WPM FFA Cup Semi Final vs Victory | Sat 29th Jan | 7:35pm | My Football (YouTube)

martinb

Ryan

Should have put on Waine and also Old 15 mins ago. Piscipo has been quiet this half. 

 I’d forgotten about Old. Yep. Criminal to have Waine and Old on the bench as we go down without returning fire. 

When I was getting my covid jab back in Oct, the guy who did it was absolutely raving about Old - he's been proven right, for a kid in his first year as a pro he's been assertive and would have been much more pro-active than Piscipo was towards the end of the game.

2nd half we sat back and let them dictated the game. Hope that's not how we plan to play this season every time we have the lead in games.

Blame the AWs. Took Payne and Lewis and lead me not to get a ‘Fire Up’ in at the start of the thread as I took a pre-game nap. 
Didn’t get fired up enough for the game. The coverage just a loud annoying Victory fap fest, much like at C-Diddy’s house.

What a fantastic first half display from everyone, in full control of this game. An ok start to the second half but as soon as they scored the heads dropped and to be honest too much of an ask for an inexperienced team, away from home, against a team full of talent in just about every position. Overall a great effort in the cup this year. To win things we're short of 2-3 good signings. Rufer did very well tonight I thought. Back to focusing on the league now. Still hurts though but thats football 

martinb

Blame the AWs. Took Payne and Lewis and lead me not to get a ‘Fire Up’ in at the start of the thread as I took a pre-game nap. 
Didn’t get fired up enough for the game. The coverage just a loud annoying Victory fap fest, much like at C-Diddy’s house.

Neither of them are needed in UAE as many players ahead of them at CM and CD, but they were most definitely needed in Geelong today.

Also our second goal was never offside as Hooper was never involved with play.  Did not move or do anything.  No interference with play at all.  Been some bang average refereeing today against kiwi teams.

Interesting that last minute academy callups have stood up (Paulsen, Van Hattum and maybe Surman) while preseason signings AWOL at best (Bozinovski, Ott, Mogg).

Marto

Interesting that last minute academy callups have stood up (Paulsen, Old, Van Hattum) while preseason signings AWOL at best (Bozinovski, Ott, Mogg).

Of those only Van Hattum joined the team late (along with Surman and Manuel). Old was with the team last season.

Was at the game, and from my perspective this result was fair. In the first half, we took the one chance we created while you can tell they were trying to attack our wings, just couldn’t find that last pass.

Once they got their first goal, it was a matter of time before they will score again, and did so easily. 

One thing i noticed being there is how small and not physical some of our players, with the expectation of Boznokvski and rufer, all our players are small and get taken off the ball far too easily, and 2nd and 4th goal showed this

Thought all 3 of Victories goals can be placed pretty squarely at Bozza's feet unfortunately, just didn't have the sharpness to keep up with the Victory boys running at him.

Difference in the end was probably our depth, which was kinda expected given our comparative squad values & the players missing on international duty. THe game should never have been in an international window. Surman, Paulsen and Rufer I thought were very good and there's signs that the front 4 is coming together, definitely the bones of a side that can make the finals this year. Surman looks assured on the ball and knows when to step out, huge performance for an 18 year old and I'm looking forward to seeing more, I can see why Uffie rates him.

Hoping Lewis comes back in good nick because I'm not big on what I've seen of Pennington, I think Lewis does a better job of linking the midfield to the front 4 and Pennington seems to get outmuscled too frequently. Rufer has also noticeably looked to turn and play forward more which is good progress from him.

All in all, good experience for a young side. Result was expected, scoreline probably flattered Melbourne a little but all their goals were well taken so no complaints here. 

Victory had more depth, like they managed to bring on Ikonomidis and Kruse with 80 or so Socceroos caps between them and D’agostino who went to the Olympics, but Talay still had 5 substitutes to use and only used 2, and only one of those when the game wasn’t a foregone conclusion, and that one was forced and disastrous.

 Waine should’ve come on earlier, no point subbing him on at 3-1 down with 5 minutes to go, as well as possibly guys like Old or McGarry, at least to freshen some legs. Regardless of whether it was in the loan agreement or not, subbing on Bozinovski against his parent club just wasn’t the best idea, because the optics of it would be so negative if he ever did something wrong. Where’s Mogg who got a scholarship deal ahead of Surman? Likewise Ott? 

I’m not sure anyone has benefited from that loan deal, Bozinovski hasn’t played so he isn’t developing at A League level, he’s not here long term so there’s no investment incentive on the Phoenix part in terms of game time, he’s not an automatic starter which is what you want from a loanee, Victory aren’t getting back a player with more experience and he’s taking the place of what could’ve been a young NZer.

Was quite certain Pennington got caught in possession on the outside of the box a number of times last night. Think in the second half, as I remember thinking just clear it , instead providing a hospital pass back. That was probably the worst I thought he’s Played so far. Rufer was excellent last night. There were a lot of positives but in the end, quality won over ☹️ Kind of had the air of inevitability over it.

alon222

Was at the game, and from my perspective this result was fair. In the first half, we took the one chance we created while you can tell they were trying to attack our wings, just couldn’t find that last pass.

Once they got their first goal, it was a matter of time before they will score again, and did so easily. 

One thing i noticed being there is how small and not physical some of our players, with the expectation of Boznokvski and rufer, all our players are small and get taken off the ball far too easily, and 2nd and 4th goal showed this

We created more than one chance in that first chance and if we had taken a couple more of those the pressure wouldnt have been so bad in the second half. Think they always looked dangerous and our lack of depth sure showed out.

1st half was great, i really believed we had this but like always the bigger clubs just do things better and we never got out of 1st gear in the 2nd half. It was a good run though and kind a shows we are getting close to winning silverware.

carlind

Victory had more depth, like they managed to bring on Ikonomidis and Kruse with 80 or so Socceroos caps between them and D’agostino who went to the Olympics, but Talay still had 5 substitutes to use and only used 2, and only one of those when the game wasn’t a foregone conclusion, and that one was forced and disastrous.

 Waine should’ve come on earlier, no point subbing him on at 3-1 down with 5 minutes to go, as well as possibly guys like Old or McGarry, at least to freshen some legs. Regardless of whether it was in the loan agreement or not, subbing on Bozinovski against his parent club just wasn’t the best idea, because the optics of it would be so negative if he ever did something wrong. Where’s Mogg who got a scholarship deal ahead of Surman? Likewise Ott? 

I’m not sure anyone has benefited from that loan deal, Bozinovski hasn’t played so he isn’t developing at A League level, he’s not here long term so there’s no investment incentive on the Phoenix part in terms of game time, he’s not an automatic starter which is what you want from a loanee, Victory aren’t getting back a player with more experience and he’s taking the place of what could’ve been a young NZer.

When we signed Bozinovski we said we wanted to sign him properly on a multi-year and not loan him but Victory didn't want to release him. Obviously both clubs think/thought he had potential. We probably assumed he'd get more game time but, for whatever reason, he's not living up to that potential.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/a-league/127636701/wellington-phoenix-turn-attention-back-to-aleague-men-after-bowing-out-of-ffa-cup

The Phoenix play former captain Ulises Davila’s Macarthur at Campbelltown Stadium next Sunday, determined to start stringing some results together.

They will be boosted by the return of All Whites Clayton Lewis and Tim Payne from international duty, while Talay is hopeful first-choice goalkeeper Oli Sail and new signing Scott Wootton will be back from injury.

Sail got through three full training sessions last week but still needs to prove his fitness before he can play.

Alex Paulsen has performed admirably in his absence and had a major hand in their quarterfinal win over Melbourne City but Talay said there will be more opportunities for the teenage shotstopper in the future.

“If Oli is available he’ll come straight back in,” Talay said.

“After the international break we’ll get two players back and hopefully Scotty will be training with the group next week and all we need to do is focus on our [A-League Men] season.”

Just watched the replay of the game after being out of reception for the weekend. Hate to bag young players, but you can see why Bozinovski hasn't been able to get a game since arriving. Too raw and was at fault for the last two goals. I wish Uffie had put Rufer at CB and McGarry as CM. Bad move that, and it backfired. Still. What a great cup run that was. Proud to be a Nix fan. Hope we will continue to prioritise the Cup in coming season, especially since we will never be able to play on the AFC CL anyway so it's not like our season is ever going to be that long 

No doubt that on the ball Pennington had a poor game by his standards (maybe to do with a recent bout of Covid). Defensively however, I think that he was very good. The first and second goals were what lost the match. In the case of the first, the ball fell luckily towards Hooper and Brillante, Brillante was able to take the ball, thereafter, the only player to respond to the threat was Pennington. Brillante went for a quick speculative shot and got lucky. The second goal was a movement by Kruse which should never have been allowed, but again the only player responding to the threat was Pennington, he didn't get to D'agostino in time but at least he responded.

We had a goal disallowed for Hooper's position, but Hooper was not interfering with play, VAR would have over ruled that offside. They had quality fresh legs. That's what made the difference.

Thought Sotirio was offside? Really ruled off for Hooper? Two people said this now..!

martinb

Thought Sotirio was offside? Really ruled off for Hooper? Two people said this now..!

 Sotirio was pretty clearly also in an offside position, replay makes that exceedingly obvious, but I think the commentators got it wrong at the time.

Nelfoos 

I'm sorry but I'm doing this frame by frame here. There's no way that the linesman's flag went up for Sotirio. It went up for Hooper. Its not at all clear from the youtube angle that Sotirio was offside (dead in line according to me). Hooper never interfered with play, he was not in the goalkeepers line of sight when Sotirio shot. For me it's a goal.

interfering with play is fairly subjective, just being where Hoops was would have influenced the keepers reactions/decisions.

kungfu panda

Nelfoos 

I'm sorry but I'm doing this frame by frame here. There's no way that the linesman's flag went up for Sotirio. It went up for Hooper. Its not at all clear from the youtube angle that Sotirio was offside (dead in line according to me). Hooper never interfered with play, he was not in the goalkeepers line of sight when Sotirio shot. For me it's a goal.

Hooper wasn't blocking the goalies vision, I agree it can't been flagged for that and, if it had been, that would've been an error.

However, in the replay at 1:24:20 of the stream, you'll see him in an offside position when the ball is played. They don't give us a view down the line unfortunately, but Sotirio looks well in front of the man just below the penalty spot who is the only one with any kind of shout to play him on. The commentators do incorrectly attribute it to Gary Hooper though.

I've embedded the image below so people can see the best angle for themselves. If this was called onside against us I'd be apoplectic.

Sotirio Offside.PNG 1.22 MB

Nelfoos

kungfu panda

Nelfoos 

I'm sorry but I'm doing this frame by frame here. There's no way that the linesman's flag went up for Sotirio. It went up for Hooper. Its not at all clear from the youtube angle that Sotirio was offside (dead in line according to me). Hooper never interfered with play, he was not in the goalkeepers line of sight when Sotirio shot. For me it's a goal.

Hooper wasn't even blocking the goalies vision, I agree it can't been flagged for that.

However, in the replay at 1:24:20 of the stream, you'll see him in a clearly offside position when the ball is played. They don't give us a view down the line unfortunately, but Sotirio looks well in front of the man just below the penalty spot who is the only one with any kind of shout to play him on. The commentators do incorrectly attribute it to Gary Hooper though.

I've embedded the image below so people can see the best angle for themselves. If this was called onside against us I'd be apoplectic.

Sotirio Offside.PNG 1.22 MB

Good! The only clear offside there is Hooper though. RIGHT?
In line is not offside, and without VAR, the linesman is not doing this to fractions of a centimeter.

Fair enough though, you can call this either way but the benefit should go to the attacking side.

I thought Jaushy was off watching it live. Even from that still frame he looks half a body off?

kungfu panda

Nelfoos

kungfu panda

Nelfoos 

I'm sorry but I'm doing this frame by frame here. There's no way that the linesman's flag went up for Sotirio. It went up for Hooper. Its not at all clear from the youtube angle that Sotirio was offside (dead in line according to me). Hooper never interfered with play, he was not in the goalkeepers line of sight when Sotirio shot. For me it's a goal.

Hooper wasn't even blocking the goalies vision, I agree it can't been flagged for that.

However, in the replay at 1:24:20 of the stream, you'll see him in a clearly offside position when the ball is played. They don't give us a view down the line unfortunately, but Sotirio looks well in front of the man just below the penalty spot who is the only one with any kind of shout to play him on. The commentators do incorrectly attribute it to Gary Hooper though.

I've embedded the image below so people can see the best angle for themselves. If this was called onside against us I'd be apoplectic.

Sotirio Offside.PNG 1.22 MB

Good! The only clear offside there is Hooper though. RIGHT?
In line is not offside, and without VAR, the linesman is not doing this to fractions of a centimeter.

Fair enough though, you can call this either way but the benefit should go to the attacking side.

Sotirio looks at least half a yard off in that image to me, I'm not sure how you're seeing anything else!

Without VAR the AR is calling whatever they believe is the correct call and because we don't have a replay along the line, their view is better than any we have. That said, I don't think the one we do have is controversial, but obviously you're seeing it differently to me so who knows?

If you're talking about the feet, half a yard is too generous, more like 2 or 3 cm but it appears to me that Sotirio is upright and the defender is leaning back. Of course I don't know exactly but I'd call it in line. As for the linesman, I'm not convinced that his flag didn't go up for Hooper.

Anyway, gotta go to work. Have a nice day 👍 

Onside/offside, what a tedious, pointless discussion. 
How many angels can fit on the head of a pin?

harrymc55

Onside/offside, what a tedious, pointless discussion. 
How many angels can fit on the head of a pin?

It depends where the head of the pin starts

harrymc55

Onside/offside, what a tedious, pointless discussion. 
How many angels can fit on the head of a pin?

42

.