National League / OCL

No habla Espanol - the NZFC bitch fight

1196 replies · 141,694 views
almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jordybean wrote:

The cops haven't arrested me so I'm innocent

Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads



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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:

You'd be a very brave person to put money on this.  This isn't sponsorship dollars.  This is trust grants.  All it takes is a slight law change or more rigorous policing in some cases and that whole source could dry up.

Sure it isn't a shirt sponsor??
 
2ndBest2011-04-01 15:58:05
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

maybe Auckland City should put some money into giving their supporters an education

Founder

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
JordyBean wrote:
If that is the case (And i dont believe it is and that if DIA had found a breach then that would negate the amateur status) then NZF need to police it then? [/QUOTE] Show me where DIA has that authority to do that.
 
 
[QUOTE=JordyBean]If that is the case (And i dont believe it is and that if DIA had found a breach then that would negate the amateur status) then NZF need to police it then?
And either they have and found no problem or they cant be bothered to
Assuming they is NZF then this is the most sensible think you've said 2ndBest2011-04-01 16:03:49
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
why cant they be bothered then?
maybe because DIA have and found nothing wrong so NZF wont find anything
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
You'd be a very brave person to put money on this.  This isn't sponsorship dollars.  This is trust grants.  All it takes is a slight law change or more rigorous policing in some cases and that whole source could dry up.
 
Strictly speaking trusts funds use is questionable across large parts of sport.  One set of law changes has already sent people scurrying for cover, another could shut it off completely.
 
Another good point. While ACFC obviously have had a great deal of success getting funding from Trillion Trust they are also very reliant on them, which seems risky.
 
Percentage of ACFC's total grants & sponsorship funding to come from Trillion Trust over the last four years (approx. only as Trillion's and ACFC's financial years don't quite align):
 
Trillion trust funding / total grants & sponsorship = %
 
2006/07  333,452 / 538,224 = 62%
2007/08  451,445 / 529,193 = 85%
2008/09  505,641 / 695,505 = 73%
2009/10  481,640 / 543,296 = 89%
 
The total grants & sponsorship figures includes sponsors as well, of which ACFC have a few, so I'm guessing that they get pretty much all their grant funding from Trillion (anyone at the club like to confirm?). If anything were to happen to Trillion they could be exposed.
 
Maybe what should happen is all the NZFC franchises start applying to Trillion and ACFC start applying to some other gaming trusts so that the risk is spread across the whole league?
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
2ndBest wrote:
Hard News wrote:

You'd be a very brave person to put money on this.  This isn't sponsorship dollars.  This is trust grants.  All it takes is a slight law change or more rigorous policing in some cases and that whole source could dry up.

Sure it isn't a shirt sponsor??
 
 
Now, now, Trillion aren't a "sponsor" of ACFC they are a "community partner".
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
As a very minor side note I always find it curious that gaming machine charitable trusts require grant recipients to advertise their receipt of those grants.
 
Why should they be wasting money on advertising? 
 
They aren't a sponsor in the true sense of the word, they are a trust performing a statutory function.  They have no interest in building their brand, which is the purpose of shirt front marketing and ground signage.
 
There are two possible answers: first, that they want to link, in the minds of punters, the grant distribution to the bars the trust have gaming machines in (most likely) and second, that they want to raise general awareness of their grant distributions (doubtful).
 
Either way it's a silly waste of money.  They should be allowing clubs to monetise that shirt front space some other way.
 
IMHO anyway.
Smithy2011-04-01 16:31:47

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I agree. It does have the unfortunate side-effect of muddying the waters around grant funding vs sponsorship funding. One of the worst offenders is the New Zealand Community Trust although they recently softened their stance to be "we invite grant recipients to use our NZCT logo if they choose".
 
They actually have a whole section of their website devoted to branding as well as a brand guide: Using the NZCT logo.
 
Apparently they are "proud of the difference we make to the lives of New Zealanders and immensely grateful for the support and hard work of all our venue operators, who make each grant possible. Correct use of our logo helps to tell the NZCT story widely through our communities so that this hard work is recognised".
 
terminator_x2011-04-01 16:51:02

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Trillion Trust obviously aren't that bothered about recognising "the support and hard work of all our venue operators" however, as they aren't even listed on their website.
 
Anyone able to name some of the Trillion Trust sites in Auckland so that next time I'm up there I can support ACFC, harness racing and the Coastguard?
terminator_x2011-04-01 16:55:23

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jesus the 'pro' remark got turned into a hot topic didn't it.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Amicale 1 - 2 Auckland City
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Just off a 28 hour flight, excellent news. Two away goals in the heat.
Amicale are still quite controlled/controlling, should be a good game; Sunday 17th at 2, down at Kiwitea Street.
Just read the match report, Canty knocked over Waitak 1 nil but red card for Chris Bale stuffs his chances for the grand final.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Apparently the grand final is at Douglas Field (Trusts Stadium) not Fred Taylor. Next Sunday, 10th at 2. That's the awkward one with only 3 booths for 5,000. So we will all have to get there early. Thankfully, loads of parking.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
JordyBean wrote:
why cant they be bothered then?
maybe because DIA have and found nothing wrong so NZF wont find anything
 
The Department of Internal Affairs' Gambling Compliance Group actually has pretty limited resources to carry out investigations and audits as highlighted in this report on the effectiveness of controls on non-casino gaming machines by the Auditor General (bear in mind this report is four years old so hopefully there have been some improvements since then).
 
The DIA largely relies on taking a risk-based approached to audit (i.e. prioritise audits according to where the risk seems highest) and gaming trusts undertaking their own self-review (which will obviously then inform the risk profile of the trust). The DIA also has a Leniency and Cooperation Policy designed to encourage those with information about illegal activities to come forward by offering them immunity from proceedings.
 
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Here's a list a Trillion Trust sites in Auckland compiled from the DIA website - societies that make grants. So if you play the pokies in one of these venues there is a very good chance that some of your money will find its way to ACFC, which may or may not ring your bell!
 
Auckland City
Jacks, Balmoral
The Abbey, Greenlane
 
Manukau
Cock & Bull, Manukau
Headin' Home, Pakuranga
The Bar, Manukau
 
North Shore
The Milford, Milford
The Rudder, Takapuna
 
Rodney
Kaipara Tavern, Helensville
Muldoon's Irish bar, Orewa
 
Waitakere
Shooters, New Lynn
 
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
The only way DiA would find something wrong is by tripping over it.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News gives me the exact reason why I wont support Phoenix next season. The 'About Yellow Fever' page says "Hard News puts most of his efforts in to supporting the game". This is crap as he should be supporting NZ football (at least in some form - such as getting a few thousand supporters out to Team Welly too) and not just some foreign Aussie league. By NZ Football bailing out Phoenix so many times, the lack of money is choking our local league from becoming pro, hence the reason why they have to 'cheat' the system. So I hate Phoenix now and hope it gets axed, and am enjoying watching some of ACFC's recent games.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Yawn. You're one of few, no one cares. Go knit a tea cosy with the other three.

Fuck this stupid game

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
chris.acfc wrote:
Hard News gives me the exact reason why I�wont support Phoenix next season. The 'About Yellow Fever' page says "Hard News�puts most of his efforts in to supporting the game". This is crap as he should be supporting NZ football (at least in some form - such as getting�a few thousand�supporters out to Team Welly too) and not just�some foreign Aussie league. By NZ Football bailing out Phoenix so many times, the lack of money is choking our local league from becoming pro, hence the reason why they have to 'cheat' the system. So I hate Phoenix now and hope�it gets axed,�and am enjoying watching some of ACFC's recent games.


Dear Lord. So now it's News' fault Teedubs don't get 20k per game? Is it his fault that Auckland City can't get more than a few hundred along to their games, in a city that's conservativly twice the size of Wellington?

How many times, exactly, has NZF 'bailed out' the Phoenix? And with how much money? And during what periods?

Of course the lack of money is choking football her in general, but this is not Phoenix's fault - the lack of money is a perennial problem, not a new one. And the very fact that we're now struggling to support one professional club in a competition that has a higher earning potential and profile should indicate to you that a professional league in NZ is nothing more than a ridiculous fantasy as the things, have stood, and will stand for a long time.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Why is it that ACFC produces the most trolls per capita of any team?

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago


O Noes.  Chris has discovered my secret I don't love New Zealand football or do anything for it.  How will I ever recover?


How's my driving? - Whine here

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
dorkland dufus fc wrote:
Youse Aussie nix r faggots. We rulz and r oarsum.

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
chris.acfc wrote:
By NZ Football bailing out Phoenix so many times, the lack of money is choking our local league from becoming pro, hence the reason why they have to 'cheat' the system.
 
Interesting point of view. I wonder if that's ACFC's official position??
 
Actually it's a shame nobody sensible from the club has been on here to explain how they legitmately manage to get so much money from Trillion Trust to run a single football team, because in the meantime the vacuum is being filled by the likes of Jordy Bean and chris.acfc. With all due respect to those two they don't seemed blessed with PR expertise.
 
I am genuinely interested to know how they do it. ACFC are obviously way out in front of everybody else when it comes to securing gaming trust funding and by sharing the knowledge they could help raise the standard of the whole league. Surely that's good for everybody?
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
terminator x,Try sending them an email?
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
"It's not my responsibility for my own project failing, it's because those bastards over there are taking all the attention/money which is rightfully ours."

Oldest excuse in the book. Fact: NZ football has never had a successful national professional league. NZ rugby can barely do it either, but do you see - for example - fans of Auckland's ITM cup team cursing the Blues and hoping they fail and leave the Super 15 because they're poaching all the money and attention?

Mock the Aussies all you want, but right here right now they have the money and we don't. Yes, it would be wonderful if seven Clive Palmers appeared and were prepared to bankroll the ASB Prem teams to be full-time pro and attract top overseas talent. And if my aunty had bollocks, she'd be my uncle.

Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads



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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I'd be intereseted to know what ACFC's secret is. Then, the next time my club gets knocked back for a grant to buy equipment for our junior teams etc, I'll know what we did wrong.

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jag wrote:
I'd be intereseted to know what ACFC's secret is.


Somehow I don't think they'd be willing to share it with the rest of us.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
sanday wrote:
terminator x,Try sending them an email?
 
Yeah might do that although I would obviously want to publish any reply here.
 
Seems a bit silly though because I know they are reading this and they are always happy enough to use Yellow Fever to promote ACFC when it suits them, but nobody officially connected to the club has anything to say about this.
 
Also, I don't want to create the impression I'm trying to persecute them or anything, because I'm really not. I'm just gob-smacked (and impressed) that they can get consistently get $400k - $450k a year from Trillion Trust and think it would be great if they could give us all some insight into how they do that. But if they don't want to that's fine also, Jordy Bean will continue to do a great job of explaining why it's all the Phoenix' fault anyway!
 
 
 
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Where the media could help local footie is reading out the 'National League' results like they did on tv before I left NZ 20 something years back. So it was a shock to return and find our own results weren't 'important' enough for our own country.
Back to the footie.
I have genuinely enjoyed the NZFC this year. Great new emerging talent, some classy football too (after 10 years watching Arsenal many things seem classy).
Nice to see a growing pool of future All Whites.edward l2011-04-05 12:02:24
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
el grapadura wrote:
Jag wrote:
I'd be intereseted to know what ACFC's secret is.


Somehow I don't think they'd be willing to share it with the rest of us.


Somehow, i don't think they have to.

Three for me, and two for them.

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
No one has said they do.  People are suggesting it would be nice to know so all the game in this country can benefit from their knowledge.
 
Not that I'm advocating they should.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Buffon II wrote:
el grapadura wrote:
Jag wrote:
I'd be intereseted to know what ACFC's secret is.[/QUOTE]

Somehow I don't think they'd be willing to share it with the rest of us. [/QUOTE]

Somehow, i don't think they have to.
 
The reason they might like to is because fans of ACFC are fond of coming on this forum and making statements like:
 
[QUOTE=alireggae]Maybe if all other clubs upped their game then the league would grow, thus attracting further sponsorship thus attracting more punters and lo and behold NZ has a league to be proud of.
 
[QUOTE=chris.acfc]By NZ Football bailing out Phoenix so many times, the lack of money is choking our local league from becoming pro.
 
All the while ACFC seems to be sitting on the answer. After all, if all NZFC franchises were able to consistently access nearly half a million dollars per annum from their local gaming trust (without ever having an application turned down) then the NZFC would be humming.
 
The place for competition is on the field. Off the field we need more cooperation and knowledge sharing if the NZFC is to survive, let alone grow.
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
chris.acfc wrote:
Hard News gives me the exact reason why I wont support Phoenix next season. The 'About Yellow Fever' page says "Hard News puts most of his efforts in to supporting the game". This is crap as he should be supporting NZ football (at least in some form - such as getting a few thousand supporters out to Team Welly too) and not just some foreign Aussie league. By NZ Football bailing out Phoenix so many times, the lack of money is choking our local league from becoming pro, hence the reason why they have to 'cheat' the system. So I hate Phoenix now and hope it gets axed, and am enjoying watching some of ACFC's recent games.
 
Chris, at the most basic level it's been established over the previous 4 or 5 pages that ACFC receives between 75 and 90% of its funding from money earmarked for amateur sport.  That's the same for all of the NZFC.  If the league went pro that tap goes, flick, switched off.  The Phoenix has nothign to do with that.  There is no money for a professional football league in NZ - none, nada, zilch.  Get your head out of the sand and debate the real issues, some of which are genuine (TW is struggling massively competing in the same market as the Phoenix, poor conversion rate of NZFC players into the Phoenix, potential greay areas in funding for our national league, possible future issues for players who have played in "amateur" NZFC qualifying for college in the states). 
 
This crap you peddle is just completely stupid.  Look at Netball.  Netball has huge corporate sponsors, good attendances, television coverage and is a very popular sport in NZ.  And how much do they get paid?  f**k all.  Is it professional?  No.
 
Look at Rugby, our most popular game.  Gets crowd, gets corporate funding.  No money and the competition is dying.
 
The future of professional football is not a NZ domestic league.  IT WILL NOT HAPPEN, it can't, not with the levels of support, supporter behaviour (NZers for various reasons don''t attend a lot of live sport), and the ability to self fund.  You can't just decide that a league will "go pro", there is no business case for it AT ALL!
 
Our future is an "amateur", semi pro domestic league.  We need to figure out how to make the league as good as we can within those parameters.  Some people believe that a more competitive league would be a good thing, hence why they are looking at ACFC and their financials and asking questions.  Personally I think that's a red herring.  I don't like gambling machine money being used to pay players and have said so in the past.  But ACFC are a good, well run outfit and they are ambitious and have done some good things. 
 
The fans on the other hand...

Normo's coming home

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Kiwi football..
 

SPANISH TRIO AT THE �DOUBLE� FOR �SUPER CITY� DERBY FINAL

AUCKLAND � Auckland City may turn to its three Spanish signings for inspiration as the club charges toward a fifth ASB Premiership title chance �with the chance of a treble �double� looming.

Manel Exposito, Angel Berlanga and Albert Reira all signed for the Auckland City club this season and each has added unique value as the club goes in search of trophies. Former Barcelona striker Exposito made his first team debut for the Catalan club alongside FIFA World Player of the Year Lionel Messi in a friendly match with FC Porto in 2003. Reira lists his most difficult opponent as Andres Iniesta. Now 30-year-old Exposito finds himself alongside compatriots Berlanga and Reira in this Sunday�s ASB Premiership Grand Final in West Auckland.

�The ASB Premiership is a good league. Rugby and Cricket seem to be more important in New Zealand,� Exposito said, �but the ASB Premiership is growing in standard in importance every year and will keep getting better. One of the principle reasons I came to New Zealand is the chance to play at the FIFA Club World Cup, and to qualify is a big target for us,� he added.

Four goals in six league appearances and a last gasp winner over Magenta in Noumea proved Exposito�s acquisition was a shrewd move by co-coach Ramon Tribulietx.

With Auckland City edging closer to a third �double�, Exposito says pure enjoyment of the new Spanish style has been a major factor in the Kiwitea Street club�s success to date.

�Aaron and Ramon work hard to create a new style at Auckland City but the players enjoy it. I think it�s a different style but easy to play because the boys know that they can have more possession and get more touches on the ball,� he said.

Co-coach Aaron MacFarland says �buy-in� from the players has been vital in realising the brand of football the MacFarland-Tribulietx partnership wants their team to express. Exposito, he says, was an important signing target.

�Manel was hand-picked and encouraged to come over and it worked,� MacFarland said, �All of the players, regardless of whether they are local or from overseas, want to play to play this brand. It�s a satisfying way to play and it shows in the fact that everyone is still at training right up until this week ,pushing for selection, even though we�ve stuck with almost the same starting eleven for the last six weeks.�


But Auckland City won�t have it all their own way with the ASB Premiership minor title holders eager to defend the championship they won convincingly last season.

�Waitakere play a different to us but they try to play good football and they won the league with 36 points, so that was a great achievement,� Exposito said, �They have good players to play their style and they got results with that style but we have our own style that we want to play. I wouldn�t say that one style is better than the other.�

Shifting to the other side of the world to chase his dream of playing at the FIFA Club World Cup was no easy decision but the former Atletico de Madrid frontman says the transition has been made easier with the help of team-mates Riera and Berlanga. The value of the Spanish trio was recognised when Berlanga snared the ASB Premiership Player of the Month award for January.

�I live with Angel and spend a lot of time with Ramon. He�s been here for a long time and knows all about New Zealand, all about the league, all about the club. Auckland City is like a family, they treat me like a son and that makes it easy [to adjust],� he said.

Co-coach MacFarland says the three Spaniards have added enormous value both on and off the pitch.

�They are three very different personalities. Manel loves to show off, play the clown and be the centre of attention while Angel is shy and reserved. Then there�s easy going Albert who gets a bit of stick from the boys for his scruffy look,� he said.

Unlocking Kiwi defences has proved no problem for a player who lists his most difficult opponent as Ricardo Carvalho, the former Chelsea and Portugal defender. But Exposito is modest when he says finding his way to goal in the ASB Premiership has been far from easy.

�New Zealand teams have very hard defences. It�s common to receive a hard tackle. In Spain defences may be more tactical but NZ defences are more physical and that makes it very hard to play for the strikers,� he said.

With injuries and suspension leaving the identity of Waitakere United�s backline for this Sunday�s domestic showpiece unconfirmed, former All White Aaron Scott, currently with the West Auckland side, said his team-mates would have to be aware of a player he said was capable of �pulling something out of the bag.�

Exposito prefers to acknowledge his Auckland City team-mates who have each contributed to the club�s run this season.

�We have a very good team and players who want to play an attractive style of football. I thought that when I come from Spain they would play a different style but everyone is starting to play really good football,� he said.

Tribulietx said Auckland City�s tactical philosophies would not change for the final match of the domestic season.

�We�re not going to change the way we play. That style is what has given us this opportunity to win the ASB Premiership. Playing our best football is the only way we are going to beat a team like Waitakere, � he said.

The ASB Premiership Grand Final between Waitakere United and Auckland City gets underway at Trusts Stadium, Henderson, on Sunday 10 April, 2011, kick-off 2pm. The match will be broadcast live on Sky Sport 2 and Radio Sport with live text updates available atwww.asbpremiership.co.nz.

Founder

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Doesn't say how much they're paying them!

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Being amateur footballers,they wouldn't be paid. You know that Jag.
 
Must be hard keeping up with such training and football commitments while holding a full time job to pay the bills. Wonder where they all work?

Allegedly

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Sorry mate. I forgot.
 
Nice of them to come all the way from Spain just to play amateur football in little old New Zealand.
 
3 Spaniards, eh? You can't beat real, grass roots Kiwi football. Played by Kiwis for Kiwi supporters.
Jag2011-04-08 15:44:37

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Don't forget folks [I'm pretty sure] Team Wellington are doing the same thing just on lesser scale. We have more than three foreign strikers on our side, who I refuse to believe play for free. You could argue that ACFC are just doing it better than us. TopLeft072011-04-08 16:03:52

Fuck this stupid game

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