NZ Ferns v Portugal 17 Feb 7pm Tron | and Argentina 20 & 23 Feb 7pm Tron & NHS

Monto

chopah

Showtime Nixie

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

I think one of the biggest concerns people have chopah is the culture of the group in which the Coach is ultimately responsible for. Perception was and still is that these girls get together for holiday camps! Only now that the pressure has come on she's trying to work more towards a high performance model. Pretty easy to sit back on a deck chair when you get given 6 year deal and leave it up to the girls to decide what's happening. 

The stats don't lie - 3 wins from 24 games. 

Sounds like we are now lowering expectations...so a win at the world cup is now a pass mark and Jitka gets a pat on back?? come on.

Bare minimum we should be getting out of our group at home. She has a huge challenge ahead of her due to what's been allowed to go on....it will tell us if she's a coach or not. But she said she's relying on two experienced players to return? Both coming off ACLs.......dreaming.

This comment about culture might be your perception but it's not mine.  You have just made a lot of assumptions about culture and ways of working on very little information.  

I don't know about your expectations but for me it was first and foremost to win a game, if we can somehow get out the group then that's a bonus.

chopah

Showtime Nixie

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

I think one of the biggest concerns people have chopah is the culture of the group in which the Coach is ultimately responsible for. Perception was and still is that these girls get together for holiday camps! Only now that the pressure has come on she's trying to work more towards a high performance model. Pretty easy to sit back on a deck chair when you get given 6 year deal and leave it up to the girls to decide what's happening. 

The stats don't lie - 3 wins from 24 games. 

Sounds like we are now lowering expectations...so a win at the world cup is now a pass mark and Jitka gets a pat on back?? come on.

Bare minimum we should be getting out of our group at home. She has a huge challenge ahead of her due to what's been allowed to go on....it will tell us if she's a coach or not. But she said she's relying on two experienced players to return? Both coming off ACLs.......dreaming.

This comment about culture might be your perception but it's not mine.  You have just made a lot of assumptions about culture and ways of working on very little information.  

I don't know about your expectations but for me it was first and foremost to win a game, if we can somehow get out the group then that's a bonus.

That's the problem. Your idea of success is winning one game, for everone else here it's getting out of our group at a home world cup.

You couldn't call klimkovas results good could you? There's been no evidence of progress the entire time she's been in charge.

do you speak for everyone on here do you?

Also I never said her record is good, I am just saying changing the coach won't magically make the team better - but I sense a pattern for you in particular, if results are not what you want them to be, sack the coach and it will be fine.  

Maybe your working for a recruitment agency, that would explain it - trying to hit your bonus.

If she was a man, coaching the mens team, she'd be gone.

Why the different standard.

We can't win, hell, we can't even draw. 

900 minutes without a goal.

How is the media, the public not begging for her head?

change won't make the team better? the girls look deflated. staff look deflated. You been part of a team before that's going no where? change can often bring new hope....sometimes when there's hope theres some light. Teams often have a sugar hit and before a world cup that could be exactly what we need. 

We now Jitka will see out her contract...shes here to stay. But something needs to change....i've mentioned before get Wayne Smith in or someone of that nature to sort out the culture and the environment and bring higher levels of professionalism and practises. A different voice! 

Something has to happen and it has to happen quick.

MetalLegNZ

If she was a man, coaching the mens team, she'd be gone.

Why the different standard.

We can't win, hell, we can't even draw. 

900 minutes without a goal.

How is the media, the public not begging for her head?

It has nothing to do with her gender - that's just your bias talking.

do you not concede even in the slightest little amount that the players (as a collective) are not really good enough, sounds harsh and there are some that show promise but for me that's the hard truth.

I just can't believe the coach managed to get a 6 year contract. WTF? Another NZF ballsup. Between that and not getting an AW coach, it has not been the best of years for NZF. Amateurs pretending to be professionals??

Anyone with an honest assessment of Switzerland?. Are they beatable?. This would be like a cup final assuming we beat the Philippines.

chopah

MetalLegNZ

If she was a man, coaching the mens team, she'd be gone.

Why the different standard.

We can't win, hell, we can't even draw. 

900 minutes without a goal.

How is the media, the public not begging for her head?

It has nothing to do with her gender - that's just your bias talking.

do you not concede even in the slightest little amount that the players (as a collective) are not really good enough, sounds harsh and there are some that show promise but for me that's the hard truth.

If the players aren't good enough then surely you'd expect the coach to set the team up in a way that reflects that she understands that? I wouldn't say she's shown that she recognizes that at all.

chopah

Monto

chopah

Showtime Nixie

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

I think one of the biggest concerns people have chopah is the culture of the group in which the Coach is ultimately responsible for. Perception was and still is that these girls get together for holiday camps! Only now that the pressure has come on she's trying to work more towards a high performance model. Pretty easy to sit back on a deck chair when you get given 6 year deal and leave it up to the girls to decide what's happening. 

The stats don't lie - 3 wins from 24 games. 

Sounds like we are now lowering expectations...so a win at the world cup is now a pass mark and Jitka gets a pat on back?? come on.

Bare minimum we should be getting out of our group at home. She has a huge challenge ahead of her due to what's been allowed to go on....it will tell us if she's a coach or not. But she said she's relying on two experienced players to return? Both coming off ACLs.......dreaming.

This comment about culture might be your perception but it's not mine.  You have just made a lot of assumptions about culture and ways of working on very little information.  

I don't know about your expectations but for me it was first and foremost to win a game, if we can somehow get out the group then that's a bonus.

chopah

Showtime Nixie

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

I think one of the biggest concerns people have chopah is the culture of the group in which the Coach is ultimately responsible for. Perception was and still is that these girls get together for holiday camps! Only now that the pressure has come on she's trying to work more towards a high performance model. Pretty easy to sit back on a deck chair when you get given 6 year deal and leave it up to the girls to decide what's happening. 

The stats don't lie - 3 wins from 24 games. 

Sounds like we are now lowering expectations...so a win at the world cup is now a pass mark and Jitka gets a pat on back?? come on.

Bare minimum we should be getting out of our group at home. She has a huge challenge ahead of her due to what's been allowed to go on....it will tell us if she's a coach or not. But she said she's relying on two experienced players to return? Both coming off ACLs.......dreaming.

This comment about culture might be your perception but it's not mine.  You have just made a lot of assumptions about culture and ways of working on very little information.  

I don't know about your expectations but for me it was first and foremost to win a game, if we can somehow get out the group then that's a bonus.

That's the problem. Your idea of success is winning one game, for everone else here it's getting out of our group at a home world cup.

You couldn't call klimkovas results good could you? There's been no evidence of progress the entire time she's been in charge.

do you speak for everyone on here do you?

Also I never said her record is good, I am just saying changing the coach won't magically make the team better - but I sense a pattern for you in particular, if results are not what you want them to be, sack the coach and it will be fine.  

Maybe your working for a recruitment agency, that would explain it - trying to hit your bonus.

So your logic to keep the coach essentially winds up to fudge it the ladies aren't very good so we may as well leave the team in the same shark state they're currently in. Yeah, great way to improve the team.

You think I work for a recruitment agency? Funny, from the outside some would think you're klimkova here in disguise. I'm really not sure how you could argue she's a good coach.

morgenstern12

Anyone with an honest assessment of Switzerland?. Are they beatable?. This would be like a cup final assuming we beat the Philippines.

Switzerland drew 2-2 with Portugal at the euros.

Ranix

morgenstern12

Anyone with an honest assessment of Switzerland?. Are they beatable?. This would be like a cup final assuming we beat the Philippines.

Switzerland drew 2-2 with Portugal at the euros.

Well then we are screwed.

Monto

chopah

MetalLegNZ

If she was a man, coaching the mens team, she'd be gone.

Why the different standard.

We can't win, hell, we can't even draw. 

900 minutes without a goal.

How is the media, the public not begging for her head?

It has nothing to do with her gender - that's just your bias talking.

do you not concede even in the slightest little amount that the players (as a collective) are not really good enough, sounds harsh and there are some that show promise but for me that's the hard truth.

If the players aren't good enough then surely you'd expect the coach to set the team up in a way that reflects that she understands that? I wouldn't say she's shown that she recognizes that at all.

It's not Klimkova's fault Wilkinson can't finish into an open net, or Satchell has the first touch of an elephant. As someone mentioned above international coaches get their players for only short amounts of time. Though compared to the AWs, the Ferns camps seem to be longer with more days together.

What is annoying with Klimkova as others have mentioned, is the apparent lack of pragmatism. She's been in the role 18 months now, with 18 Ferns games (prior Portugal). The core of this Ferns team (especially a first choice 11) have been around for years. She must have recognised early on the limitations of the playing group. The fact for years they had only been capable of pretty direct football.

So why hadn't a 5 at the back been tried (and likely discarded), well prior these important (especially for the public image) 3 games in NZ. Have the senior players been pushing on her a deluded idea that they can suddenly play aka Spain 2010? The pre first game double act of her & Riley "We.Will.Beat.Portugal" was embarrassing  (even before being thumped 5-0). Look I know there are some big differences between the genders. Girls just wanna have fun & the like - but still cringeworthy. The coach needs a level of seperation from the players - not just being one of the girls/boys.

It's almost like they thought they were way way better than they actually are, prior that Portugal game. Now suddenly they realise they are a bit shark, can't score a goal, and are almost last minute scrambling to find a style/setup - that gives them some hope come July.

I'd agrue a wiser coach, would have started of setting up in a more pragmatic way back in 2022, even 2021.

I liked reading Sam Wilkinson's summary a few months ago, of why the Nix ALW side needed to change how they were playing. It was a Twitter tweet. Maybe give him the Ferns job! Tongue firmly in cheek

morgenstern12

Anyone with an honest assessment of Switzerland?. Are they beatable?. This would be like a cup final assuming we beat the Philippines.

No chance with how we are currently playing. Switzerland are as good as Portugal. Norway are better than the both of them. 

Most exciting thing about Group A will be who gets 1st place out of Norway and Switzerland. 

You know the thing that really seals it for me?

The best performances of Klimkovas time in charge of the Ferns were in her first four games. Lost creditably 1-0 to Canada (after a 5-1 mauling in the first game), lost 2-1 to South Korea but genuinely dominated the first half before they were a bit too strong for us second half, won 2-0 against South Korea AWAY in South Korea and played well on the counter after a good defensive effort. 

The fact is we haven't topped those performances since - and that tells us that Klimkova has made this team worse and needs to resign. 

Monto

chopah

Monto

chopah

Showtime Nixie

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

I think one of the biggest concerns people have chopah is the culture of the group in which the Coach is ultimately responsible for. Perception was and still is that these girls get together for holiday camps! Only now that the pressure has come on she's trying to work more towards a high performance model. Pretty easy to sit back on a deck chair when you get given 6 year deal and leave it up to the girls to decide what's happening. 

The stats don't lie - 3 wins from 24 games. 

Sounds like we are now lowering expectations...so a win at the world cup is now a pass mark and Jitka gets a pat on back?? come on.

Bare minimum we should be getting out of our group at home. She has a huge challenge ahead of her due to what's been allowed to go on....it will tell us if she's a coach or not. But she said she's relying on two experienced players to return? Both coming off ACLs.......dreaming.

This comment about culture might be your perception but it's not mine.  You have just made a lot of assumptions about culture and ways of working on very little information.  

I don't know about your expectations but for me it was first and foremost to win a game, if we can somehow get out the group then that's a bonus.

chopah

Showtime Nixie

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

I think one of the biggest concerns people have chopah is the culture of the group in which the Coach is ultimately responsible for. Perception was and still is that these girls get together for holiday camps! Only now that the pressure has come on she's trying to work more towards a high performance model. Pretty easy to sit back on a deck chair when you get given 6 year deal and leave it up to the girls to decide what's happening. 

The stats don't lie - 3 wins from 24 games. 

Sounds like we are now lowering expectations...so a win at the world cup is now a pass mark and Jitka gets a pat on back?? come on.

Bare minimum we should be getting out of our group at home. She has a huge challenge ahead of her due to what's been allowed to go on....it will tell us if she's a coach or not. But she said she's relying on two experienced players to return? Both coming off ACLs.......dreaming.

This comment about culture might be your perception but it's not mine.  You have just made a lot of assumptions about culture and ways of working on very little information.  

I don't know about your expectations but for me it was first and foremost to win a game, if we can somehow get out the group then that's a bonus.

That's the problem. Your idea of success is winning one game, for everone else here it's getting out of our group at a home world cup.

You couldn't call klimkovas results good could you? There's been no evidence of progress the entire time she's been in charge.

do you speak for everyone on here do you?

Also I never said her record is good, I am just saying changing the coach won't magically make the team better - but I sense a pattern for you in particular, if results are not what you want them to be, sack the coach and it will be fine.  

Maybe your working for a recruitment agency, that would explain it - trying to hit your bonus.

So your logic to keep the coach essentially winds up to fudge it the ladies aren't very good so we may as well leave the team in the same shark state they're currently in. Yeah, great way to improve the team.

You think I work for a recruitment agency? Funny, from the outside some would think you're klimkova here in disguise. I'm really not sure how you could argue she's a good coach.

oh you got me - I have been on this forum for 11 years pretending to be someone else just so I could defend myself against a dude whose only football strategy is to sack the coach and hope for the best.  Good one.

Not bias... in fact I would argue that my view is the opposite as I am wanting her to be judged on her results the same as anyone.

Yes our players are not world beaters, which is why I don't expect us to beat USA or Canada who are leaders in the womens game. But I do expect us to do much better against teams ranked lower than us, or in the 20's.

Coaches should be judge on results - i'm judging her on hers. She has not done a good enough job.

chopah

MetalLegNZ

If she was a man, coaching the mens team, she'd be gone.

Why the different standard.

We can't win, hell, we can't even draw. 

900 minutes without a goal.

How is the media, the public not begging for her head?

It has nothing to do with her gender - that's just your bias talking.

do you not concede even in the slightest little amount that the players (as a collective) are not really good enough, sounds harsh and there are some that show promise but for me that's the hard truth.

Yes Chopah, I was obviously being serious about you being Klimkova. Jeze your sarcasm radar is a thing of beauty.

And I don't think I've called for any other coaches to be sacked? I'm not always the biggest fan of Talays system but I recognize him as well worth having around, I was a fan of Hay too. It's really just this one coach that I have a problem.

Sorry for wanting more out of the team at a home world cup. I'm just hoping NZF want more too.

We aren't blessed with attacking talent are we! 
It's a make shift side that had played. Some players out their hands up for selection for sure. Some a decent amount just confirmed that they are average and not upto it. But then who realistically do we replace them with? I would nit have 5 players from last night in my team. But what 5 would I replace them with??? Where are these world class players coming from? 
Yes they lost the games. But they improved in performance and certain metrics.  
She can only polish a terd so much.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/we-actually-got-better-football-ferns-coach-jitka-klimkova-searches-for-positives-despite-alarming-signs/J3AFOBU2KVCOHLLH7EBU6QZCKE/

Wow. Just wow. We got better over the series, well that's pretty easy to do when you start the series losing 5-0. And she's also rejected that there is any need for additional coaching input or support. So that's not happening. 

So Klimkova ain't resigning, and with a deal until 2027, NZF sure ain't sacking her. Would it be worth paying out that much when we are so close to a World Cup that little change would be possible anyway? It'd be a risk they're probably not willing to take. 

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/we-actually-got-better-football-ferns-coach-jitka-klimkova-searches-for-positives-despite-alarming-signs/J3AFOBU2KVCOHLLH7EBU6QZCKE/

Is of course behind The Herald paywall, but disappointing if she is outright rejecting getting in additional help or support. The Black Ferns provided the perfect example of how a team (female at that, at a home WC) could turn around a series of poor results in less than a year.

And of course alot of that came from having a top to bottom review, and adding in top coaches like Wayne Smith, with a proper focus on High Performance.

Surely the new GM of High Performance, Keir Hansen - can't be happy with the way the team is performing currently. There must be some inhouse review going on, to help ensure the Ferns ain't a flop at their home WC.

Maybe unlike Hay, Klimkova is all friendly/collaborative with her NZF workmates - and that's all that matters.

lthomas20

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/we-actually-got-better-football-ferns-coach-jitka-klimkova-searches-for-positives-despite-alarming-signs/J3AFOBU2KVCOHLLH7EBU6QZCKE/

Wow. Just wow. We got better over the series, well that's pretty easy to do when you start the series losing 5-0. And she's also rejected that there is any need for additional coaching input or support. So that's not happening. 

So Klimkova ain't resigning, and with a deal until 2027, NZF sure ain't sacking her. Would it be worth paying out that much when we are so close to a World Cup that little change would be possible anyway? It'd be a risk they're probably not willing to take. 

A lot easier to sack her after the world cup.

AV says Klimkova should stay (for now!). At least the other teams in the Ferns pool, struggled with their Feb friendlies as well.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/world-cup/131310532/football-ferns-can-still-achieve-world-cup-goals-but-selections-have-to-start-making-sense

Most worryingly, there were several baffling selection decisions – both at the start of matches, and during them – and that can’t continue in April and July if the Ferns are to make the history they want to at a World Cup on home soil.

A first World Cup win and a place in the knockout stages remain within their reach, especially when you consider their lengthy injury list this month, and the mixed fortunes of their group A rivals – Norway, the Philippines and Switzerland – over the past fortnight.

But Jitka Klimková’s personnel choices need to start making more sense than they did on several occasions in February, even when allowing for the fact that she was without six top players for the loss to Portugal and nine for each of the two losses to Argentina – absences that make calls for a change of coach an overreaction.

At least Foster did make it into camp in the end, unlike her exciting Phoenix team-mate Milly Clegg, who surely has to be there as a new attacking option next time, after three matches where the Ferns had just seven shots on target and 19 in total.

Not having her there this time in place of Mackenzie Barry (who played one minute as the third-choice right back), Ava Collins (27 as the sixth-choice forward) or Indiah-Paige Riley (who missed the first two matches with concussion) was another missed opportunity.

Either she has absolute blind faith in her abilities as a coach, or values $$ above all else. Only 2 possibilities IMO for her still being here.

She should have walked.

chopah

Ted Striker

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

Why can't people be critical of a terrible run of results? I don't understand. Jitka is an adult and should be treated like one. If you screwed up at your job would your boss keep saying "No worries wasn't as bad as the screw up you made last time, and the several times before that"? Is everyone just supposed to accept that the women's team are getting paid the same as the men and not held to the same level of accountability? Herbert lost his job, Hudson lost his job, Hay lost his job. Are we supposed to just pretend that they are not professionals and the coach is not a professional?

You said: "You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing"

Well it looks like you can, this from Wikipedia:

"In February 2017, US Soccer reassigned Michelle French to be a full-time assistant coach for the senior women's national team,with Jitka Klimková replacing her as head coach in April 2017. The team finished runners-up in the 2018 CONCACAF Women's U-20 Championship. In the 2018 FIFA U-20 Women's World Cup, the team failed to progress from the group stage for the first time in history."

Then to your point: "plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra."

This was a league that played 10 games. I think it is a good result indeed but a bit of stretch to say it is a formidable coaching record.

You also say: "Could it just be that we just are not that good".

It could be but we were beating Brazil as recently as 2016 so what happened? The coach picks the team. The coach comes up with the game plan. The coach gets results or develops the team for a new cycle or else they move on.

At what point in your view, does she get fired? After a poor world cup? What is the pass mark to keep her on till 2027? To win one game? I think any of us armchair critics would be quite happy to take a job where that is the measurement of success. It was thought Hay was on 250k per year, is the Women's coach getting equal pay? If so, how is winning one game against the Philippines a good return on this level of investment?

Firstly I never said people couldn't be critical, my point is I don't think any coaches within NZF's cost or influence range would be able to deliver much better.  whoever was coach for this period was going to be faced with a rebuild of sorts, with some of the veteran ferns not really delivering consistently and the young brigade maybe not really ready for this level of competition yet.

You say as recently as 2016 - that's 7 years ago, that's an eternity in international football.

Results have been poor and Jitka needs to try and solve that - my point is she has had a lot of high profile appointments and is well respected in international football, but some (and maybe not yourself) people on here think since they watch a bit of football that she is hopeless.

and to answer the question I believe in the long term rebuild they are trying to do, so yes if they win one game (not done before) at the WC then I believe she should continue (if she wants to) to see out her contract.

also just picking out something else - you said her record at W-League was a good result but it's a stretch to say it's formidable - just pointing out I didn't ever say that.

You did say that! You highlighted the "60% win record and a minor premiership" while neglecting to mention it was a 10 game season. Why would you do that? 

You say beating Brazil was 7 years ago and a lot can change, well that's just the point. It was the same players and nothing has changed except the coach and the age of the players. Look, maybe you know her personally and are friends with her and like her style but how can NZ who is one of the 20 richest countries in the world with investment and infrastructure countries like Haiti and even Argentina can only dream of be praying for a victory against the Phillippines? 

Monto

Yes Chopah, I was obviously being serious about you being Klimkova. Jeze your sarcasm radar is a thing of beauty.

And I don't think I've called for any other coaches to be sacked? I'm not always the biggest fan of Talays system but I recognize him as well worth having around, I was a fan of Hay too. It's really just this one coach that I have a problem.

Sorry for wanting more out of the team at a home world cup. I'm just hoping NZF want more too.

to be fair the recruitment comment wasn't aimed at you, nor was the coaches thing - I think there has been some conversations crossing over.

I just wanted to say in general I'm not saying I am enjoying the results - let me summarise:
1) I think Jitka has a profile that is top or near top of the profile of coaches NZF could attract right now - that's one reason I think blaming her for all the issues and moving on is naive
2) The player squad as undergone a bit of a shift and like I said before I don't think we are in a position to have a truly competitive squad regardless of coach at this world cup, perhaps the next
3) I see someone has brought up results vs world rankings - It doesn't take a genius to see lots of countries didn't even bother with women's football when we saw the ferns grab some success internationally, that has changed in the last few years and lots of countries budgets have gone up massively, I was talking to someone who said the lionesses budget went from 1 million pounds to 100 million pounds in one financial cycle.  just as an example where some countries place the women's game in terms of importance.
4) As a fan I want to see them get out of the group, but I'm just trying to add some realistic expectations.

Ted Striker

chopah

Ted Striker

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

Why can't people be critical of a terrible run of results? I don't understand. Jitka is an adult and should be treated like one. If you screwed up at your job would your boss keep saying "No worries wasn't as bad as the screw up you made last time, and the several times before that"? Is everyone just supposed to accept that the women's team are getting paid the same as the men and not held to the same level of accountability? Herbert lost his job, Hudson lost his job, Hay lost his job. Are we supposed to just pretend that they are not professionals and the coach is not a professional?

You said: "You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing"

Well it looks like you can, this from Wikipedia:

"In February 2017, US Soccer reassigned Michelle French to be a full-time assistant coach for the senior women's national team,with Jitka Klimková replacing her as head coach in April 2017. The team finished runners-up in the 2018 CONCACAF Women's U-20 Championship. In the 2018 FIFA U-20 Women's World Cup, the team failed to progress from the group stage for the first time in history."

Then to your point: "plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra."

This was a league that played 10 games. I think it is a good result indeed but a bit of stretch to say it is a formidable coaching record.

You also say: "Could it just be that we just are not that good".

It could be but we were beating Brazil as recently as 2016 so what happened? The coach picks the team. The coach comes up with the game plan. The coach gets results or develops the team for a new cycle or else they move on.

At what point in your view, does she get fired? After a poor world cup? What is the pass mark to keep her on till 2027? To win one game? I think any of us armchair critics would be quite happy to take a job where that is the measurement of success. It was thought Hay was on 250k per year, is the Women's coach getting equal pay? If so, how is winning one game against the Philippines a good return on this level of investment?

Firstly I never said people couldn't be critical, my point is I don't think any coaches within NZF's cost or influence range would be able to deliver much better.  whoever was coach for this period was going to be faced with a rebuild of sorts, with some of the veteran ferns not really delivering consistently and the young brigade maybe not really ready for this level of competition yet.

You say as recently as 2016 - that's 7 years ago, that's an eternity in international football.

Results have been poor and Jitka needs to try and solve that - my point is she has had a lot of high profile appointments and is well respected in international football, but some (and maybe not yourself) people on here think since they watch a bit of football that she is hopeless.

and to answer the question I believe in the long term rebuild they are trying to do, so yes if they win one game (not done before) at the WC then I believe she should continue (if she wants to) to see out her contract.

also just picking out something else - you said her record at W-League was a good result but it's a stretch to say it's formidable - just pointing out I didn't ever say that.

You did say that! You highlighted the "60% win record and a minor premiership" while neglecting to mention it was a 10 game season. Why would you do that? 

You say beating Brazil was 7 years ago and a lot can change, well that's just the point. It was the same players and nothing has changed except the coach and the age of the players. Look, maybe you know her personally and are friends with her and like her style but how can NZ who is one of the 20 richest countries in the world with investment and infrastructure countries like Haiti and even Argentina can only dream of be praying for a victory against the Phillippines? 

point out to me where I used the word formidable?  surely you can make your point without saying I said stuff that I didn't - you seem to have more than enough ammo with my contrasting views to be able to not do that.

Ted Striker

chopah

Ted Striker

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

Why can't people be critical of a terrible run of results? I don't understand. Jitka is an adult and should be treated like one. If you screwed up at your job would your boss keep saying "No worries wasn't as bad as the screw up you made last time, and the several times before that"? Is everyone just supposed to accept that the women's team are getting paid the same as the men and not held to the same level of accountability? Herbert lost his job, Hudson lost his job, Hay lost his job. Are we supposed to just pretend that they are not professionals and the coach is not a professional?

You said: "You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing"

Well it looks like you can, this from Wikipedia:

"In February 2017, US Soccer reassigned Michelle French to be a full-time assistant coach for the senior women's national team,with Jitka Klimková replacing her as head coach in April 2017. The team finished runners-up in the 2018 CONCACAF Women's U-20 Championship. In the 2018 FIFA U-20 Women's World Cup, the team failed to progress from the group stage for the first time in history."

Then to your point: "plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra."

This was a league that played 10 games. I think it is a good result indeed but a bit of stretch to say it is a formidable coaching record.

You also say: "Could it just be that we just are not that good".

It could be but we were beating Brazil as recently as 2016 so what happened? The coach picks the team. The coach comes up with the game plan. The coach gets results or develops the team for a new cycle or else they move on.

At what point in your view, does she get fired? After a poor world cup? What is the pass mark to keep her on till 2027? To win one game? I think any of us armchair critics would be quite happy to take a job where that is the measurement of success. It was thought Hay was on 250k per year, is the Women's coach getting equal pay? If so, how is winning one game against the Philippines a good return on this level of investment?

Firstly I never said people couldn't be critical, my point is I don't think any coaches within NZF's cost or influence range would be able to deliver much better.  whoever was coach for this period was going to be faced with a rebuild of sorts, with some of the veteran ferns not really delivering consistently and the young brigade maybe not really ready for this level of competition yet.

You say as recently as 2016 - that's 7 years ago, that's an eternity in international football.

Results have been poor and Jitka needs to try and solve that - my point is she has had a lot of high profile appointments and is well respected in international football, but some (and maybe not yourself) people on here think since they watch a bit of football that she is hopeless.

and to answer the question I believe in the long term rebuild they are trying to do, so yes if they win one game (not done before) at the WC then I believe she should continue (if she wants to) to see out her contract.

also just picking out something else - you said her record at W-League was a good result but it's a stretch to say it's formidable - just pointing out I didn't ever say that.

You did say that! You highlighted the "60% win record and a minor premiership" while neglecting to mention it was a 10 game season. Why would you do that? 

You say beating Brazil was 7 years ago and a lot can change, well that's just the point. It was the same players and nothing has changed except the coach and the age of the players. Look, maybe you know her personally and are friends with her and like her style but how can NZ who is one of the 20 richest countries in the world with investment and infrastructure countries like Haiti and even Argentina can only dream of be praying for a victory against the Phillippines? 

Nothing has changed except the coach and the age of the players - I can tell you the rest of the world has moved on big time since 7 years ago, that can't all be Jitka's fault?
I don't know her personally, although I have seen her run some sessions when she with was the Ferns age group teams.
If the whole point here is New Zealand as a country should be doing better - then sign me up for that narrative, I just don't think it's an easy fix like changing coach.  I think the fixes needed a many and wide ranging, I mean we can't even manage a club based Women's national league due to lack of numbers of decent players, so yeah I think there are other areas to concentrate on.

Infrastructure and wealth of a country means jack s in terns of football. NZF hardly flush with resources, we are not a football culture. Someone said most of Haiti team based overseas. And not sure if you aware but Argentina kind of enjoy football, think they are meant to be ok at it. Just take a look at most of Africa and the facilities they have compared to players the produce.

watching_from_far

Infrastructure and wealth of a country means jack s in terns of football. NZF hardly flush with resources, we are not a football culture. Someone said most of Haiti team based overseas. And not sure if you aware but Argentina kind of enjoy football, think they are meant to be ok at it. Just take a look at most of Africa and the facilities they have compared to players the produce.

Know what means jack shark in the context of realtime results?

Whether a place is a "football country", what its population is, how many people play football there, whether their mens team are good, etc. are actually irrelevant to a conversation around results for the Ferns. Sure these things matter when comparing funding and development and for making strategic long-term football plans, but that is not Klimkovas job. 

What matters from a results perspective is 1. How good their team is and 2. How good their individual players are. That's what actually matters out there on the pitch. And anyone can tell you that the vast majority of results and performances under Klimkova haven't been good enough with that considered. 

PS Haiti has 5 players in the French top league, then some more in lower tiers, a couple playing college soccer in the USA, and then some domestic girls as well. That's not better than NZ which has 4 players in the WSL, 2 players in NWSL, heaps of players in A-League Women, multiple playing college soccer in the USA, as well as others playing in the Danish top flight, Scotland, Sweden, etc. 

I dont want to bag the coach too much. I cant comment on her running of the High Performance environment, and I still havent been able to read the Heralds summation of the issue , due to it being behind a firewall.

But the coach has had a terrible issue with player availability, and also player performance. My impression is that we can muster a half decent backline, and half decent midfield . If at full strength in those areas, certainly we could be competitive.
On the assumption that Nayler is third choice keeper at best, then thats no so bad.

But up front, my god, we dont seem to have anyone who can hold the ball or shoot. I looked back at the last 15 games or so, and I think we only scored one goal from a forward (Wilkinson). The rest (which werent many) were from the likes of Riley,Chance and Bott.

Maybe the coach isnt doing things right, which is fair enough criticism, but I have to say the forward stocks looks very poor, nowhere near good enough. Clegg has to be considered in that environment, and will no doubt now at least be in the WC squad. But are the likes of Rennie, Wilkinson and Satchell really the best we have? They look so limited, And I doubt any coach will get us out of the WC group if thats our pop gun attack.

Showtime Nixie

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

I think one of the biggest concerns people have chopah is the culture of the group in which the Coach is ultimately responsible for. Perception was and still is that these girls get together for holiday camps! Only now that the pressure has come on she's trying to work more towards a high performance model. Pretty easy to sit back on a deck chair when you get given 6 year deal and leave it up to the girls to decide what's happening. 

The stats don't lie - 3 wins from 24 games. 

Sounds like we are now lowering expectations...so a win at the world cup is now a pass mark and Jitka gets a pat on back?? come on.

Bare minimum we should be getting out of our group at home. She has a huge challenge ahead of her due to what's been allowed to go on....it will tell us if she's a coach or not. But she said she's relying on two experienced players to return? Both coming off ACLs.......dreaming.

 
On the culture…. 
Heraf wanted to instil professional culture, but when he said that the team should stay at the team meal until everyone was done that was not appropriate. 
Not saying should have kept him; his football style was atrocious, but he was trying to make it a professional environment.

As I don't have Sky, I don't watch the ALM or ALW so I can only go on stats. 

The Phoenix ALW are by far the worst team in the comp. Clegg has played in 9 matches and only scored 2 goals. That's a poor ratio, even for someone who plays in a piss poor team. 

On the face of it, I can't understand the clamour? Aside from Phoenix fans wanting to push their player (which is fair enough). 

Without looking at the stats I'd imagine that's actually probably a better ratio compared to the other options.

Rusty Dunks

As I don't have Sky, I don't watch the ALM or ALW so I can only go on stats. 

The Phoenix ALW are by far the worst team in the comp. Clegg has played in 9 matches and only scored 2 goals. That's a poor ratio, even for someone who plays in a piss poor team. 

On the face of it, I can't understand the clamour? Aside from Phoenix fans wanting to push their player (which is fair enough). 

She hasn't started every one of those. Has also scored at U20 and U17 World Cups. I'd like to see her in the squad. But she more just represents another option and a different option rather than being a massive saviour.

Katie Rood also deserves another go. 

chopah

Ted Striker

chopah

Ted Striker

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

Why can't people be critical of a terrible run of results? I don't understand. Jitka is an adult and should be treated like one. If you screwed up at your job would your boss keep saying "No worries wasn't as bad as the screw up you made last time, and the several times before that"? Is everyone just supposed to accept that the women's team are getting paid the same as the men and not held to the same level of accountability? Herbert lost his job, Hudson lost his job, Hay lost his job. Are we supposed to just pretend that they are not professionals and the coach is not a professional?

You said: "You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing"

Well it looks like you can, this from Wikipedia:

"In February 2017, US Soccer reassigned Michelle French to be a full-time assistant coach for the senior women's national team,with Jitka Klimková replacing her as head coach in April 2017. The team finished runners-up in the 2018 CONCACAF Women's U-20 Championship. In the 2018 FIFA U-20 Women's World Cup, the team failed to progress from the group stage for the first time in history."

Then to your point: "plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra."

This was a league that played 10 games. I think it is a good result indeed but a bit of stretch to say it is a formidable coaching record.

You also say: "Could it just be that we just are not that good".

It could be but we were beating Brazil as recently as 2016 so what happened? The coach picks the team. The coach comes up with the game plan. The coach gets results or develops the team for a new cycle or else they move on.

At what point in your view, does she get fired? After a poor world cup? What is the pass mark to keep her on till 2027? To win one game? I think any of us armchair critics would be quite happy to take a job where that is the measurement of success. It was thought Hay was on 250k per year, is the Women's coach getting equal pay? If so, how is winning one game against the Philippines a good return on this level of investment?

Firstly I never said people couldn't be critical, my point is I don't think any coaches within NZF's cost or influence range would be able to deliver much better.  whoever was coach for this period was going to be faced with a rebuild of sorts, with some of the veteran ferns not really delivering consistently and the young brigade maybe not really ready for this level of competition yet.

You say as recently as 2016 - that's 7 years ago, that's an eternity in international football.

Results have been poor and Jitka needs to try and solve that - my point is she has had a lot of high profile appointments and is well respected in international football, but some (and maybe not yourself) people on here think since they watch a bit of football that she is hopeless.

and to answer the question I believe in the long term rebuild they are trying to do, so yes if they win one game (not done before) at the WC then I believe she should continue (if she wants to) to see out her contract.

also just picking out something else - you said her record at W-League was a good result but it's a stretch to say it's formidable - just pointing out I didn't ever say that.

You did say that! You highlighted the "60% win record and a minor premiership" while neglecting to mention it was a 10 game season. Why would you do that? 

You say beating Brazil was 7 years ago and a lot can change, well that's just the point. It was the same players and nothing has changed except the coach and the age of the players. Look, maybe you know her personally and are friends with her and like her style but how can NZ who is one of the 20 richest countries in the world with investment and infrastructure countries like Haiti and even Argentina can only dream of be praying for a victory against the Phillippines? 

point out to me where I used the word formidable?  surely you can make your point without saying I said stuff that I didn't - you seem to have more than enough ammo with my contrasting views to be able to not do that.

So clarify it. Why did you bring up the 60% win record and a minor premiership in a 10 game season? Are you doing it to point out how good she is or not? The use of the word "formidable" is of little relevance. You were bringing those stats up to support her credibility, which they do little to support.

watching_from_far

Infrastructure and wealth of a country means jack s in terns of football. NZF hardly flush with resources, we are not a football culture. Someone said most of Haiti team based overseas. And not sure if you aware but Argentina kind of enjoy football, think they are meant to be ok at it. Just take a look at most of Africa and the facilities they have compared to players the produce.

Have you looked at the way Argentina treat their women's team? Have you seen the cow paddocks they play on in Argentina? Have you seen the conditions that the top women team at Juventus play on? The men and women's game are not the same status even in "football culture" nations. How do you think those players from Africa succeed? The get scouted and brought to countries (often former colonial rulers) with better infrastructure and wealth or they get put in academies where they have the top resources. If the African countries had the same wealth per capita as NZ how many times would they have won the world cup already? Do you think some kid growing up literally in the garbage dumps on the outskirts of Nairobi has the chance to play organized football or even kick a football? How can you say infrastructure and wealth doesn't mean anything in terms of football?! Iceland has the same population as Christchurch do you think they would be able to have the competitive team they do if they were at the same economic level as Mozambique? All opportunity in anything is dominated by economics more than anything else.

Rusty Dunks

As I don't have Sky, I don't watch the ALM or ALW so I can only go on stats. 

The Phoenix ALW are by far the worst team in the comp. Clegg has played in 9 matches and only scored 2 goals. That's a poor ratio, even for someone who plays in a piss poor team. 

On the face of it, I can't understand the clamour? Aside from Phoenix fans wanting to push their player (which is fair enough). 

Phoenix players will always have the extra fan clamour given they exist at the forefront of consciousness, especially compared to others in the team. But I guess there is a 'why not?' factor, even though throwing a 17-year-old as the leading goal threat is a bit risky.

If you look at players like Rennie or Collins, they are in college soccer which finished in November or so. So at best they've been in off-season programs for four months possibly. Even in-season neither set the house on fire. Rennie scored zero goals at Arizona St and Collins scored three for St John's (in a weaker conference). Neither were selected in any of their respective conferences' post-season teams.

But not scoring goals is not a new issue. The Ferns have played 81 games since the start of 2015 - last two WWC cycles - and have scored 104 goals and conceded 140. 46 of those 104 goals have come in the six matches against OFC teams - 44% of their goals. In the 60 games against top 25 teams in that period - bearing in mind the FF's ranking has never been below 24 - they have scored 34 goals whilst conceding 130. As for this issue being isolated to Klimkova, none of the four coaches in that period averaged more than 0.75 goals a game against these teams.

The problems lie quite deeper than the surface, so in some respects there's nothing to be lost by chucking in Clegg. Counterarguments could be that it doesn't help putting that level of pressure on a player yet to leave high-school, certainly not pinning all the hopes on her.

Ted Striker

chopah

Ted Striker

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

Why can't people be critical of a terrible run of results? I don't understand. Jitka is an adult and should be treated like one. If you screwed up at your job would your boss keep saying "No worries wasn't as bad as the screw up you made last time, and the several times before that"? Is everyone just supposed to accept that the women's team are getting paid the same as the men and not held to the same level of accountability? Herbert lost his job, Hudson lost his job, Hay lost his job. Are we supposed to just pretend that they are not professionals and the coach is not a professional?

You said: "You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing"

Well it looks like you can, this from Wikipedia:

"In February 2017, US Soccer reassigned Michelle French to be a full-time assistant coach for the senior women's national team,with Jitka Klimková replacing her as head coach in April 2017. The team finished runners-up in the 2018 CONCACAF Women's U-20 Championship. In the 2018 FIFA U-20 Women's World Cup, the team failed to progress from the group stage for the first time in history."

Then to your point: "plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra."

This was a league that played 10 games. I think it is a good result indeed but a bit of stretch to say it is a formidable coaching record.

You also say: "Could it just be that we just are not that good".

It could be but we were beating Brazil as recently as 2016 so what happened? The coach picks the team. The coach comes up with the game plan. The coach gets results or develops the team for a new cycle or else they move on.

At what point in your view, does she get fired? After a poor world cup? What is the pass mark to keep her on till 2027? To win one game? I think any of us armchair critics would be quite happy to take a job where that is the measurement of success. It was thought Hay was on 250k per year, is the Women's coach getting equal pay? If so, how is winning one game against the Philippines a good return on this level of investment?

Firstly I never said people couldn't be critical, my point is I don't think any coaches within NZF's cost or influence range would be able to deliver much better.  whoever was coach for this period was going to be faced with a rebuild of sorts, with some of the veteran ferns not really delivering consistently and the young brigade maybe not really ready for this level of competition yet.

You say as recently as 2016 - that's 7 years ago, that's an eternity in international football.

Results have been poor and Jitka needs to try and solve that - my point is she has had a lot of high profile appointments and is well respected in international football, but some (and maybe not yourself) people on here think since they watch a bit of football that she is hopeless.

and to answer the question I believe in the long term rebuild they are trying to do, so yes if they win one game (not done before) at the WC then I believe she should continue (if she wants to) to see out her contract.

also just picking out something else - you said her record at W-League was a good result but it's a stretch to say it's formidable - just pointing out I didn't ever say that.

You did say that! You highlighted the "60% win record and a minor premiership" while neglecting to mention it was a 10 game season. Why would you do that? 

You say beating Brazil was 7 years ago and a lot can change, well that's just the point. It was the same players and nothing has changed except the coach and the age of the players. Look, maybe you know her personally and are friends with her and like her style but how can NZ who is one of the 20 richest countries in the world with investment and infrastructure countries like Haiti and even Argentina can only dream of be praying for a victory against the Phillippines? 

When it comes to Footballing infastructure, Argentina is way ahead of NZ. Even for Women, as they have their own league.

morgenstern12

Ted Striker

chopah

Ted Striker

chopah

there must be some quality coaches on here with all the armchair experts taking shots at Jitka.  You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing, plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra.
Could it just be that we just are not that good, I for one will be happy if we break our duck and win one game at the World Cup.   

Why can't people be critical of a terrible run of results? I don't understand. Jitka is an adult and should be treated like one. If you screwed up at your job would your boss keep saying "No worries wasn't as bad as the screw up you made last time, and the several times before that"? Is everyone just supposed to accept that the women's team are getting paid the same as the men and not held to the same level of accountability? Herbert lost his job, Hudson lost his job, Hay lost his job. Are we supposed to just pretend that they are not professionals and the coach is not a professional?

You said: "You don't coach the US 20 women's team if you don't know what your doing"

Well it looks like you can, this from Wikipedia:

"In February 2017, US Soccer reassigned Michelle French to be a full-time assistant coach for the senior women's national team,with Jitka Klimková replacing her as head coach in April 2017. The team finished runners-up in the 2018 CONCACAF Women's U-20 Championship. In the 2018 FIFA U-20 Women's World Cup, the team failed to progress from the group stage for the first time in history."

Then to your point: "plus for local relevance a W-League title and minor premiership, alongside a 60% winning record for Canberra."

This was a league that played 10 games. I think it is a good result indeed but a bit of stretch to say it is a formidable coaching record.

You also say: "Could it just be that we just are not that good".

It could be but we were beating Brazil as recently as 2016 so what happened? The coach picks the team. The coach comes up with the game plan. The coach gets results or develops the team for a new cycle or else they move on.

At what point in your view, does she get fired? After a poor world cup? What is the pass mark to keep her on till 2027? To win one game? I think any of us armchair critics would be quite happy to take a job where that is the measurement of success. It was thought Hay was on 250k per year, is the Women's coach getting equal pay? If so, how is winning one game against the Philippines a good return on this level of investment?

Firstly I never said people couldn't be critical, my point is I don't think any coaches within NZF's cost or influence range would be able to deliver much better.  whoever was coach for this period was going to be faced with a rebuild of sorts, with some of the veteran ferns not really delivering consistently and the young brigade maybe not really ready for this level of competition yet.

You say as recently as 2016 - that's 7 years ago, that's an eternity in international football.

Results have been poor and Jitka needs to try and solve that - my point is she has had a lot of high profile appointments and is well respected in international football, but some (and maybe not yourself) people on here think since they watch a bit of football that she is hopeless.

and to answer the question I believe in the long term rebuild they are trying to do, so yes if they win one game (not done before) at the WC then I believe she should continue (if she wants to) to see out her contract.

also just picking out something else - you said her record at W-League was a good result but it's a stretch to say it's formidable - just pointing out I didn't ever say that.

You did say that! You highlighted the "60% win record and a minor premiership" while neglecting to mention it was a 10 game season. Why would you do that? 

You say beating Brazil was 7 years ago and a lot can change, well that's just the point. It was the same players and nothing has changed except the coach and the age of the players. Look, maybe you know her personally and are friends with her and like her style but how can NZ who is one of the 20 richest countries in the world with investment and infrastructure countries like Haiti and even Argentina can only dream of be praying for a victory against the Phillippines? 

When it comes to Footballing insfastructure, Argentina is way ahead of NZ. Even for Women.

No it isn't. I can show you that it isn't. Here is a good youtube video on the state of/attitude to the women's game in Argentina.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lta-SXANwM

That video was 4 years ago indeed, here is a news article from 2019

https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/sports/argentine-womens-football-turns-professional-but-only-just.phtml

Good quote from it:

"AFA has created a fund worth US$2,600 a month for each team to pay the salaries of eight players. Those players, not enough to make up a full team, will earn 15,000 pesos each, or US$330. Those eight salaries combined amount to the typical wage of a men’s fourth-division player."

How is this better than the A-league?

But I am of course open to new information. What are you basing that on?
 

Think we off track now. but they isn't massive infrastructure and money on the favelas of Brazil... didn't seem to hinder Rivaldo, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho I'm sure the list would goes on. At the end of the day we aren't a football culture, kids aren't out on the street, in the cage, under the bridge playing pick me games of unstructured 5 aside football  ever spare moment they have. Until that happens as I'm sure it prob does in  Nairobi we won't be any good.

Back to the ferns and our lack of goal scorers.

watching_from_far

Think we off track now. but they isn't massive infrastructure and money on the favelas of Brazil... didn't seem to hinder Rivaldo, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho I'm sure the list would goes on. At the end of the day we aren't a football culture, kids aren't out on the street, in the cage, under the bridge playing pick me games of unstructured 5 aside football  ever spare moment they have. Until that happens as I'm sure it prob does in  Nairobi we won't be any good.

Back to the ferns and our lack of goal scorers.

 Ok pretty short sighted. You say it did not hinder 3 people and "the list goes on" but you skip over the millions of kids it did hinder and how much better even Brazil would be if they did have more prosperity. I would love to know how you think Iceland managed to achieve what it has? Did their kids start playing pick up games under bridges?