Coaching Angst - ZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

And you have pretty much summed it up nicely in one Sir Les.

If anyone coach that aspired to be hirer up the food chain (i.e. A League) and in not NZ based knows pretty much they could name their price as high as they like if they were negotiating to be the Phoenix coach because what alternatives do the Phoenix have if they didn't have Ricki? Zero.

When you throw in that they probably are not going to throw 700k at a coach, then you come back to what they can afford and what is realistic and they pretty much wind up with Ricki cause 150K for the other NZ coaches would possibly be overpaying them to take a big step up with all due respect to their ability
Jeff Vader2011-11-16 23:19:24

Are we saying that RH is the best option - or is he the best option because he is the only option?

To be honest JD I don't know.

Objectively, there is not a better NZ based option so I think we can agree that he is the best Kiwi coach. Overseas options right now, I can't see a better option that would come in our price range, whatever that may be. That may change in 6 months time when the season ends. Then the cost of that coach goes up because the best alternative to an overseas coach is the one we have and if the Phoenix don't want him, then overseas coaches can name their price and the Phoenix will have to pay because of said lack of another option.

Or settle for someone of less calibre or unproven and hope to strike it lucky on the cheap. Then you are playing the lottery so would you be better with what you had or taking a big risk (Paul Nevin)

Thats kinda how it stacks up for me at the moment.

So, there is only one possible coach for NZ's one professional team.

Well, NZ football is more screwed than I thought.

Given the lack of funds/alternative options Ricki seems destined to stay, so maybe Welnix should focus on getting a quality assistant coach and a quality goalkeeping coach to help him out.This would be cheaper than hiring a new manager and I assume there's probably a lot more options out there for these roles.

I also think investment in an assistant coach would be beneficial. Also a pathway to become headcoach in the future.

Wonder if any of the current NZFC bosses would be suitable? Or wonder if there would be potential for them to coach teeDubs and be assistant at Nix?

Would mean splitting of jobs, but also would bring more likelihood to signing of TW players, and a better overall knowledge of the local competition

I wonder how a guy like Trani would go as head coach. Has done his time as assistant coach both in the A-League and a bit internationally. He is a smart guy and super passionate about football and has a lot of respect in the football community. I reckon he would jump at the chance of becoming a head coach.....plus he has been at the Nix and knows the club.

To think that Ricki is the only option is wrong. There are always options.

If Ricki was seriously hurt or worse tomorrow, someone else would be found. There will always be people interesting in going for that job, if it was put out there as a possibility, they would come from far and wide I bet, and someone would be quite capable.

The Nix Nine currently have limited knowledge but they will be keeping an eye out and gathering more knowledge, that is what you do when you run a business.

They have given Ricki a chance and fair enough, he was doing ok when things were running reasonably smoothly before TS went down the gurgler.

It is hard to judge how any of the current coaches in NZ would do, as they are operating in a different environment. In a reverse way of looking at it would Ricki win the NZ comp with TW say

Anyway he is there and safe for now and lets get on with it

PS thought one of Doloras's posts was negative and stoopid

A-League Coaches (excluding caretaker coaches) win % since the inaugural season, excluding this season.

Ricki has increased his win % every year since taking control of the nix - they won a higher percentage of games last season, despite not making it as far in the finals. On season-by-season form, you'd want to keep him on.

52%
Graham Arnold 50%
Pierre Littbarski 50%
Rini Coolen 46%
Ernie Merrick 45%
Ange Postecoglou 43%
Richard Money 41%
Frank Farina 41%
John Kosmina 40%
Vitezslav Lavicka 39%
Aurelio Vidmar 39%
Terry Butcher 37%
Ricki Herbert 36%
Lawrie McKinna 36%
Miron Bleiberg 33%
Gary Van Egmond 30%
Dave Mitchell 30%
Branko Culina 25%
John van't Schip 24%
Ron Smith 22%
Ian Ferguson 13%
Fran Straka

That's "Doloras". Dolares is what Manuel Espinoza is paid.

Oh definitely not the only option in NZ but I don't think there are 'better' options. You could give the gig to Milicich, Emblen, Ramon, Stu, Sova, Bono (and anyone else) but would they be better than Ricki? I don't think they would be at this point in time.

I wonder what Ernie Merrick is up to these days.....2 titles and 46% win ratio and he gets sacked by the Victory

Funny how Franz Straka only had a 13% win ratio, but everyone rating him as a good coach.

paullt2011-11-17 12:56:03

But he had probably the worst squad in A League history to deal with. Compare that to Ferguson and van't Schip who both have underperformed with the squads at their disposal.

Can we get the title of this thread changed from "Hire Rob" to "Hire ???"

Guus Hiddink?

It's fine as it is, just needs one more B at the end

If someone already said this 3 pages back, apologies.I couldn't be bothered going back any more than 2 sorry.

I think this is actually a smart move from the owners to retain Ricki and not the negative some are painting it as. In fact, I'd even go as far as say its also an obvious one.
Instead of focusing purely on the coaches role with the Phoenix look at the strategy that's unfolding.
Ricki coaches the All Whites, and has strong involvement in U20 and Olympics squads with some  potential benefits..continuity of coaching structures, identifying and nurturing key talent earlier etc, all with a view to a consolidated All White squad to succeed in qualifying for WC2014.
The WellNix 8/9 owners have a stated aim of establishing a Nix Academy and nurturing Kiwi talent for the Nix. To risk losing Ricki's input in the Nix Academy's establishment while they exercised some dubious due process, given his authority, influence and connections in the NZ Football structure and the general Football community would be stupid.
They have allowed for an orderly introduction of a new coach transitioning pre-WC,  thus allowing for a fresh coaching approach to the Nix, coinciding with a likely transition of many of Ricki's older key players out, and retained Ricki's expertise and influence within the Nix organisation for a wider role as potential Director of Football as they grow the Academy.
I'll be interested to see whether any other key coaching appointments are made in the Nix soon, or whether Greenacre is being groomed to step up within the Nix structure, or whether they look further afield for fresh input.
RedGed2011-11-19 21:37:31

Another rubbish performance tonight. Lets also not forget that for all those who say "oh its the players" that it was Ricki who brought in ALL of them.

A number of them are simplay no longer good enough and Ricki doesn't seem to see it.

Can't say I've seen ricki have a chat to messi and say sorry son I'd rather have daniel! What sort of talent do you think ricki has to choose from? Have a look at the squad ffs we are on the bare bones!

The Rome wasn't built in one night. Ricki had several years to build his team. I know he experienced financial uncertainty, but look who is playing. DBB (Daniel, Bertos, Brown etc.).

In addition, over the last few years  RH watched so many ASB games and how many talents he identified?

NIL.

I am not saying sack Ricki, what I am saying is: he has his weaknesses and he needs a very good assistant coach.

Yeah, the bare bones that he's now said several times that he is happy with! He can't have it all ways. The squad isn't even good enough if everyone was fit.

Some aren't up to it any more i agree, we lack pace down the left and right flanks and desperately need a striker.But to be fair to Ricki, he couldn't do much because of the situation with terry and the lack of money. plus the unlucky fact of losing Pantellis for the season, Pav breaking his arm and Iffill being injured early on too hasn't helped the cause.That said some of our play on the field has been rather rubbish at times.

Our aging squad of journeymen needs a good clean out - my biggest worry is Herbert doesn't have what it takes to;

Watching the game I thought of that famous saying

yeah, I find it interesting that we are known as the team who gets the most crosses into the box, yet we have a forward line least suited to crosses into the box.

it is unlucky that we have had injuries to pantelis and ifil, but it is a bit sad that injuries to two players means we are without any creativity.

we desperately need ifill and sanchez fit to provide that bit of quality in the attacking third

our defensive organisation and ball-winning ability, including in midfield, has been excellent all season

shouldn't need much to turn these games into better results

Bit of a hatchet job from Danny Hay but one good point I thought he raised - what actually is our plan when we get the ball? Like others have said other than stick it out wide and hope someone beats a man one-on-one what are we told to do?

In 2 off seasons we haven't added a player that now starts regularly other than Sanchez. Ricky has to take responsibility for that, if not for this year then for last.

It is much more likely that the players will be replaced before the coach is replaced, unless we are encouraging Welnix to go full Nathan Tinkler.

TBF noone really knows what outclauses (from either side) there are in Ricki's contract.

It's called humour.

 

Paston frustrated at playing second fiddle

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/soccer-football/news/article.cfm?c_id=86&objectid=10768683

Bring back Pasty

While he said his alliance with coach Ricki Herbert isn't strained, either, the wildcard in this situation is Paston's contract. His current deal runs out at the end of this season and Herbert would be remiss to let the 34-year-old leave the club, considering Warner is the only other 'keeper on the Phoenix's books.

"That's something I've got to work through in the next few weeks and months,'' Paston said. "There are a couple of options on the table and, when the time's right, I'll make that decision.''

Bringing some of last week's discussion from the Billy Harris Thread to this one where it probably belongs, I'm quietly optimistic about the Nix under Ricki.
Somehow Ricki has maintained this core group of players through the last two seasons financial turmoil under Terry, and even managed last season's play-offs, albeit briefly.
Its obvious recruitment has been restricted for at least two seasons.Key management personnel still to be replaced. The lack of a fitness specialist until later in pre-season could well have contributed to poor pre-season player preparation and subsequent injuries at seasons start.
That led to more players in a depleted squad playing out of position in roles unfamiliar,more stress plus poor ref and player decisions leading to red card mania. Ricki's hardly responsible for that conundrum, or the Clayton's choice of fit or available players to choose from through recent weeks.
 It seems obvious to me the lack of funds has hamstrung the Nix across the board, yet despite that they are still in with a chance.
The next few weeks are important, key players returning to the fold from injury...another pivotal encounter like season 3's  GCU at the RoF would be great about now.
Longer term, Ricki's got security of tenure to rely on with his new agreement and there's provision for new blood to coach,plus an academy and who knows what else in the WP Organisation. 

The new owners have kept the Nix ship on an even keel (and floating,AND moving forward even) while they sort through the business workings and cover the costs. Their relative hands-off approach up till now seems a prudent step,lets see how things shape up after the New Year break.