
Our team is just quite low on quality I think. There is a lot of unjustified optimism about our youngsters. We have two players who we know would make it into a starting XI of most top 6 A-League sides in Rufer and Payne. Jury still out on Eze but nobody else in our entire squad is good enough and that isn't even debatable. 

Edit: maybe Armiento could too, I don't know, but harsh to judge him when I havent ever really watched him 

I think if most of our youngsters were at British clubs (L1 & 2), they would have been let go by now.

Who cares. They are at a Kiwi Club, and if the above is true thank fudge they ain't in the UK. The consistent trend is that most of the ex Weenix kids need 2-4 full seasons in the ALM before the better ones star.

By your above rationale Ben Old would have been thrown on the UK football pyramid scrap heap before having his breakout season. None of the current Nix youngsters have yet been around the first team as much as he was before leaving for Gaul.
7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
Yeh, different model. 

I remember our primary school struggling to get 11 soccer players for a team in NZ versus what a friend told me about in Liverpool where 300 6 year olds showed up! 

It’s madness in the UK that so many players give their whole young lives to football academies and only a small small percentage get professional careers. And even very successful youth players like those who won the underage World Cup with England have no guarantee of a career at EPL level. Pretty crazy.

Just to put Ben Waine’s struggles to get settled in perspective. 

https://www.fifa.com/en/tournaments/mens/u17worldcup/indonesia-2023/articles/englands-2017-u17-world-cup-champions-where-are-they-now




7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
I see most have decent football careers, those in the lower top divisions would be on a reasonable living.

This “conversion rate” is excellent when comparing it with (an example I have witnessed here in NZ) local basketball. My son went through all the rep age groups for basketball and participated in numerous camps etc. we saw some fantastic young players in our travels but the conersion rate was very low. Looking at some old team photos, at rep under 12 level (12 players in the squad) there are 3/12 that went on to anything. 1 is a current NBL player and 2 others (including my boy) went to the US to play college basketball. Only the NBL player gets paid (probably) but not enough  to not have another job.

With football academies, you’d expect better rates, more so in the UK where there are plenty of places to play pro. In NZ, if you don’t make the Nix or AFC, then thats usually it.

A lot different to my day where there were a host of 16/17 year olds off to the UK to stay with relatives and hawk themselves to various football clubs, attending trials, knocking on doors etc. I would of done the same but at the age of 17 I got a decent job and career that I stayed 23 years in, so stayed home. Today youngsters can join local academies and attempt what is now an established pro pathway, logistically easier if it turns to custard for you.
martinb
Yeh, different model. 

I remember our primary school struggling to get 11 soccer players for a team in NZ versus what a friend told me about in Liverpool where 300 6 year olds showed up! 

It’s madness in the UK that so many players give their whole young lives to football academies and only a small small percentage get professional careers. And even very successful youth players like those who won the underage World Cup with England have no guarantee of a career at EPL level. Pretty crazy.

Just to put Ben Waine’s struggles to get settled in perspective. 

https://www.fifa.com/en/tournaments/mens/u17worldcup/indonesia-2023/articles/englands-2017-u17-world-cup-champions-where-are-they-now


7 months ago
Interesting conversation, I can’t speak on behalf of NZ or the UK but in Argentina where I’m from, its hard.  For most young children born in poverty, a football career is the only possible way out. So, the same boy who probably doesn’t want to spend half an hour doing his school homework would spend hours playing with friends, on a public park or a bare piece of flat land, hoping that one day a team scout would see him play and decide he’s worth a trial.

Teams hold open trials for kids of different ages, so they can just show up there. I attended one once, and it was fascinating. It was for a team currently in the second division and in complete disarray, so we’re not talking a top notch opportunity. Some kids went with their parents, who were rooting from the sides, but some were alone, having walked or rode a bus to the place. In any case, the sieve was brutal, and most were told to go back home within half an hour. I left after a couple hours when maybe 10% of them remained, yet I know most of them were still going to be rejected.

From a historical perspective, of course there are many poor countries which don’t even come close to Argentina in football. Thing is, the sport caught on in the middle 19th century and had no rival for a long time, so pretty much every youngster turned an amateur player. Some modest success was achieved, and as some teams became competitive with the European top dogs, it took near exclusive status, same with Brazil and Uruguay.

The cut throat approach is critical, though not nice in the least. My nephew played in a children’s league of sorts when he was 7 or 8. Unlike NZ, Australia or even USA which view of children sports as fun for all, the Argentinian view of football is “only the best guys play”. So my nephew (who was no star) spent long minutes in the bench, only coming in when the game was either easily won or hopelessly lost… yes, that made him and me feel like shark. But I admit that’s the attitude that leads to better player quality overall. For those who travelled to South America, you would have noticed there were kids playing in the streets or in dirt everywhere, playing with rolled up socks or balls that are falling apart.. 


7 months ago
I don't agree with the setiment it leads to better players... it makes the assumption that players don't improve at different rates. Lots of potential stars would be lost to the game in that situation.

Can't recall the study, but it's an American one that showed something like 2/3rds of proffesional athletes were born in the the first 3 months of the year. Why?

Basically it came to the difference in size often between a 10 yr old born in Jan vs a 10 yr old born in Dec. Bigger kids naturally dominate smaller kids, and so they got picked up, they got the extra training and over time grew into better players... but were they always destined to be good, no. But they got the opportunity.

Been big and quick at 10 years of age, doesn't translate to being big and fast at 20.

My kids a good example... he's small, and slow as fudge (runs flat footed) but technically he is arguably the best in his squad and understands the game better(plays for the local academy - not that always means anything). Because of the latter, he competes well, but can struggle especially against bigger kids who just mow up the ground. Thus their influence is bigger on the game currently than his.

If we did have rep sides again in our area, he potentially would miss out or sit on the bench which would stiffle his progress.

I hope we have truely moved on from this (but fair we lack 'aware' coaches), as I experienced the above when playing and it still irks me today. Trailled for Waikato football, our team won 5 - 2, I scored 4 goals and set up the 5th. Didn't make the team. Was told I was too small to compete. I was at highschool at the time.
7 months ago
coochiee
Marto
imanixsupporter
Our team is just quite low on quality I think. There is a lot of unjustified optimism about our youngsters. We have two players who we know would make it into a starting XI of most top 6 A-League sides in Rufer and Payne. Jury still out on Eze but nobody else in our entire squad is good enough and that isn't even debatable. 

Edit: maybe Armiento could too, I don't know, but harsh to judge him when I havent ever really watched him 

I think if most of our youngsters were at British clubs (L1 & 2), they would have been let go by now.

Who cares. They are at a Kiwi Club, and if the above is true thank fudge they ain't in the UK. The consistent trend is that most of the ex Weenix kids need 2-4 full seasons in the ALM before the better ones star.

By your above rationale Ben Old would have been thrown on the UK football pyramid scrap heap before having his breakout season. None of the current Nix youngsters have yet been around the first team as much as he was before leaving for Gaul.

But their lies the rub. All the players that have been on sold for decent money went through the entire u20 cycle in the Reserves and while they may have trained with the 1st team from time to time they only signed pro deals in the last year of cycle. This in in stark contrast to the approach taken by the current manager (aided and abetted by the Director of Football) who has identified kids who have hardly played any CL football and expected them to be competitive at A League level. Bottom line is that most of the younger players will be out of contract before there are any approaches for them...LBS perhaps being the only exception imo. 
7 months ago
Filming into the light, zoomed out. Also, my pet hate, reaction shots (coaches, crowd) while the ball is in play 😡
LG
You know what was the worst thing to watch?? That sharkty TV camera coverage. It was like watching a game through reversed binoculars. If it wasn't for a Nix fan standing behind the goal and filming it, I'd never have seen how it went in. 2 Sharkty cameras and not one was really showing a closer to the action type of picture.
7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
@Napier lots of good points and stories that deserve to be told! 
@Metalleg it seems there’s a similar birth month lottery in academies. 

With that squad- that’s England’s creme of the cream. Of that squad that won the WC at under 17 some are stars and some are Championship bench, league one and so on. 

I’d guess football is a bit more within our culture-we’ve got a lot more relatives on the football pyramid in the UK, than in basketball in the US. 

It’s kind of unfair to look at a 100 year old professional system v an amateur system. If your home country is an amateur system, any money you make from the game is above expectation. 

Just did a quick google. There’s a variety of figures. Only 10% of academy products play significant amounts of football at any of the 4 levels (more than 20 games). Only 4% (or less in some studies) any tier one football. 

My general point was there is simply a large number of players, so lots more of them get cut. No greater conclusion than that. 
My secondary point was even from that mountain of youth talent, a very successful youth career or a youth contract at a big club doesn’t seem to make it likely that you’ll end up in a top league. 


7 months ago
Footballtragic
coochiee
Marto
imanixsupporter
Our team is just quite low on quality I think. There is a lot of unjustified optimism about our youngsters. We have two players who we know would make it into a starting XI of most top 6 A-League sides in Rufer and Payne. Jury still out on Eze but nobody else in our entire squad is good enough and that isn't even debatable. 

Edit: maybe Armiento could too, I don't know, but harsh to judge him when I havent ever really watched him 

I think if most of our youngsters were at British clubs (L1 & 2), they would have been let go by now.

Who cares. They are at a Kiwi Club, and if the above is true thank fudge they ain't in the UK. The consistent trend is that most of the ex Weenix kids need 2-4 full seasons in the ALM before the better ones star.

By your above rationale Ben Old would have been thrown on the UK football pyramid scrap heap before having his breakout season. None of the current Nix youngsters have yet been around the first team as much as he was before leaving for Gaul.

But their lies the rub. All the players that have been on sold for decent money went through the entire u20 cycle in the Reserves and while they may have trained with the 1st team from time to time they only signed pro deals in the last year of cycle. This in in stark contrast to the approach taken by the current manager (aided and abetted by the Director of Football) who has identified kids who have hardly played any CL football and expected them to be competitive at A League level. Bottom line is that most of the younger players will be out of contract before there are any approaches for them...LBS perhaps being the only exception imo. 

It's all a bit of crystal gazing guess work, but I disagree with your last comment.

I's say very high chance Hughes & Sheridan will be sold for a fee.
Good chances with LBS, GSR & LKH.
The others toss of a coin.

The list below is a few months old, so may have been some contract extensions I have missed.

Contract expiries
Expires 2025/26
Luke Supyk
Finn Roa Conchie

Expires 2026/27
Corban Piper
Luke Brooke-Smith
Alby Kelly-Heald
Lukas Kelly-Heald
Xuan Loke
Gabriel Sloane-Rodrigues
Jayden Smith

Expires 2027/28
Isaac Hughes
Matt Sheridan
Nathan Walker
7 months ago
Of the people who’ve watched Supyk at age group, what’s his game? He needs to be chasing counter attacks behind a defense? Or he also is a bit of a poacher? 


7 months ago
coochiee
Footballtragic
coochiee
Marto
imanixsupporter
Our team is just quite low on quality I think. There is a lot of unjustified optimism about our youngsters. We have two players who we know would make it into a starting XI of most top 6 A-League sides in Rufer and Payne. Jury still out on Eze but nobody else in our entire squad is good enough and that isn't even debatable. 

Edit: maybe Armiento could too, I don't know, but harsh to judge him when I havent ever really watched him 

I think if most of our youngsters were at British clubs (L1 & 2), they would have been let go by now.

Who cares. They are at a Kiwi Club, and if the above is true thank fudge they ain't in the UK. The consistent trend is that most of the ex Weenix kids need 2-4 full seasons in the ALM before the better ones star.

By your above rationale Ben Old would have been thrown on the UK football pyramid scrap heap before having his breakout season. None of the current Nix youngsters have yet been around the first team as much as he was before leaving for Gaul.

But their lies the rub. All the players that have been on sold for decent money went through the entire u20 cycle in the Reserves and while they may have trained with the 1st team from time to time they only signed pro deals in the last year of cycle. This in in stark contrast to the approach taken by the current manager (aided and abetted by the Director of Football) who has identified kids who have hardly played any CL football and expected them to be competitive at A League level. Bottom line is that most of the younger players will be out of contract before there are any approaches for them...LBS perhaps being the only exception imo. 

It's all a bit of crystal gazing guess work, but I disagree with your last comment.

I's say very high chance Hughes & Sheridan will be sold for a fee.
Good chances with LBS, GSR & LKH.
The others toss of a coin.

The list below is a few months old, so may have been some contract extensions I have missed.

Contract expiries
Expires 2025/26
Luke Supyk
Finn Roa Conchie

Expires 2026/27
Corban Piper
Luke Brooke-Smith
Alby Kelly-Heald
Lukas Kelly-Heald
Xuan Loke
Gabriel Sloane-Rodrigues
Jayden Smith

Expires 2027/28
Isaac Hughes
Matt Sheridan
Nathan Walker

Apologies did not explain myself clearly. Was not referring to Hughes, Sheridan and Conchie who followed the same pathway as previous years i.e. went pro towards the end of their last year of their u20/Reserves cycle and all had 2/3 years minimum of C/NL football and were dominant at that level. For anyone to come in for them they need to be getting regular A League minutes and dominating and as mentioned except for LBS (perhaps) cant see the others getting enough game time nor being good enough yet to stand out. Signed too soon imo.
7 months ago
the benefit of signing younger players for longer terms is two fold, firstly you get to kep their wages under control for longer, scondly when they have their break out seson the the inevitable european club comes along you can cash in!

Queenslander 3x a year.

7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
Footballtragic
coochiee
Footballtragic
coochiee
Marto
imanixsupporter
Our team is just quite low on quality I think. There is a lot of unjustified optimism about our youngsters. We have two players who we know would make it into a starting XI of most top 6 A-League sides in Rufer and Payne. Jury still out on Eze but nobody else in our entire squad is good enough and that isn't even debatable. 

Edit: maybe Armiento could too, I don't know, but harsh to judge him when I havent ever really watched him 

I think if most of our youngsters were at British clubs (L1 & 2), they would have been let go by now.

Who cares. They are at a Kiwi Club, and if the above is true thank fudge they ain't in the UK. The consistent trend is that most of the ex Weenix kids need 2-4 full seasons in the ALM before the better ones star.

By your above rationale Ben Old would have been thrown on the UK football pyramid scrap heap before having his breakout season. None of the current Nix youngsters have yet been around the first team as much as he was before leaving for Gaul.

But their lies the rub. All the players that have been on sold for decent money went through the entire u20 cycle in the Reserves and while they may have trained with the 1st team from time to time they only signed pro deals in the last year of cycle. This in in stark contrast to the approach taken by the current manager (aided and abetted by the Director of Football) who has identified kids who have hardly played any CL football and expected them to be competitive at A League level. Bottom line is that most of the younger players will be out of contract before there are any approaches for them...LBS perhaps being the only exception imo. 

It's all a bit of crystal gazing guess work, but I disagree with your last comment.

I's say very high chance Hughes & Sheridan will be sold for a fee.
Good chances with LBS, GSR & LKH.
The others toss of a coin.

The list below is a few months old, so may have been some contract extensions I have missed.

Contract expiries
Expires 2025/26
Luke Supyk
Finn Roa Conchie

Expires 2026/27
Corban Piper
Luke Brooke-Smith
Alby Kelly-Heald
Lukas Kelly-Heald
Xuan Loke
Gabriel Sloane-Rodrigues
Jayden Smith

Expires 2027/28
Isaac Hughes
Matt Sheridan
Nathan Walker

Apologies did not explain myself clearly. Was not referring to Hughes, Sheridan and Conchie who followed the same pathway as previous years i.e. went pro towards the end of their last year of their u20/Reserves cycle and all had 2/3 years minimum of C/NL football and were dominant at that level. For anyone to come in for them they need to be getting regular A League minutes and dominating and as mentioned except for LBS (perhaps) cant see the others getting enough game time nor being good enough yet to stand out. Signed too soon imo.

Okay fair enough. 

So of the current squad you are saying GSR, Loke, Walker and Jayden Smith are players who have been signed to the 1st team too early, and should have had more time first at Central/National League level? Missing out on actual game time development?

I guess time will tell. Certanly Smith is an interesting one. Seems to have played little football at all the last 12 months. Had long stretches on the bench in the ALM last season as CB cover.

All 4 of those guys (provided Walker is fit) will likely go to the U20 WC. That will be important for their development. An advantage that the Nix does have helped by it's Academy and NZ only having 2 pro clubs - they will have the biggest number of youngsters at the U20 WC compared to all the other ALM clubs. Sure a disruption to pre season but an added bonus re a large cohort of the squad being exposed to high quality opposition etc.
7 months ago
coochiee
Footballtragic
coochiee
Footballtragic
coochiee
Marto
imanixsupporter
Our team is just quite low on quality I think. There is a lot of unjustified optimism about our youngsters. We have two players who we know would make it into a starting XI of most top 6 A-League sides in Rufer and Payne. Jury still out on Eze but nobody else in our entire squad is good enough and that isn't even debatable. 

Edit: maybe Armiento could too, I don't know, but harsh to judge him when I havent ever really watched him 

I think if most of our youngsters were at British clubs (L1 & 2), they would have been let go by now.

Who cares. They are at a Kiwi Club, and if the above is true thank fudge they ain't in the UK. The consistent trend is that most of the ex Weenix kids need 2-4 full seasons in the ALM before the better ones star.

By your above rationale Ben Old would have been thrown on the UK football pyramid scrap heap before having his breakout season. None of the current Nix youngsters have yet been around the first team as much as he was before leaving for Gaul.

But their lies the rub. All the players that have been on sold for decent money went through the entire u20 cycle in the Reserves and while they may have trained with the 1st team from time to time they only signed pro deals in the last year of cycle. This in in stark contrast to the approach taken by the current manager (aided and abetted by the Director of Football) who has identified kids who have hardly played any CL football and expected them to be competitive at A League level. Bottom line is that most of the younger players will be out of contract before there are any approaches for them...LBS perhaps being the only exception imo. 

It's all a bit of crystal gazing guess work, but I disagree with your last comment.

I's say very high chance Hughes & Sheridan will be sold for a fee.
Good chances with LBS, GSR & LKH.
The others toss of a coin.

The list below is a few months old, so may have been some contract extensions I have missed.

Contract expiries
Expires 2025/26
Luke Supyk
Finn Roa Conchie

Expires 2026/27
Corban Piper
Luke Brooke-Smith
Alby Kelly-Heald
Lukas Kelly-Heald
Xuan Loke
Gabriel Sloane-Rodrigues
Jayden Smith

Expires 2027/28
Isaac Hughes
Matt Sheridan
Nathan Walker

Apologies did not explain myself clearly. Was not referring to Hughes, Sheridan and Conchie who followed the same pathway as previous years i.e. went pro towards the end of their last year of their u20/Reserves cycle and all had 2/3 years minimum of C/NL football and were dominant at that level. For anyone to come in for them they need to be getting regular A League minutes and dominating and as mentioned except for LBS (perhaps) cant see the others getting enough game time nor being good enough yet to stand out. Signed too soon imo.

Okay fair enough. 

So of the current squad you are saying GSR, Loke, Walker and Jayden Smith are players who have been signed to the 1st team too early, and should have had more time first at Central/National League level? Missing out on actual game time development?

I guess time will tell. Certanly Smith is an interesting one. Seems to have played little football at all the last 12 months. Had long stretches on the bench in the ALM last season as CB cover.

All 4 of those guys (provided Walker is fit) will likely go to the U20 WC. That will be important for their development. An advantage that the Nix does have helped by it's Academy and NZ only having 2 pro clubs - they will have the biggest number of youngsters at the U20 WC compared to all the other ALM clubs. Sure a disruption to pre season but an added bonus re a large cohort of the squad being exposed to high quality opposition etc.

Would add Supyk to the list. Was interesting that at the u19 qualifiers none of them were starters with Greeny in some positions preferring kids at the Nix but without pro deals. Does certainly point to a disconnect between the 1st Team and Reserve Team coaches. They will almost certainly go to the WC as they are pro's but reckon only LBS will be a nailed on starter. Could be wrong but don't see GSR and Smith getting much game time...but then again the two of them will also be available for the next 20's WC.
7 months ago
My 5 cents:

LBS will make the Nix decent coin

Loke, the Kelly-Healds, Hughes & Sheridan solid A League players

The rest let go.
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

7 months ago
Marto
My 5 cents:

LBS will make the Nix decent coin

Loke, the Kelly-Healds, Hughes & Sheridan solid A League players

The rest let go.
When you say the rest, who do you mean? GSR? The keeper we had for this game? Conchie?
7 months ago
I think it was Stoke that made a very low ball enquiry on Supyk last season. Unless an extension has been negotiated, he'll be a free agent next June. So if he does well at the U20WC and this season's ALM, he could well be off to a L2 type level club next year, without the Nix getting a fee.

I watched the U20s 2nd friendly in Chile a few months back, and I thought he looked decent, holding up the ball well, combining with Ukich, Putt and LBS.

But he's still to yet score a single ALM goal so who knows. He'd surely have to get a few this season to get much serious interest from up north. Does have the handy UK passport.
7 months ago
I thought he was better in this game, despite a terrible miss. Seemed to get on the ball more, made a few decent runs. But I don't tate him as our back up striker currently.
7 months ago
Looks like we might miss WSW and play Heidelberg.. Not like they're going to be an easy team though. They smashed Nunawading and are currently tied 1st in NPL Vic.
7 months ago
imanixsupporter
Would be nice to KO Kosta

Heidelberg have done that comfortably before we had the chance.
7 months ago · edited 7 months ago · History
wilbaker
Looks like we might miss WSW and play Heidelberg.. Not like they're going to be an easy team though. They smashed Nunawading and are currently tied 1st in NPL Vic.
Arguably a worse outcome... Heidelberg would have to be one of the best teams right now outside the A-League.

We'll also need a new kit for this one 😆
Adelaide's resident Nix supporter
7 months ago
Foolish if you have no one better available or you can afford to buy one. 
Marto
My 5 cents:

LBS will make the Nix decent coin

Loke, the Kelly-Healds, Hughes & Sheridan solid A League players

The rest let go.