In The Zone - The End

How so?

Hey Smithy, with the reserve team/amateur stuff is it not also a problem being registered across two confederations if trying to transfer between constantly?

Coming from a more general Kiwi sports/football fan perspective... it would be great to hear more about the report, and the fact they aren't at least providing some sweeping generalisations or key points/goals/changes that have been identified.

As alluded on the poddy, they needn't name names in terms of feedback, or who was necessarily at fault. What they do need to tell stakeholders (in my belief) is what they've learn't (however vague) and what they are going to do to lift their game (punnage intended).

They take hundreds of thousands of dollars in fees/subscriptions from thousands of people across the country. Whether they're engaged or not (and the fact most aren't probably says enough) they deserve to know the intent of the national body and broadly, how those funds are being "invested" in their game.

In addition, it's potentially a great opportunity to re-engage some of the people, fans, corporates and christ knows who else has drifted away from the game following the heights (and opportunity) of 2010.

Kinda reminds me of what happened in the 80's (when I was playing/involved/engaged in football, following '82)...

Not sure I agree with Smithy's assertion that ASB Prem is a higher std of football than the NYL.

The three Aussie NYL teams currently playing in NPL are doing quite well:

Newcastle Jets - 1st out of 10 teams after 6 games

Brisbane Roar - 4th out of 13 teams after 10 games

Perth Glory - 7th out of 12 teams after 8 games

And yes, it's bloody bizarre that NZF won't even release a summarised/watered-down version of that World Cup Review.

And also, I don't agree that the Federations don't represent Joe Average. OK, maybe they don't in practice, but they damn well should.

It's meant to be a democracy - players vote reps onto club boards - clubs vote reps onto Federation Boards - Federations vote reps onto the NZF Board.

They problem is that it's all a rather slow and laborious process to effect change right at the top and that wears people out and they end up not giving a fuck or not believing it possible.

But ultimately, if the players and other stakeholders give up on their democratic right to effect change then there won't be any change.

So yes, I think all stakeholders should feel free to speak out - individually or collectively - and NZ Football should listen because otherwise (although it may take a while) we are going to get rid of you.

Yes they do. 3 of the 7 positions are elected by the Federations.

At the upcoming Congress 2 of the 3 elected positions are up for grabs. One appointed position will also be advertised.

This was all covered in excruciating detail in the "Effecting Change at NZF" thread.

Kenny's Mrs is admired.

TBF those three NPLs (North NSW, QLD, and WA) are considered well below the likes of the VPL. QLD maybe not so much. But if we assume the ASBP is at or near the VPL level, then the ASBP should be stronger than most of the NYL teams.

Below NSW and Victoria but similar to the Brisbane comp I think has been the general concencus.

OK, OK, Newcastle are carving up one of the weaker leagues (but they are still carving it up) and Perth are just rubbish at everything they do. Brisbane are making a strong showing in the Queensland NPL which totally counts.

It doesn't matter though because like everyone else on the planet except JD and a couple of knitters I think the Nix Reserves in the ASB Prem is a no-brainier and the std is more than good enough.

It's certainly true that the Federation Boards tend to look within their own ranks for nominees for the NZF Board and I'm not aware that there's been too many openly contested elections in past years (meaning the Feds tend to nominate the same number of people as their are vacancies - and there's a bit of pre-Congress horse-trading goes on).

Fed Boards have the same 4 appointed, 3 elected structure as the NZF Board so it would be interesting to know whether they have tended to nominate candidates for the NZF Board from their elected or appointed members in the past. Obviously the former would seem slightly more democratic than the latter.

I'm pretty sure Frank van Hattum was an elected Capital Federation Board member who then got nominated & elected to the NZF Board. He went from club to Fed (elected by club reps) to Fed Chairman (elected by Fed Board members) to NZF (elected by Fed reps) to NZF Chairman (elected by NZF Board members). Classic rise through the ranks and, at face value, completely democratic.

However, it's interesting that at no point did any rank and file NZF member (apart from at his own club) ever actually vote for Frank van Hattum. Most NZF members only ever get the opportunity to vote people onto their own club's committee (and most don't even take that opportunity). From that point on they can only try and influence the people who actually get to vote at different points in the process. Is that democracy?

I don't have a 'burning desire' to read the review, I do however think it's imperative for any body who takes fees from all players to make these things public. If I'm paying $64 from my subs to NZF/Mainland Football combined, then i believe I am entitled to almost complete transparency from that body.

I say 'almost' as I believe that some if it needs to remain confidential, but there must be plenty that could be made available without doing too much damage to particular individuals.

The over-riding natural connclusion is that the report absolutely slams the board and their appointees (Herbert, FDJ etc) and they're protecting their own arses.

Another thought - it might be good to try and get some visibility over:

- whether Capital Football is going to be nominating anyone (whether it's a CF Board member or not) for either of the two elected vacancies for the NZF Board at the upcoming Congress

- who Capital Football intends voting for (if not making their own nomination)

with a view to possibly influencing that.

If they are not nominating anyone they might not know who they are going to vote for if the other nominees haven't been circulated by NZF yet (probably need to ask NZF what the timetable is for that).

Anyway, I might email Richard Reid and try and find out. Others could do the same.

Interviewing Andy Martin on Monday.

I feel that at least some version of the report should be made public, so I am all for yellow fever as a collective kicking up a stink

#InTheZone V114 is out at www.yellowfever.co.nz/podcasts. 

The pod is back, but with technical difficulties (sorry!), to chat Fever Hui, the pursuit of Michael McGlinchey, and the lack of interest in Tim Payne. The international segment makes a return with the first of a four part World Cup preview. And the pod is rounded out with an extended interview with NZF boss Andy Martin.

Audio is a bit dodgy sorry.

Whose idea was it to record the pod in a submarine?

Martin sounds like he has some substance.....considering he has only been here a few months he has a solid grasp of the issues facing the game. Plus some sound ideas on what should happen next. Looks like Nixettes will most prob be playing in ASB later this year....Great.

I thought he sounded good but you would expect that with his background.  I thought there were a couple of important things I picked up:

- he mentioned that he wanted more NZ qualified players playing in NZ, I took that to mean less foreign players in the national league, so maybe the qualification as a local player will change

- the stand down between Phoenix and ASBP looks like it will go, which is actually quite big.  Opens up the whole of the ASBP for the Phoenix to recruit from more easily on short term deals - which is why I kind of don't get why the Phoenix are so keen on a reserve team in the ASBP. They'll want the best players and I think they won't be the ones playing for Phoenix Reserves, which will end up as a youth team plus some fringe 19-22 year olds and the Phoenix squad members not playing that week.

- we will not get any real detail about the report and the board has decided they don't want it in the public domain, the vision for the All Whites he talked about will be a completely different thing altogether

Interesting. If the stand down period goes between Nix and ASBP goes, will the stand down between other ASBP teams and incoming pros then also go? One would think it would have to. And if it does, then that would seemingly negate the "more NZ qualified players/less foreign players in the ASB" point.

Not sure about this. I think they want to develop a reserve team, that is essentially a youth team supplemented with non-match day players. Surely this is a good thing? More young players are in a professional environment for 9 months of the year. The Phoenix get to develop these players and offer pro contracts to the ones who are developing the most. It a way to filter out the talent coming through rather than taking a punt of the Rufers/Ridentons/Adams of the world.

Wow that sound.

I guess it depends on the age of the player they expect to have in this team. I suspect it will be similar to the NYL in Aussie, so the late teens to bridge the gap between that and the full Phoenix squad. So perhaps the coaches involved with the WPFA will also be involved with the reserve team. Maybe Greenacre is there too? Who know.

At the moment the pathway is:
Feds/private academies
National Youth League
ASBP
Nix

But if you are a 17/18/19 yo kids there are only a few ASBP spots available as you are competing with senior players and foreign players. I see this, and I could be way off the mark, as providing more ASBP opportunities for this age group, while giving fringe Nix players game time. Isn't that good for both the Phoenix, and for football in NZ in general?

yea the audio made it hard to hear some of the time, but content wise was another good listen

The bit that jumped out of the Andy Martin interview was him saying the Phoenix are a NZ team in the A-League. That is an about face from the Aussie team residing in NZ we have always been told we are.