Huawei Wellington United Phoenix Academy Football School of Excellence - WeeNix

1) Will be used with reserves to play mid week games.

2) Ricki told me they are likely to use those players as injury replacement.

3) Can't see why not.

sounds like he's got cold feet, all of a sudden

arf arf!!!   very funny!

Cold feet is always a problem when you go to the Antartic!

 No issue because Doubt TW would want him either. 

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/7168530/Two-A-league-spots-dangled-in-front-of-young-guns?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

told you so

Here's a question - who has more qualification to run this thing, Chris Greenacre or Declan Edge?  I like the idea of this programme but I worry about its implementation.  This is a start and gives us a bit more depth but youth development is about kids of 12/13 not 20 - this isn't really youth development at all.  By the age these guys are all of the key skills are in built, you can teach fitness and tactical awareness but you're not really going to improve technique

Really good piece on 3news about the 'school of excellence'. Their first task was cleaning kit and boots etc, and Durante mentioned "assigning himself one of them", bit of a laugh. 

Good to see it stretched to 9 with the inclusion of Hamish Watson too, he's a big strong kid who scores goals for fun. Training against Siggy and Dura will only make him better. 

The best of the kids - the Howiesons, Woods etc - will still be picked up by clubs overseas but the Nix will get the next pick of the best the country has. That's what makes this whole thing so good, less kids are being overlooked in our country now when they are at the crucial age when they need to move up from the likes of ASBP. 

I agree to an extent TL07 - but actually the next best kids (kosta, marco, cameron, draper, spoonley etc) were already getting picked up.  Personally I would be going younger but I take your point

Also in that piece Ricki said they were looking at establishing academies in Auckland and Christchurch too in the future.

not just in the future, in a few months!

Wonder how that would work? a younger age group? Cause that could be cool if they had 12-18 yos in the three centres.

Not sure I agree there.  Surely being in a full time enviroment can help improve passing technique for example.  More you practice, the greater your success rate.

Declan Edge...hands down. Or Colin Tua.

Handing this job straight to Greenacre is a bit of a slap in the face for all those kiwi coaches who have done the hard yards season after season coaching kiwi youth. Full time professional coaching jobs are rare in this country, its a shame the net was not cast a bit wider. Greenie has got the gig coz he is a good bloke and will "fit" in. The fact that he has almost no coaching experiance and has done zero work at youth coaching level seems to be overlooked.

If you read about the great football coaching academies around the world one thing that really sticks out. They all stress getting the best possible people running these things is the key. Coaching youth is a specialised job. Fine getting Greenie to come in and do specialist striker sessions but getting him to run the thing????????

The best qualifications in the world don't necessarily make you the best person for any job.  I've seen plenty of people qualified up the Whazoo lose out on a job or get moved out of it because they don't fit the environment or the culture or the goals of the organisation.

Declan is doing some great things in the Waikato but he has always marched to the beat of his own drum.  Knowing what I know of him (and I have lived in Hamilton for half my life) he wouldn't fit the Phoenix, he wouldn't fit much that he wasn't totally in charge of.

The reason he has his own Academy is because running one for someone else wouldn't work.  The reason he is head coach of Waikato is because he couldn't be someone's assistant.

As for Greenie, do you know what coaching he has done?  He's more qualifed than just about anyone in New Zealand with his UEFA badges, he definitely fits the culture and aims of the club and he has done service here that earns him a chance to learn the ropes at a professional club. 

As for Colin, is he even coaching anymore, hasn't he moved into administration more?

Watching Declan's team play this year was one of the most ridiculous things I saw all season in football.

http://www.proelitefootball.co.nz/

I'm just being provacative really - I don't really want Declan to coach the kids, it just all comes back to my concern that there is only one football voice in NZ football right now

Yes, I am also concerned about Ryan Nelsen's influence. I heard from a very good source that he did all the coaching at the World Cup.

I agree that Declan is in his own space...a bit like mad Wynton. But I still am to be convinced that Greenie is the best person to coach our youth academy. 

I was not talking about people having academic qualifications for the job....I was talking about on the ground experiance. 

I disagree that we should give him the job because of loyal service and give him a chance to learn the ropes.....Ifill is a great bloke, has years of pro experiance. What say he wants a coaching job when he finishes up as a player? Do we find something for him as well? There is plenty of evidence in coaching literature that suggests players returning straight back to a club in a coaching capacity rarely works. Going from being one of the lads to coach is too big a change.

We are meant to be a fully professional football club. That means getting the very best people  that we can afford. 

I agree with JD that we have a one football voice issue at the Nix. In my opinion Ricki needs a strong assistant. Someone who can bring an alternative point of view and is not afraid to make suggestions. Someone who can bring stuff from their own extensive coaching background. Greenie will be the apprentice under Ricki, very much the junior partner.

In the mean time if anyone can provide a comprehensive rundown on Greenies coaching experiance I will shut up!

So, what you're advocating is signing someone who has previously clashed with Ricki on coaching and selection matters, perhaps someone who has previously run a youth set-up like the one the Phoenix have, but even better would have been involved at another A-League club with a full youth set-up.  Perhaps even someone with experience of the NZ game, NZ players and the ASB Premiership?

Now, where would we find someone with that?

Knocked in a few for Hawkes Bay in the ASB Premiership, now back at Lower Hutt leading the Golden Welly in the Central league.

A young D Mac  ??

Regarding Greenacre, in the business world the first thing you ever do is look to promote from within. Keeps your staff motivated and you know what you are getting. Don't under-estimate the importance of someone fitting the culture. Greenacre has a gold mine of experience from doing the hard yards in the UK professional leagues and now would know enough about football in this part of the world as well. He already has a couple of years mentoring younger players within the Nix squad, and he is also just as qualified as John Aloisi and John Kosmina, to give a couple of examples.

Rule Number One :  Trainees clean the boots

Agreed.

This is not going to be a youth coaching set-up per-se, more like a professional finishing school and an extended trial for stepping up to the full-time Phoenix squad. Greenacre seems well-placed to do that (notwithstanding my earlier prediction that if we fail to secure another striker and/or import player Greenacre could end up back on a playing contract anyway. He will almost certainly pop-up as injury cover sometime during the season).

wrong thread

Yes, but the worry is what football these guys are going to be taught.  

There are two issues here. The assistant coach and Greenacres role.

You don't need to find someone who has clashed with Ricki...thats just silly. IMO Ricki would be an even better coach at the Nix if he had someone experianced as an assistant to act as a sounding board. Someone who could offer an alternative opinion based on their own coaching experiances. A bit like Raul Blanco did at the WC for the Aw's. Being an experianced player(Greenacre) does not equal instantly being a coaching expert.

As for finding somewhere better than Greenie. I can't believe there are not better candidates in NZ or Australia. I did not see the list of applicants so I don't know who applied but if they gave the job to someone who doesn't appear to have coached before then the rest of the applicants must have been really bad.

As for other names what about that guy Mulvey???? He did a fantastic job with the GC youth and has A-League assistant experiance. He would be excellent in both roles at the Nix. 

I guess we will have to disagree on this. I really hope that Greenie does a good job. With the club adopting a recruit within policy it is absolutely vital they get the Academy program right.

You mean Stu Jacobs, Luciano Trani and Vaughan Coveny ...all rolled into one!  ;-)

Deleted

1: The best coaches in NZ that have toiled away for years may not be a patch on Greenacre. To be fair to NZ, we understand rugby instantly because its our culture. The English understand football instantly because its their culture. The toiler may not have anything on Greenie simply because of a culture reason much like a 35 year veteran rugby coach from Ukraine has nothing on Pat Lam (arguably the worst Super 15 coach right now) because of a culture thing.

2: I think 'youth development' is probably the wrong term because as you alude, the youth really get their skill set before 20. Perhaps a better name (and its not a good connotation) is a Phoenix Grooming School whereby we are taking promising young footballers and putting them into a pro environment to help them grow to the benefit of the Phoenix and to be pro footballers.

3: There is perhaps only one voice right now. If you put up any alternatives, would they be better at it than the current? There are many candidates and most of them do not fit for a variety or reasons. That doesn't make it right or wrong but to change the status quo, you have to do it for the better.

Hey, let's not confuse the concern that "there is only one voice in NZ football right now" with a discussion about coaching appointments at the Phoenix. They are two different discussions.

There should only be one voice at the Phoenix. Just like at any other club the assistant and youth coaches report to the head coach and should follow their direction. Yes, you want people who have their own ideas and are not afraid to make suggestions but at the end of the day if the head coach says "the sky is red today" then the sky is fucking red.

The problem is, that voice isnt there full time. He is away doing 2 other jobs, and one conflicts with getting the best for the Phoenix.

Noting in the paper today that there didnt seem much resolve from Ricki about getting FFA to look at the schedule around the All Whites games

see Road to Brazil thread

Couldnt resist