WPM R18 vs Auckland FC | Sat 21st Feb | 5:00pm | RoF / SS1 / Sky Open

The players are completely to blame for whatever that was from the own goal through to half time.

They were the better team up until that point. Collectively heads should not completely go because of one freak moment. Suggests they were far too emotional going in to the game.

imanixsupporter

Chiefy and Josh Oluwayemi have probably forever tainted this derby, it could have been the most amazing institution, a promise of all that football could and should be in NZ. 

There was the very first Oluwayemi derby blunder, and I remember him being pretty weak in failing to stop a Pijnaker header in derby #2, then today. He very much played his part.

Anyone with a passing interest in this will probably forever mock and dismiss it from here on out, no matter what happens in the next 5 years or so. People who would have rightfully been curious about it at its inception, despite not being big football followers. 

Such a missed opportunity. And it never should have been like this. Nix management get what they deserve. Anyone who thought Chiefy should have had his contract extended last year needs their head read. 

This is a bit overdramatic.

I just personally think a lot of the defense's failings are due to the ineffective and confusing instructions theyve been given, and a lot of their apparent lack of motivation is because they probably didnt believe that Chiefy's setup made sense/was going to work. Yes they have been shocking but at the end of the day Chiefy is responsible for that and he has taken full responsibility and so for now I see no point at pointing blame at the players. 

imanixsupporter

I feel bad for Josh. If Chiefy was capable of coaching a normal style of football not requiring incredibly risky high line sweeping or passing out from the back no matter the press, he might have really impressed for us as a great shot stopper. He was asked to things he shouldn't have been, given his attributes. 

But he isnt going to be here next season, nobody in their right mind would waste a visa spot on him. So he shouldn't get another minute this season. 

What do you mean "normal style of football"? 'Keepers sweeping, considering where the ball was, is very much normal football.  Even passing out is very much normal, inviting the press is very much normal. 

Ok maybe I should have said conservative/traditional rather than normal but you know what I mean. Josh clearly didnt have the right attributes to do what Chiefy wanted him to and it was foolish for Chiefy to recruit and extend him as a result. 

Jonty07

If players at this level do not understand the basic principles of defending, they shouldn't be anywhere near professional level.. The school boy errors defensively aren't down to coaching, rather an inability or lack of motivation to do the basics

Do you seriously think players lack motivation? They are all playing to keep their careers alive. The coaching has been so shambolic that my guess is most players have lost confidence, have got confused with the system and second guessing themselves on the pitch.
This becomes evident when errors are made, which then further compounds into total loss of belief and control, like during yesterday's game. It's down to the coaching 100%. Two years of philosophical overcomplicated nonsense has ruined these players confidence.
Having said that, some of our players need to go at the end of the season, we need a good clear out. Otherwise, most of our guys will take the trauma of the last 2 years into next year's derbies...

I left posing in this tread till now due to ebing so fudgeing angry after last night.
Then I read that italiano tended his resignation immediatly after the game - which had to come but I was pleased he showed some honour and sttod down before being fired.

On the game itself: Italiano is always responsible for who takes the field and what style they play - until that goal we looked god, AFC had no shots on goal before then. After the goal the key for me and those around me was the reaction from the players. Leaders stood at half way with their hands on hips, Josh received a pay on the back form Hughes I think it was, but noone gathered the team together to regain control and from then onwards it was game over. 
Eze was literally the only one on the park showing any effort.
All of the back four played statues for the rest of the half, midfield were nowhere to be seen, losing the ball and just watching as AFC passed the bal forwards, then wide, then a simple cut back the goal!
Italiano says he read them the riot act at half time, I would have yanked Rufer, Tuiloma, Naijarine, Nagasawa and played given the young guys their chance. At 4-0 we were never winning but a message needed to be sent.

The lack of effort from the players was clear, this has been the case for a number of games this season. We've played good footy but as soon as an error occurs our heads drop!

Those players at the end of their contracts and thise playing for WC spots need to take a hard look at themselves and pick their game up for whoever comes in next.
I assume it will be Greenacre in a caretaker role until the end of the season. Many of the current squad will not be back next season.

theprof

I left posing in this tread till now due to ebing so fudgeing angry after last night.
Then I read that italiano tended his resignation immediatly after the game - which had to come but I was pleased he showed some honour and sttod down before being fired.

On the game itself: Italiano is always responsible for who takes the field and what style they play - until that goal we looked god, AFC had no shots on goal before then. After the goal the key for me and those around me was the reaction from the players. Leaders stood at half way with their hands on hips, Josh received a pay on the back form Hughes I think it was, but noone gathered the team together to regain control and from then onwards it was game over. 
Eze was literally the only one on the park showing any effort.
All of the back four played statues for the rest of the half, midfield were nowhere to be seen, losing the ball and just watching as AFC passed the bal forwards, then wide, then a simple cut back the goal!
Italiano says he read them the riot act at half time, I would have yanked Rufer, Tuiloma, Naijarine, Nagasawa and played given the young guys their chance. At 4-0 we were never winning but a message needed to be sent.

The lack of effort from the players was clear, this has been the case for a number of games this season. We've played good footy but as soon as an error occurs our heads drop!

Those players at the end of their contracts and thise playing for WC spots need to take a hard look at themselves and pick their game up for whoever comes in next.
I assume it will be Greenacre in a caretaker role until the end of the season. Many of the current squad will not be back next season.

Yeah I want to add that I too noticed that Hughes was the only player to go back and console Josh after that first goal - I was pretty disappointed that Manjrekar and Bill didn't also Rufs as captain should have. 

We were playing alright up until then, but you could see that heads dropped at that moment and it felt like the players thought it was all over.

It was an absolute howler, but that early in the game it's one mistake and surely you want to show support for your team mate when you know they are going to be put in some difficult positions throughout the rest of the match

InsulinMachine

Jonty07

If players at this level do not understand the basic principles of defending, they shouldn't be anywhere near professional level.. The school boy errors defensively aren't down to coaching, rather an inability or lack of motivation to do the basics

Do you seriously think players lack motivation? They are all playing to keep their careers alive. The coaching has been so shambolic that my guess is most players have lost confidence, have got confused with the system and second guessing themselves on the pitch.
This becomes evident when errors are made, which then further compounds into total loss of belief and control, like during yesterday's game. It's down to the coaching 100%. Two years of philosophical overcomplicated nonsense has ruined these players confidence.

We can't say that for sure. You could argue we have got a bunch of senior players who likely weren't being re-signed by their previous team, but who got a gig here, where they've managed to prove their previous team was right.

Chief selected them. But he was, arguably, forced to senior up the squad, all at once, presumably on a budget.

I don't know. Big issues are usually due to a combination of things. We gave a rookie coach a chance. The club changed its academy approach part way through his tenure to get senior players on board so we weren't so reliant on kids in the case of injury.  The club demanded more entertaining football, presumably on the same budget. And then seemingly panicked and loosened the spend as we copped further injuries and losses and as it became apparent that entertaining became risky and embarrasing. We scored a lot of goals while also looking calamitous.  

All that said, there were a few games we drew that we should have won but for dumb keeper and other errors.  We could easily have been in the top six if not for three or four pretty abject player errors.

Maybe Chief's biggest issue was being an optimist about making the clubs money ball playing squad philosophy work. 

looking at it in isolation, that first goal was not in any way, ‘a schoolboy error’.

1. Oliwyemi’s positioning was as instructed
2. With the ball’s elevation, the northerly wind presented a major challenge re his timing to meet the ball
4. Had he handled outside of the area he would have been in deep strife with the referee
5. He was backpeddling
6. His attempt to deflect the ball with his head while backpeddling could just as easily have diverted the ball away from the net. That was very unlucky.
7. It was a very high bounce off a firm pitch

That event would have posed a major problem for even top rated keepers

His confidence must have been shot after that

That is saying nothing about other mistakes that he’s made in different games just adding a bit of perspective

In itself the error was no worse than the errors that outfield players make in every game. 

The consequences of course are amplified.

Agree with AT. As I said earlier, a lot of focus was put on Josh being miles upfield, and also being ready to be out to head long balls. A lot of keepers barely think about heading such balls. He was backpedalling and went to head it because that is what Chiefy wanted, and it backfired massively. Under a different coach, that simply doesnt happen 

imanixsupporter

I just personally think a lot of the defense's failings are due to the ineffective and confusing instructions theyve been given, and a lot of their apparent lack of motivation is because they probably didnt believe that Chiefy's setup made sense/was going to work. Yes they have been shocking but at the end of the day Chiefy is responsible for that and he has taken full responsibility and so for now I see no point at pointing blame at the players. 

I agree 100%.  Well coached, experienced players who play intuitively to the game going on around them do not run around like school kids chasing the ball. all within an arms length of each other.

I think we are seeing overcoached players with their heads full of what they should be doing, producing an inflexible approach, a complete lack of initiative, innovation and adaptability, and the result is a dull ineffective hotpotch.

I dont think any coach is telling their keeper to put their head on a ball that high, yeas the instruction to Josh would be to sweep and play high, but on seeing that hoof upfield he should have been on his bike to get back, let the ball bounce and see it over the bar or catch it. Pausing to head the ball was on Josh and it was a clear error. But it was just one moment, which he should have seen his team mates rally around him and continue to fight, the next three goals conceeded were not 100% the keepers fault - they lie with the midfield and defence not doiung their jobs

Fenix

imanixsupporter

I just personally think a lot of the defense's failings are due to the ineffective and confusing instructions theyve been given, and a lot of their apparent lack of motivation is because they probably didnt believe that Chiefy's setup made sense/was going to work. Yes they have been shocking but at the end of the day Chiefy is responsible for that and he has taken full responsibility and so for now I see no point at pointing blame at the players. 

I agree 100%.  Well coached, experienced players who play intuitively to the game going on around them do not run around like school kids chasing the ball. all within an arms length of each other.

I think we are seeing overcoached players with their heads full of what they should be doing, producing an inflexible approach, a complete lack of initiative, innovation and adaptability, and the result is a dull ineffective hotpotch.

That perfectly sums up what Chiefy has made of this team over the past 2 years sadly

Buffon II

The players are completely to blame for whatever that was from the own goal through to half time.

They were the better team up until that point. Collectively heads should not completely go because of one freak moment. Suggests they were far too emotional going in to the game.

But also they way the first goal was conceded was a killer.
It wasn’t one freak moment. Josh had had about 4 iirc. And this one was special. Omg.

martinb

Buffon II

The players are completely to blame for whatever that was from the own goal through to half time.

They were the better team up until that point. Collectively heads should not completely go because of one freak moment. Suggests they were far too emotional going in to the game.

But also they way the first goal was conceded was a killer.

A coach killer fer sure! but not a game killer, it's one fudgeing goal! Where weas Rufer after that goal? oh thats right he was stood at half way with his hamds on his hips, like mos of the team. No getting the lads heads back up no he dropped his sack with the rest of them.

I bloody hope that Rufer / the senior group calls a player-only meeting asap. They really have to sort their stuff out. Play for the badge. Play for the wins. They'll also be playing for their contracts with a new coach to come. Time will tell...

That no one went over is an indictment. 
Again look how the club and the Port rebuilt Woud’s confidence. 
We definitely shouldn’t have been out of it at 1-0. 

Chief had this season twice, imo. Maybe 3 times, but the first version met injury crisis. 

We had the McCarron team. That version was collecting points. Then we had Alby’s version. We integrated new players and were unlucky not to get more points. That version was almost ready. Either of those two put in a better derby showing against a depleted AFC than that. 

You shouldn’t be tinkering before a big game. Josh isn’t Neuer. And he’s struggled with the derby before. 

And where they were hitting those goals from is exactly where I want to see Armiento hitting shots. 

We didn’t shoot. We didn’t score. We played like Stoke. Or Arsenal. Without the watertight defense. 

We were promised attack, but Chief has returned to his core principle of trying to control a game.

InsulinMachine

martinb

observerfromuh

InsulinMachine

Gordinho

Pretty dire. Just wondering what the goalie hit on Eze looked like on tv. Looked like a head button from the stand.....

 Eze faked contact. Like him as a player but that was pathetic.

 He does it every game, its pathetic especially as the A-League is a more contact league than others.

 
Bullshark. 
Stand up for your own players. 

He’s the golden boot and he works his fkn socks off and has done very little wrong this game. 

Woud deliberately runs into him. Not enough in it, but puts it in the refs mind.

 I don't stand up for cheaters and actors 

This league is full of them so you might want to watch something else. Don't get me wrong, that was embarrassing, but Eze put himself about during matches with minimal support from teammates. In this match, AFC knew that they just needed to stop him which they effectively did through a variety of means, many of which I would contest were not legal within the laws of the game. He had very little protection from the ref. I am prepared to forgive him one embarrassing moment for what he brings. Just can't forgive that first goal though. Oh my days! 

theprof

I dont think any coach is telling their keeper to put their head on a ball that high, yeas the instruction to Josh would be to sweep and play high, but on seeing that hoof upfield he should have been on his bike to get back, let the ball bounce and see it over the bar or catch it. Pausing to head the ball was on Josh and it was a clear error. But it was just one moment, which he should have seen his team mates rally around him and continue to fight, the next three goals conceeded were not 100% the keepers fault - they lie with the midfield and defence not doiung their jobs

Totally agree with this analysis.

Its still a bad mistake but it is as clear as day that Chiefy's particular tactical instruction contributed to it happening

Fenix

5th goal. Again, 4 players within touching distance of each other, goalscorer totally free in the middle

Screenshot_20260222_010003_Chrome.jpg 44.43 KB

retre was also late on his press for this goal, decided to go ahead with it anyway and left a gaping hole

theprof

martinb

Buffon II

The players are completely to blame for whatever that was from the own goal through to half time.

They were the better team up until that point. Collectively heads should not completely go because of one freak moment. Suggests they were far too emotional going in to the game.

But also they way the first goal was conceded was a killer.

A coach killer fer sure! but not a game killer, it's one fudgeing goal! Where weas Rufer after that goal? oh thats right he was stood at half way with his hamds on his hips, like mos of the team. No getting the lads heads back up no he dropped his sack with the rest of them.

Sorry but in the in the stands around me that first goal was a game killer. You could feel the energy of the crowd just evaporate.  

Having a few hours to cool my jets over this, I just get angrier about the state the club & yesterday.

1) It all starts pre game for me, its a little thing but it all makes a difference in elite sport.. When asked a few days pre game about the importance of the derby, Corica was clear in saying “It’s more then just 3 points, its a derby and you need to have an extra motivation to go out and do well” - meanwhile Carlo Armiento in his interview said “It’s just another game, we don’t feel the pressure of a derby”.. Pressure is GOOD! It’s healthy if you use it well, it can bring the best out of you, it shouldn’t be ignored.. For some of those guys players, this might be the biggest game of their career, embrace it.. Auckland always do, we go into our shell.

2) first 20 minutes of a derby at home, in a must win game you want to apply maximum pressure on your opponents, try to create chances, try to force errors, impost yourself on the game, we did none of that.. Either it be coaching, players not switched on (been an issue all year, and that’s on the coach) or a poor team shape.

3) Josh.. I am sorry, but that’s not excusable, he might be a top bloke, nice guy, signs autographs for kids post game, but that’s a career killer.

4) the leaders - Rufer, Tuiloma, whoever they’re, I watched closely after each goal, Rufer held his hands on head after each goal, and Tuiloma just looked to the ground, body language matters, and leaders will bring in the team together in a huddle and try to calm everyone down, and re-focus, ours don’t. 

That’s it for now, I’m still angry.. ill come back with more later lol

Feverish

Simon B

mikecj

yeah. it was pretty rough.

I need to watch the replays (although I don’t think I can face that tonight), but the worst thing about the oggie is that at least from my angle it looked like if Josh had leapt back up he might’ve been able to grab the ball in time.

Or maybe that’s just the “slow-motion car crash” effect playing tricks on me.

Don’t say this - it is making me angrier ha

Well now that I’ve brought myself to rewatch it I owe Josh an apology - there was no way he was recovering from that.

Goes to show how unreliable our perception can be, which is something I should remember next time I’m raging at a ref’s decision.

Simon B

Feverish

Simon B

mikecj

yeah. it was pretty rough.

I need to watch the replays (although I don’t think I can face that tonight), but the worst thing about the oggie is that at least from my angle it looked like if Josh had leapt back up he might’ve been able to grab the ball in time.

Or maybe that’s just the “slow-motion car crash” effect playing tricks on me.

Don’t say this - it is making me angrier ha

Well now that I’ve brought myself to rewatch it I owe Josh an apology - there was no way he was recovering from that.

Goes to show how unreliable our perception can be, which is something I should remember next time I’m raging at a ref’s decision.

Yet it is given as an own goal because it wouldn’t have gone in the net without his header. 

And we had a warning when he misjudged one earlier.

imanixsupporter

Agree with AT. As I said earlier, a lot of focus was put on Josh being miles upfield, and also being ready to be out to head long balls. A lot of keepers barely think about heading such balls. He was backpedalling and went to head it because that is what Chiefy wanted, and it backfired massively. Under a different coach, that simply doesnt happen 

Sometimes I reckon you don't watch football, or did in the 90s when the 'keepers could pick up back passes and therefore didn't need to use their feet other than launching the ball 50+m up field.

Nixieboys222

Having a few hours to cool my jets over this, I just get angrier about the state the club & yesterday.

1) It all starts pre game for me, its a little thing but it all makes a difference in elite sport.. When asked a few days pre game about the importance of the derby, Corica was clear in saying “It’s more then just 3 points, its a derby and you need to have an extra motivation to go out and do well” - meanwhile Carlo Armiento in his interview said “It’s just another game, we don’t feel the pressure of a derby”.. Pressure is GOOD! It’s healthy if you use it well, it can bring the best out of you, it shouldn’t be ignored.. For some of those guys players, this might be the biggest game of their career, embrace it.. Auckland always do, we go into our shell.

2) first 20 minutes of a derby at home, in a must win game you want to apply maximum pressure on your opponents, try to create chances, try to force errors, impost yourself on the game, we did none of that.. Either it be coaching, players not switched on (been an issue all year, and that’s on the coach) or a poor team shape.

3) Josh.. I am sorry, but that’s not excusable, he might be a top bloke, nice guy, signs autographs for kids post game, but that’s a career killer.

4) the leaders - Rufer, Tuiloma, whoever they’re, I watched closely after each goal, Rufer held his hands on head after each goal, and Tuiloma just looked to the ground, body language matters, and leaders will bring in the team together in a huddle and try to calm everyone down, and re-focus, ours don’t. 

That’s it for now, I’m still angry.. ill come back with more later lol

On points 1 and 2, given how the players responded after the og you can tell it was more than "just another game" - I can totally understand that mindset given the weight of expectations and the 5 prior losses hanging over their heads like a Sword of Damocles - which fell after the og. And in that first 23min before the og, we had superior possession and position and disrupting a lot of AFC's play - it was messy football but we were applying some pressure, the og totally shot us mentally and calmed AFC.

reg22

Fenix

5th goal. Again, 4 players within touching distance of each other, goalscorer totally free in the middle

Screenshot_20260222_010003_Chrome.jpg 44.43 KB

retre was also late on his press for this goal, decided to go ahead with it anyway and left a gaping hole

I was disappointed with Retre, LKH is a better midfielder than him at the moment

Retre was poor last year... he just scored a screamer to hide it from everyone.

Chief didnt have the right players or tactics last year of this year. The first year is on him. The second on the club for giving him another year when it was clear he wasn't up to it (based on results and his relationships with players and staff).

We have too many players not up to scratch unfortunately and our imports outside EZE aren't good enough. James is woeful. His positioning, awareness and decision making is bang average. Our goalkeeper is not too error prone (last year and this year. He makes Woud look assured!) and Nagasawa, who I like, is just middling and not clearly better that those he plays in front of.

Its lucky that so many player contracts are ending... it will allow the new coach to come in and create his or her own team.

Two years of sharke, when given the arrival of Auckland, if we had a good team we also could have ridden the wave of interest in footy and used that to help build the club and the game... instead of trying to kill it! 

Auckland's support.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DVAQI_HgQgh/?igsh=MXB5em1yNjBrM3h1NQ==

On one level this pisses me off, because it's them,  on another...football fans like that in Aotearoa.  Wasn't like that in my day. ( Thinks... six Stop Out fans at a National League playoff in Auckland ) 🫣

dairyflat

Auckland's support.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DVAQI_HgQgh/?igsh=MXB5em1yNjBrM3h1NQ==

On one level this pisses me off, because it's them,  on another...football fans like that in Aotearoa.  Wasn't like that in my day. ( Thinks... six Stop Out fans at a National League playoff in Auckland ) 🫣

They missed the photo of them swimming off Moa point.

Getting a lot of this in the last 24 hrs, somehow seems appropriate

image.png 33.48 KB

I thought the same

The tip is to slow down. No hoofs down field will lead to goals. Only slow patient build up.

Wait 5 seconds before pushing the tab.

Alf Tupper

looking at it in isolation, that first goal was not in any way, ‘a schoolboy error’.

1. Oliwyemi’s positioning was as instructed
2. With the ball’s elevation, the northerly wind presented a major challenge re his timing to meet the ball
4. Had he handled outside of the area he would have been in deep strife with the referee
5. He was backpeddling
6. His attempt to deflect the ball with his head while backpeddling could just as easily have diverted the ball away from the net. That was very unlucky.
7. It was a very high bounce off a firm pitch

That event would have posed a major problem for even top rated keepers

His confidence must have been shot after that

That is saying nothing about other mistakes that he’s made in different games just adding a bit of perspective

In itself the error was no worse than the errors that outfield players make in every game. 

The consequences of course are amplified.

You must be joking, mire stupid error than last week‘s Alby mistake

It is the kind of fudge up that will be played world wide by if not hundreds of thousands/millions.

Possibly also used by goal keeping coaches for years to come on not what to do.

AucklandPhoenix

It is the kind of fudge up that will be played world wide by if not hundreds of thousands/millions.

Possibly also used by goal keeping coaches for years to come on not what to do.

Its friggen everywhere being reposted all the bloody time. Sick of being asked is this your team. 😔😭😭

Well not great but hit Domes 10k to break even I guess.

10,040 attendance yesterday.