Wellington Phoenix Men

Welkom Roly! - Never to be an All White

254 replies · 31,990 views
about 11 years ago

RoriM6 wrote:

Forgive my ignorance but why can he not be an all white? I know he played youth for another nation but so did winston. Does it have something to do with where they are born?

Winston was able to play for us and Denmark because he had dual nationality already when he first played for them.  

Roly only had (has) Dutch citizenship when he played for the Dutch youth sides so can never play for anyone else.  

Lia is in the same position, has kiwi citizenship (I think) but will never play for the AWs due to playing youth football for Aussie whereas Durante never played for Aussie at youth level.

Where the rule gets silly is where a player has never played a youth international for anyone but can play in friendlies for one country then transfer to another at full senior level (read Michael Fitzgerald).

Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

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about 11 years ago

Cant you make a one time switch in that situation or something? 
I could be getting my sports mixed up...

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about 11 years ago

If you've played youth football for one country, you can switch as you were eligible for a different country at the time you played you played those youth games.

Thus when Roly played for Dutch, he wasn't eligible for the All Whites. Ineligble. 

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about 11 years ago

paulm wrote:

Cant you make a one time switch in that situation or something? 
I could be getting my sports mixed up...

Technically you can. If you played non-competitive senior games for one country, you can switch. See Diego Costa.

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about 11 years ago
Blatter got votes from NZ Footy, what about some extra cash? I'm joking. As I said, we should enjoy while it lasts.
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about 11 years ago · edited about 11 years ago · History

I don't see this naturalising Roly working.

a) He's played for the Netherlands in FIFA competitive matches at youth level so can't play for the All Whites as he wasn't eligible at the time he played for them so why would he be granted early citizenship?

b) He's Dutch and you can't hold dual citizenship if you have a Dutch passport so he'd have to give up his Dutch passport. 




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about 11 years ago

Wibblebutt wrote:

I don't see this naturalising Roly working.

a) He's played for the Netherlands in FIFA competitive matches at youth level so can't play for the All Whites as he wasn't eligible at the time he played for them so why would he be granted early citizenship?

b) He's Dutch and you can't hold dual citizenship if you have a Dutch passport so he'd have to give up his Dutch passport. 

does he need to be a citizen to be a local player? guess so. but that would make it difficult.  my dutch mate had the same problem (not a football star though)

Calling all fans in Japan, come down and support the mighty nix in Osaka

http://www.facebook.com/WellingtonPhoenixClubMembersSupportersGroupOsaka

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about 11 years ago

Isn't it permanent residency rather than citizenship?

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about 11 years ago · edited about 11 years ago · History

Has to be a citizen. PR doesn't class you as a local player.




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about 11 years ago

Ahh yes quite right.

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about 11 years ago

Wibblebutt wrote:

Has to be a citizen. PR doesn't class you as a local player.

This will take about 5 years.

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about 11 years ago

All this Roly discussion has got me thinking. If Ernie was to play our favourite Dutchie on the right the nobody would be able to get around him without hugging the sideline.

Thoughts?

"Ive just re-visited this and once again realised that C-Diddy is a genius - a drunk, Newcastle bred disgrace - but a genius." - Hard News, 11:39am 4th June 2009

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about 11 years ago

When will he qualify to play for the all whites :-)

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about 11 years ago

C-Diddy wrote:

All this Roly discussion has got me thinking. If Ernie was to play our favourite Dutchie on the right the nobody would be able to get around him without hugging the sideline.

Thoughts?

His generation rules the nation.

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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about 11 years ago

"Pass to Roly on the right hand side"

You know we belong together...

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about 11 years ago

Oska wrote:

"Pass to Roly on the right hand side"

Clearly a new chant is born!

Actually, getting outplayed quite a bit these days

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about 11 years ago

Yep, a Rasta flavour chant.

Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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about 11 years ago

He probably hasn't given up on representing their senior side just yet.

Wont happen and I'd be surprised if he is here next year.

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about 11 years ago · edited about 11 years ago · History

asmodeus_82 wrote:

Doloras wrote:

Feverish wrote:

2ndBest wrote:

No he can't. Has played for Dutch youth sides.

Really? How did we get this guy?!

It's still quite depressing that we can't believe that anyone who plays for us can be at all decent. :-/

To be fair in this instance we were pretty lucky to sign him. He could easily be playing somewhere Europe. I think its more stunning that he is in this league at all rather than with us.

Things never really panned out for him in Holland. He certainly never was a name player there.

He never got the breaks  - the coach who rated him at Ajax as a teenager, Martin Jol, resigned soon after giving Roly his one and only Ajax appearance in the Eredivisie (and one Cup appearance) and new manger Frank de Boer didn't rate him.

He was then sent out on loan to smaller Eredivisie clubs NAC and Roda for two seasons before signing permanently for Ivan Vicelich's old club Roda for the 2013-14 season.

Roda then got relegated and he was able to use an out clause in his contract to leave and sign for Wellington.

Lots of players have played for Dutch youth teams and never gone on to big careers. Examples include Reza the current Iran international (Dutch born and several Dutch youth caps) who is on the books of my mum's club Charlton Athletic but didn't make it there and is on loan in Kuwait, and Osama Rashid a Dutch Iraqi who has 28 Dutch u-17, u-19 and u-20 caps up until last year (much more capped than Roly and a mainstay of Dutch youth sides for the last six years)  and was on the books of Feyenoord but now plays in the fourth tier of Dutch football for Alphense Boys (although he's in Iraq's squad for the Asian Cup).

It seems strange, but Holland's national youth sides have never been very successful - their u-17's have only qualified for three FIFA u-17 World Cups (knocked out in the group stages twice) and four FIFA u-20 World Cups (not since 2005).

They failed to make the UEFA u-19 Finals in Hungary last year to determine the qualifiers for FIFA u-20 World Cup NZ 2015 - they finished beneath Georgia and Wales in their qualifying group!

Holland have only qualified for two of the last ten UEFA u-19 Finals tournaments.

Big Pete 65, Christchurch

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about 11 years ago

http://www.vi.nl/premium/roly-bonevacia-genieten-b...

Piece on Roly

I cant copy and paste the translation for some reason, but the point of note is:

"You can call us the maverick of the A-league. Opponents say it obviously never fun to come and play with us. Especially because- unlike previous years- enough to get noticed on Wellington Phoenix. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy went to play football."
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about 11 years ago

maynardf wrote:

http://www.vi.nl/premium/roly-bonevacia-genieten-b...

Piece on Roly

I cant copy and paste the translation for some reason, but the point of note is:

"You can call us the maverick of the A-league. Opponents say it obviously never fun to come and play with us. Especially because- unlike previous years- enough to get noticed on Wellington Phoenix. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy went to play football."

Playing up the pitch and knocking in goals and creating assists doesn't hurt either!

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about 11 years ago

Being very much apprecizted would also be good for his morale. He knows that fans have taken him to heart. It is nice to be wanted in that respect.

Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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about 11 years ago

maynardf wrote:

http://www.vi.nl/premium/roly-bonevacia-genieten-b...

Piece on Roly

I cant copy and paste the translation for some reason, but the point of note is:

"You can call us the maverick of the A-league. Opponents say it obviously never fun to come and play with us. Especially because- unlike previous years- enough to get noticed on Wellington Phoenix. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy went to play football."

It's just the first paragraph you can view of a subscriber-only article - hence not possible to copy and paste.

Here are the first two paras:

From relegation with Roda JC to play for the national title in Australia.The transfer of Roly Bonevacia (23) to Wellington Phoenix has worked out well. Just a little more than halfway through the season, his club ranks second in the A-League. For the midfielder, his adventure with the club from the New Zealand capital is like playing European Cup football."For every away game it's at least three hours flying," says Bonevacia."And then you have good luck if you play in Melbourne or Sydney. I have also experienced Perth away. Horrible! Nine hours it took us. Although business-class, but just in a scheduled flight... At Roda JC I found the bus trips long, but in retrospect it was not too bad ... "

The Ajax-trained Bonevacia - he played in the 2010/11 season one game for Ajax - signed a two year contract last summer at The Nix."That Wellington participate in the A-League, for me was a binding condition. Because the level of competition in New Zealand is pretty mediocre. The Australian teams play football very direct, offensive, far ahead. Similar to the Championship in England. You can call us the maverick of the A-League. Opponents say it is obviously never fun to come and play against us. Especially because - unlike previous seasons - Wellington Phoenix are having a stand-out year. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy had playing football. "

Big Pete 65, Christchurch

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about 11 years ago

Big Pete 65 wrote:

maynardf wrote:

http://www.vi.nl/premium/roly-bonevacia-genieten-b...

Piece on Roly

I cant copy and paste the translation for some reason, but the point of note is:

"You can call us the maverick of the A-league. Opponents say it obviously never fun to come and play with us. Especially because- unlike previous years- enough to get noticed on Wellington Phoenix. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy went to play football."

It's just the first paragraph you can view of a subscriber-only article - hence not possible to copy and paste.

Here are the first two paras:

From relegation with Roda JC to play for the national title in Australia.The transfer of Roly Bonevacia (23) to Wellington Phoenix has worked out well. Just a little more than halfway through the season, his club ranks second in the A-League. For the midfielder, his adventure with the club from the New Zealand capital is like playing European Cup football."For every away game it's at least three hours flying," says Bonevacia."And then you have good luck if you play in Melbourne or Sydney. I have also experienced Perth away. Horrible! Nine hours it took us. Although business-class, but just in a scheduled flight... At Roda JC I found the bus trips long, but in retrospect it was not too bad ... "

The Ajax-trained Bonevacia - he played in the 2010/11 season one game for Ajax - signed a two year contract last summer at The Nix."That Wellington participate in the A-League, for me was a binding condition. Because the level of competition in New Zealand is pretty mediocre. The Australian teams play football very direct, offensive, far ahead. Similar to the Championship in England. You can call us the maverick of the A-League. Opponents say it is obviously never fun to come and play against us. Especially because - unlike previous seasons - Wellington Phoenix are having a stand-out year. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy had playing football. "

That can only be good for us!

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about 11 years ago

Big Pete 65 wrote:

maynardf wrote:

http://www.vi.nl/premium/roly-bonevacia-genieten-b...

Piece on Roly

I cant copy and paste the translation for some reason, but the point of note is:

"You can call us the maverick of the A-league. Opponents say it obviously never fun to come and play with us. Especially because- unlike previous years- enough to get noticed on Wellington Phoenix. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy went to play football."

It's just the first paragraph you can view of a subscriber-only article - hence not possible to copy and paste.

Here are the first two paras:

From relegation with Roda JC to play for the national title in Australia.The transfer of Roly Bonevacia (23) to Wellington Phoenix has worked out well. Just a little more than halfway through the season, his club ranks second in the A-League. For the midfielder, his adventure with the club from the New Zealand capital is like playing European Cup football."For every away game it's at least three hours flying," says Bonevacia."And then you have good luck if you play in Melbourne or Sydney. I have also experienced Perth away. Horrible! Nine hours it took us. Although business-class, but just in a scheduled flight... At Roda JC I found the bus trips long, but in retrospect it was not too bad ... "

The Ajax-trained Bonevacia - he played in the 2010/11 season one game for Ajax - signed a two year contract last summer at The Nix."That Wellington participate in the A-League, for me was a binding condition. Because the level of competition in New Zealand is pretty mediocre. The Australian teams play football very direct, offensive, far ahead. Similar to the Championship in England. You can call us the maverick of the A-League. Opponents say it is obviously never fun to come and play against us. Especially because - unlike previous seasons - Wellington Phoenix are having a stand-out year. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy had playing football. "

I "heart" Roly

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about 11 years ago

Big Pete 65 wrote:

maynardf wrote:

http://www.vi.nl/premium/roly-bonevacia-genieten-b...

Piece on Roly

I cant copy and paste the translation for some reason, but the point of note is:

"You can call us the maverick of the A-league. Opponents say it obviously never fun to come and play with us. Especially because- unlike previous years- enough to get noticed on Wellington Phoenix. And I must say that, after a difficult year at Roda JC, I found it fun. The pleasure which I as a little boy went to play football."

"That Wellington participate in the A-League, for me was a binding condition. Because the level of competition in New Zealand is pretty mediocre.

I blame Auckland

"Ive just re-visited this and once again realised that C-Diddy is a genius - a drunk, Newcastle bred disgrace - but a genius." - Hard News, 11:39am 4th June 2009

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about 11 years ago · edited about 11 years ago · History

FourFourTwo Article on our man ROLY

With his football dream fading in Holland former Ajax midfielder Roly Bonevacia has found that the land of the long white cloud has reignited his football career, proving that the A- League can provide opportunities for youthful footballers on the continent.

Bonevacia is a graduate of the Ajax’s youth academy and he spent 12 years playing for the club from the age of 10.

The former Dutch international youth player is revelling in his new surroundings at Wellington Phoenix and is a major part of why the club has surged into the top four of the A-League.

“I felt like Dutch clubs/people took me for granted.” said Bonevacia about why he chose to move to the Phoenix.

“I didn't play as much games as I wanted to. I needed to play more and feel important. Ernie Merrick convinced me that was exactly what I was going to be doing in New Zealand.

“Coming to Wellington and finding myself back here is the best feeling ever. I'm having fun again, I feel appreciated and needed.

“I wake up to the most amazing view every morning and the people are really kind.”

Bonevacia didn’t know much about the A-League before he arrived in Wellington, citing a snobbish attitude in Holland that’s aimed towards the Australian competition.

“I watched some games but I didn't know much about the A-League,” he said.

“I wanted to go to Wellington open minded and see for myself what the league and the team was like and make it my own.

“Europeans are very 'critical' about the A-League. They don't believe it has much potential for young European players but I want to prove them wrong.

“If there's anything to improve at all (about the A-League), it will be small changes such as facility improvement and training ground expansion.”

Bonevacia made 57 senior appearances in the Eredivisie for teams like Ajax, NAC Breda and Roda JC, and with the A-League season past its midway point the 23-year-old says the standard of both leagues are closer than critics in Europe would expect.

“The standard is higher than Dutch/European people think,” he said.

“I'm 100 per cent sure our team would make the top (at least the sub top) in the Dutch Eredivisie. I think it's a great platform for young players to show their quality and to develop.

“You travel a lot in the A-League, we're not used to that in Holland. I used to complain if we had a three-hour bus drive, looking back I should have been relieved it was only three hours.

“Except for the temperature, the A-League and Dutch first league look very much alike. Good quality players, much ground play. But I think it's even more similar to the English league because of the high intensity of play.”

Fourth-placed Wellington Phoenix are on 28 points, the same amount they finished on last A-League season.

Bonevacia points out that the new players that have come in have been a big part of this season’s turnaround.

“The Phoenix already had some good players but they were missing key players to make the difference,” he said.

“Now our team is complete, we understand each other and that results into good performances, the team really connects, we work well together as a team instead of individuals.

“I feel like I have grown a lot as a player and developed another style of playing without losing my personal touch.”

Bonevacia feels that the Phoenix have already achieved success by proving many of their critics wrong and that the team deserves recognition for their positive results.

“At the start of the season the Australian teams did not treat us with much respect,” he said.

“They probably thought we weren't worthy playing in 'their' league, I guess that has changed now.

"Our goal for the season was top six, but I think our new goal is to stay in the top four and see how far we can get.

“For me, my team already won by showing the A-League what we're worth! No matter where you play you will always have certain people who think you don't belong there.

“The Phoenix has just as much potential as all the other teams in our league and we knew that from the start. We just had to make some changes.”

Bonevacia says those changes were instigated by Wellington Phoenix head coach Ernie Merrick.

“He (Merrick) finished the puzzle by adding new players and putting them on the right spots. I really like his style, he loves to play attacking football and ground play," he said.

“Ernie Merrick believed in me and I don’t want to let him down.”

Born and raised in the Netherlands to parents from Curaçao - part of The Netherlands Antilles in the Caribbean - Bonevacia made his senior debut for Ajax in the 2010-2011 season but only made one league appearance before he moved to NAC Breda.

Bonevacia played for the yellow army for a season and then spent the next two years at Roda JC before making the move to Wellington Phoenix

“They have taught me everything I needed to know,” said Bonevacia about his time with Ajax.

“They turned me into a technical player, able to fit in any kind of team and playing style. My Ajax debut with Martin Jol was a dream come true.

“It was a difficult time when that dream started falling apart. Everything changed, I was lost and underrated but now I found myself back.

“I played amongst big players such as (Luis) Suarez, (Miralem) Sulejmani, (Vurnon) Anita, (Nigel) De Jong and (Daley) Blind - just to name a few.

“It's great to play amongst high-quality players but I've learned to demand the highest out of my own performance in order to take my team to the next level instead of leaning on others.”

During his time in Holland, Bonevacia also played for the Dutch international under-17s and under-19s youth teams.

“It was fantastic, I was very honoured to be selected,” said Bonevacia.

“I’m still in touch with my former u17/u19 and Ajax team-mate Ricardo van Rhijn who is now a Dutch international.”

Con Stamocostas is an Australian football writer. Check out Episode Five of his latest Football Snobcast: The Asian Cup Experience with co-host Rob Toddler.


Read more at http://www.fourfourtwo.com/au/news/bonevacia-lovi...

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about 11 years ago · edited about 11 years ago · History

“If there's anything to improve at all (about the A-League), it will be small changes such as facility improvement and training ground expansion.”


I curse you Marco.  A thousand curses.

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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about 11 years ago

Implies he's eligable, no more.

A fan is a fan.

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about 11 years ago

That's a pretty reasonable Curaçao squad. 

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about 11 years ago

Ernie spraying the shark around.

A fan is a fan.

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about 11 years ago · edited about 11 years ago · History

Daniel Richardson wrote:
Committing to a national side is a big choice and Bonevacia said he had given consideration to living in New Zealand for five years to possibly become eligible for the All Whites. It's unlikely he would ever force his way in to the Dutch senior side.


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about 11 years ago

Jtoml3 wrote:

That's a pretty reasonable Curaçao squad. 

Big call to commit to a side 160 in the world and the country was "disbanded" a few years ago, whatever that means!

Normo's coming home

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about 11 years ago

Play for NZ Roly! At least you'll get reasonable internationals every 5 months instead of losing to Grenada 5-0 every 10

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about 11 years ago

Think that side would beat us


Auckland will rise once more

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about 11 years ago · edited about 11 years ago · History

This sounds like he's definitely going to accept the Curacao offer.

As discussed earlier, he can't be an All White, so why not start playing internationally immediately?

Hopefully he won't go this month though!

It will take him at least 4 flights to get there for home games:

1 WLG-AKL

2 AKL-LAX

3 LAX- (DFW/Miami?)

4 (DFW/Miami) - Curacao 

- that's if Curacao has direct flights from the US!

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about 11 years ago

Pretty much spot on, could also go the other way if need be in case he wants to catch up with family and friends

1. WLG - AKL

2. AKL - CAN (Guangzhou)

3. CAN - AMS (terdam)

4. AMS - CUR

Either way it's a shark load of time on a plane. For some reason I think he'd favour this route too...

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