AFC Announcement on future of Phoenix

Living in Melbourne now you know very well that it's only a few 15 year old dickheads with no idea of how the game had to re-build itself here that caused the disruption the other day.

Also, you know damn well that the (vastly) pro-AFL media in Melbourne are sniffing for any story at present to bring soccer into disrepute.

You know better valeo, I'm sure you do.
diego's son2009-12-21 16:24:52

It changed in 2009 so that basically travel and accommodation expenses were covered for participating teams. From memory, it was about $US60,000 for a win in the group stages this year.

Sounds like something we can certainly relate to.

He can't lose something he doesn't have. Oceania support is aligned behind the Blatter/Platini camp.

RedGed hit the nail on the head that surely it would be smarter for MBH to try and change that, i.e. actually support the Nix and the Oceania 11, bring the OFC under the AFC's wing as some kind of little brother relationship (Blatter would try to counter that), and try to change the political landscape. Perhaps if he does this he runs the risk of alienating his support in the Middle East, hence politically he is stuck between a rock and a hard place.

I can't help thinking that come FIFA president election time that people will be able to level the charge at MBH that he is anti-football because he killed professional football in NZ and Oceania, however I also can't believe that MBH hasn't thought of this. He must be an astute politician to have got as far as AFC president and as an astute politician he has most likely thought several steps ahead.

Give us a team in the W-League instead

Well he is a crafty dork whatever compromise he "miraculous" does. And we all still hate him and people would figure out that he reigns by pitting others against themselves. Blatter/Platii will push for the Oceania 11 as well as the Nix.

The threat to ban A-League Clubs to play ACL will be under fire from the FIFA Appeals Committee and AFC will look dumb making such ban exist.

Other Countries from the South East such as China, South Korea and Japan would want Australian A-league club to play because it will downgrade the competition and they would feel that they can't topple Australia who is number one ranked AFC national team without some important club matches in the ACL.

With Australia being number one ranked as well as being having up to the likeihood of 14-16 teams in the next 5 years, It would be crazy not to have 3-4 A-League teams in the ACL. To have only one team or even two teams like some of the weak AFC nations is a slap to the Confederation itself. Mr Bin Asia is sure to lose his seat in the next AFC elections. I am willing to bet that he will back off since the AFC nations that are completing in the World Cup are from the East Asia.

If we are to look at it from the West Asian view. They would see that the 5 places in the WC are taken by 3 East Asian teams and 2 Oceania teams. They are such a jealous lot.

If NZ does well at the World Cup, then global wise, international nations would have to reevaluate how strong Oceania was for the last 30 years. Even the coefficients of the confederation would have to change in the ranking calculations. I still believe that for every OFC nation (including Australia as Oceania nation) ranked along side each of the 4 AFC nations that they would be similar ranked to. The OFC teams would best the AFC teams and is hereby the equal if not better confederation. Not as weak as some may think.

In the final analysis, it was because the OFC nations were as poor as most of the AFC teams with even less international games so they could not secure much FIFA ranking points.AllWhitebelievr2009-12-22 17:52:01

That's where I was heading to as well.
If Mr Bin Hammin encourages support of Oceania in a fostering, big brother/little brother way there will be an alliance created between our confederations, it may placate FIFA and Mr Blatter -possibly even reduce his influence in Oceania- and when the world presidents vote comes around, it won't be forgotten.

 I suggested earlier a joint lobbying by AFC and OFC to increase World Cup spots in the WC from 32 to 36, with at least 2 new spots to AFC plus the OFC winner invited to compete in later rounds of WCQs.
Whether or not the governing body would increase the number of World Cup spots I don't know-the round of 18 would be tricky to further reduce- BUT if Mr Bin Hammin was on to it he'd ensure any extra WC spots not assigned in Asia went to those confederations he most needs influence in.

I'm not going to read through 13 pages of Bin Hamman slagging angst, and occasional common sense, so apologies if I repeat what someone else says.

For those who follow F1, this is what Bernie Ecclestone does (and has done time and time again).

Stripes2009-12-23 04:03:54

I think that any attempt to resolve this issue by making the Phoenix look more "Australian" or "Asian" is dangerous because it further distances the Nix from its core support in a commercial, promotional and marketing sense. There's no point in having an A-League team in New Zealand if it isn't perceived by the public as being a NZ team.

I said 'fighting amongst themselves', not 'fighting Sydney fans'. Those incidents were pretty isolated like usual and obviously were just a couple of idiots. (from both sides) The Herald Sun always jumps on those incidents, of course. It's going to be interesting to see if they do the same for Heart as they seem to be sponsoring them, much like the Age does for the Victory?

I don't think any 'active' Melbourne supporter would want to think they are part of something called a  'supporters club'.
valeo2009-12-23 10:54:32

But my point is not about what is mandatory, it is about who the nix have in their starting line up in order to be competitive in the league,

I just think Option 3 is too hard a sell in NZ, to the point of "why f**king bother". That team may as well be based in Canberra or somewhere else.

If we could argue for kiwi boys not to be imports at other squads it would probably help our case if instead of just NZers we argued for all Oceanians to be exempt from import status. 

If it came down to it, i could still support a wellington team full of Aussies and the best NZ has to offer. If you look at the Pemier League some teams would be lucky to field 1 or 2 English players in a game, I would be devastated if the nix were gone for ever.

Yeah I'd still support the nix. Id prefer to have NZers in the team but if not then so be it. Why do they need to be nzers for people to support them?

The problem of an Australian player based team is perhaps not so relevant for the passionate supporters on here but would be a big problem for Mr. Joe Average, hence it would be very hard to ever grow crowds beyond 6-7k.

Actually for me as a passionate fan I have a problem, I'd say casual fans would care less.

I don't think it's as clear cut as that Loz.  If that Team Wellington game had been at 14:00 instead of so close to the evening match there would have been more there.

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/a-league/lowy-urged-to-seal-kiwi-deal-271327

With respect, you're a passionate All Whites fan.  There are fans of WPFC who don't see it as "AWFC".

Agree with that.  I'd prefer kiwi's but even if it had to be 18 Aussies or whatever then I'd support them through thick and thin just like I do with the current player base.

The whole issue here is the level of 'assistance' that Oceania gets from Australia's move to Asia.

If FIFA, the AFC and the OFC are serious about this 'assistance', there should be a mandatory requirement for 2 squad members from non-NZ Oceania countries as a minimum to be in Phoenix's squad (not necessarily first team, but at least as part of the 23). Looking at it holistically, we're talking CONFEDERATIONAL assistance to Oceania, not just NZ.

The Asian Champs League is an AFC thing, so they can have a say on that, so if they say 'No NZ players" then that is their call.

Following the recent AFC announcement, I'll guarantee this:

1. The proposed 'Oceania's 11' team won't happen
2. No more NZ-based teams will be allowed into the A-League in the short term.

Whilst the WPFC have put on a better show that the NZ Knights, it was the FFA's insistence in 2007 for a NZ-based (and Terry's cash) that got WPFC into existence.

Whilst (corporately) the FFA is supportive, there is still some general street-level questions as to why there is a NZ-based team in the A-League. The tide has changed, but there is still street-level questions in Oz about the matter.

I'll leave it at that for now.

You're letting your inner mdm come out there DS.

I'll play the one-two here: don't we back Durante as one of our boys, even above (say) Mulligan?  Same for Lia, right?  I'll step out a bit and say that there is a special place for Wellingtonians in WPFC, but if they're from further away than the Hutt Valley they might as well be from Mars.

girls are form mars, boys are from venus

yea stripes, get it right............

Yeh but your granny's an Aussie

Don't fully know what you mean there fully, but I think the main problem here is the politics behind it, it's all to do with the fact that NZ and Australia are in different football confederations these.

Both sides can argue till they're black and blue in the face, truth is the matter will come down to either:

1. Lowy
2. Bin Hamman
3. Blatter

Or possibly:

4. Court of Arbitration for Sport

That's what this is, sporting politics at its best.

I know nothing about the Court of Arbitration for Sport.  Anybody in the know speculate as to what the result could be?  Would they consider most of our argument a sentimental, thus invalid, one (aka it would kill Oceanic football)?