AW vs Paraguay Oct 12 Match Thread

Enjoyed the game last night. Thought it pretty much summed up where the All Whites are at. We have made huge strides over the last 2-3 years but lets be honest without Ryan Nelsen we aren't going to contain teams such as Paraguay.

He is simply the reason we dont concede many goals because it was clear to see last night without him there is no communication or leadership at the back and he makes Reid and Vicelich look good and is always the one making a last ditch tackle when it looks as if the other team will score.

In the midfield I though Simon Elliott was again good without being great he gets on the ball and doesn't give it away much, as for Tim Brown how on earth this guy makes the starting XI mystifies me, yes he is fit and occasionally gets into good goal scoring positions but as a centre midfielder he is pretty much non existent for 90 mins all game, i dont expect a Xavi or Iniesta performance but at least try and get on the ball and get us going. He just doesn't seem to like getting on the ball and if he does once a half he just passes it backwards and he barely made a tackle last night as Paraguay were too slick in their movement when it was around him.

Other observations:

Brockie looked good when he got involved

Killen is a good player and he looked our most dangerous player at times he just lacked a bit of quality in his final product

As for the person saying Wood was his MOM. You must be having a laugh. I dont think I have ever seen someone give the ball away that much. He is unaware of players around him which suprises me considering he plays at a higher level than most of our players. Yes he has a bit of raw potential but hes a long way off being as good as many say he is.

Also Boyens is that bad I doubt he would stand out in the NZFC

Paston has been quality for New Zealand for the last year or so!

Bertos is a waste of space looked lost out on the left, has gone backwards over last 12 months in a big way. 1 decent ball in all night and had tonnes of space and opportunity. Having no left foot doesn't help him

The biggest positive for me last night was the way we approached the 2nd half though at half time I was worrying that it could be a blowout but the All whites did do alot better in the second half although I thought. Paraguay never even got out of second gear which also was a reason.

I just feel that yes Ricki has done a brilliant job over the last couple of years to get us the results he has but once Nelsen and Elliott retire I really feel we are going to struggle although I do hope I am wrong!

We created plenty of chances against a quality side. Killen had the majority but Brown had a couple too. It's great to see us competing with side much higher than us in the rankings. Smeltz and Nelson do make a big difference to our team though.

Forget what the results have been in both games, It's the way we have played without Ryan Nelsen that has shown that RH is not going to pull in the none football fan. This is the person that NZF needs to attract to make these sort of games a money maker.
Bring in a Kevin Keegan type, we score 5 if the score 4 etc never be a dull game.
The first half was staring to look like we could take the game, but it came down to not changing the shape at the back to make up for the loss of Nelsen. That should have been done before the team was named. I could not believe we still had 3 at the back with Reid in the middle, he got out of position so many times in SA playing at full back, nor is he big at organising others, Siggy should have been in the middle.
The second half we didn't change things early enough to give the players coming on time to make an impact.
That performance by a coach does not make me want to travel to Auckland or Wellington for future non tournament games.
Get away from being so negative in this sort of game.
If you are a central midfield player and you don't score a goal in 20+ games then something is wrong with the system or the players ability to play at that level. So which is it for Brown?

Jamie Cross had a good game and got the big ones correct and no that was not a foul on Bertos in the 40th minute, again the Paraguay player just used his body to step across and take the ball away, Bertos had too bigger touch and gap between himself and the ball.

Wood has impressed me with his ability in the air and I think his ability to bring the ball down with his chest is particularly impressive. He uses his strength well and seems to make things happen through sheer determination. I think his weakest aspect is his finishing, especially with his feet and to break the West Brom team next season he is going to have to improve that facet of his game. He is a player who I think has great potential but you can sense he is still raw and some of his skills need refining. But he is the best and most exciting prospect we've had for years so good luck to the young man. He now needs to score some goals for Barnsley.

Junior822010-10-13 13:16:01

aitkenmike2010-10-13 13:53:51

My take on the game is that we list 2-0.

imo we wouldn't have felt Nelsen's absence as much if Tommy "injured" Smith was playing. I rate him higher than Reid at the moment.

 Followed him around for a couple hours after he finished work, at the game, stood 2 rows behind him and over his left shoulder. Stood next to him at the urinal and said hello without telling him who I was, followed him home and shat on his doorstep - pretty standard stalking procedure.

I really enjoyed the game! I thought that apart from conceding the two goals and having a player sent off we played really really well. I was pleased to have the draw against them in the World Cup but it was great to see us finally attacking and creating chances. 

Asked if he was disappointed with Reid's challenge, All Whites coach Ricki Herbert replied: "I was a bit disappointed with the referee, to be honest. I think at the end of the day it's a friendly game and why would you send someone off in the 90th minute?"

Ok, just read this on the Stuff website in relation to the game.  Sorry Mr Herbert, but THAT STUPID RESPONSE has just put you way down in my estimations, and demonstrated a real lack of judgment on your part. And Im a bit biased, having broken both legs playing the beautiful game.

I also thought it was stupid, what minute of the game the foul is in should have no impact on the ref's decision.

Ricki always says 'at the end of the day'.

He would never have said that if one of ours got tackled like that. Bad call Ricki.

Fixed

Agreed,what a stupid thing to say!

I hate Jamie cross as much as the next guy,but he doesn't deserve sh*t for giving out a completely justified red card.Tegal2010-10-13 19:58:11

Will certainly jump on the bandwagon on this one. Ridiculous call by Ricki here. That was a red card in any game, any where, at any stage, and it is ridiculous to criticise the ref for making the correct call.

I'm quite surprised the guy didn't break a leg from that tackle.

Indeed like Vince Grella's on Leo.
We were astonished that it was claimed that the red card was not issued because it was a "friendly". As we should have been.

Note: some inconsistency there which may have led to Ricki's comment (not excusing him, but worthy of note)

Sorry Turfmoore, but I don't see how Ricki's comment can be justified. Reading further into the article on Stuff, he seems pre-occupied with the prospect of losing Reid for more than one game as a result. So what? Reid was found out last night anyway. He's no great saviour. And I'm amazed at how many times in these two games he has tried to make a simple pass under no pressure, and knocked it over the sideline. Then there's his poor positional sense. Don't worry Rick, we have other options. What we don't need is that unpredictably terrible, clumsy, ugly tackling Reid has become known for. Is it just poor technique?

I don't think he had seen a replay at the time he said it. Not making an excuse for that, you have to be a bit more careful what you say, but he was caught up in the frustration of losing Reid for the next time they play and said something silly rather than spiteful. I don't think he had seen it because if he had he wouldn't have any complaints, the tackle was a shocker, no where near the ball.

Don't act like we have better defensive options than Reid though. He is still young and inexperienced. He has potential to turn into a great defender for club and country.

Sorry Pao, I think you misinterpreted my comment. I wasn't attempting to justify Ricki's comment.

We were justifiably grumpy that Grella was reportedly NOT sent off because the Oz-NZ match was a "friendly". (Opposite of Rici's view)

My end note was that this precedent may have affected Ricki's judgement. Explain it to some extent maybe, but certainly doesn't justify it in my view.

(Explain and justify quite different beasts: Being drunk may explain one's action, but certainly doesn't justify it)

No prob Turf, thanks for clarifying.

haha!

I thought I caught something on the news tonite that said the Paraguayan [is that a word?] had a broken knee or something. Saw the tackle tonite too, made me wince. Someone else mentioned it and I thought this at the time too, that Reid showed some class by staying there and checking on the guy and wringing his cap - shows me it wasn't intentional which would have been too Roy Keanesque for my liking.

But he was given the red straight away before he even had a chance to show any care. I was beginning to wonder if he was ever going to go off.

You must have missed it, Reid was shown the red card immediately! His concern for the player was after he'd been shown the card.

Stupid tackle and deserved to sent off. Herbert's comments equally stupid.

yeah- I was watching online, so was not sure if he had been carded he was there so long. But I do think it was genuine concern- again, the red was justified, but he did show some good personal qualities by staying to see if the guy was ok. I think the fact that none of the Paraguay players flattened him (a la the fisticuffs/ handbags against oz) maybe illustrated they interpreted his concern as genuine too.

Hopefully the injury is not too serious, and hopefully Winston learns from this and develops as a player as a result.

whatever.they all could have fit in his pocket.damn right they didnt want a piece

Too true!

Wanted Kosta in this team! Dunno where, but still....would be good to see him Wee Mac, Leo, Wood and Smeltz in combo at some point....

I DO NOT UNDERSTAND YOU FOOTBALL PEOPLE.....SANTANDER  WENT HARD  BEFORE ON REID  WITH  A 2  LEGGED  ATTACK...WHEN  HE WAS  PLAYING  SWEEPER....   WHAT  WOULD HAVE HAPPENED  IF SANTANDER  BROKE  REIDS LEG  BEFORE ....

lol?