Wellington Phoenix Men

v Central Coast, Sat 13, 7.30pm

440 replies · 2,803 views
over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Steptoe wrote:

Feverish wrote:
- Nick Ward. He is not in the squad because he spoke out against Ricki's defensive tactics. So Ricki didn't like this. Also heard Pavlovic got into some sort of trouble, not sure what though, which is why he isn't in the side. Not certain on Pavlovic though.

when/where was this?
Hearfield, Ward & Pavlovic all missed the Perth trip for off-field reasons.


This is what I heard as well.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Steptoe wrote:

Feverish wrote:
- Nick Ward. He is not in the squad because he spoke out against Ricki's defensive tactics. So Ricki didn't like this. Also heard Pavlovic got into some sort of trouble, not sure what though, which is why he isn't in the side. Not certain on Pavlovic though.

when/where was this?
Hearfield, Ward & Pavlovic all missed the Perth trip for off-field reasons.


This is what I heard as well.


Going to guess Hearfield was discoing it up in town
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
CboZ wrote:
Steptoe wrote:

Feverish wrote:
- Nick Ward. He is not in the squad because he spoke out against Ricki's defensive tactics. So Ricki didn't like this. Also heard Pavlovic got into some sort of trouble, not sure what though, which is why he isn't in the side. Not certain on Pavlovic though.

when/where was this?
Hearfield, Ward & Pavlovic all missed the Perth trip for off-field reasons.


This is what I heard as well.


Going to guess Hearfield was discoing it up in town


Apparently ward and pav decided to dispute being dropped but troy just accepted it and thats why he was back.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Solution is simple - We need a Dutch coach, look at Adelaide & the Heart, LOL!!!
 
I would love to say something positive but am finding it pretty hard to think of anything. Players seem to of lost all confidence. Playing Greenacre up front by himself isn't working. He gets no decent service. Where is Nicky Ward?
 
Also I see Kosta scored again tonight. He would be a handy player to have in the team this year, what a loss he has been. Good on him though for seeking an opportunity elsewhere and making the most of it.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
good god, if i see another post about how it would be great to have Kosta still at the phoenix and how it's our loss, i'm going to rumble.   The guy gets to play his natural game at the Roar, he was stiffled here by how Ricki wants to play. He is better off there.
George Costanza2010-11-14 21:55:18
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Just been reading some of the Aussie football sites.....mostly they can't believe ....to quote some of them ..."how shiite the Nix are this season" many thought that with the good squad we had we would be near the top of the table.
Some of the more pertinant coments were along the lines of "the nix have no attack down the centre....always go wide....too predicable"
A few comments about its too soon to dump the coach because he was so good for the Nix and the AW's recently.
 
Here's hoping some of the players currently on the outer like Pav, Ward and Hearfield have a ripper game against Waikato for the Nixettes and really put their hand up for inclusion next game
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Solution is simple - We need a Dutch coach, look at Adelaide & the Heart, LOL!!!


Good work, name two teams that lost this week. Ha
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jazzman wrote:

Sorry for the rant.

�

�


No apology needed, cheers for this post. Imo opinion it's a fairly good analysis of what could be happening atm. Let's just hope at least one of our teams (I am a fellow reds supporter) picks up their game a bit!
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
George Kostanza wrote:
good god, if i see another post about how it would be great to have Kosta still at the phoenix and how it's our loss, i'm going to rumble.   The guy gets to play his natural game at the Roar, he was stiffled here by how Ricki wants to play. He is better off there.


Agreed.  Our painfully slow build up play doesn't suit him. 
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Aaaaaand here come the conspiracy theories.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Midfielder wrote:
wolfman wrote:
Midfielder wrote:
Not sure if it's possible as not sure how strong your youth teams are ... but just on the youth in the side and the skill also � look at the summary almost every Australia player in the team has been in a national side. Don't you have a U 20 national team to get players, remembering a major reason for the Nix's inclusion in the A-League is to develop NZ football ..

 True, but the team also need to get results in order to put bums on seats, and to remain a credible entity within the league.

 

We can't pick a team full of youth players, if they're going to be cleaned up every week. Remember, the Aussie young players having been playing in the so-called YL with older, experienced players, which must be helping their development immensely. Until this season, the Nix haven't had that option.


Four players from you U 20 team... the Mariners have four from the U 20 and another 3 from the U 23 side...

Young legs eager to show how good they are... remember the Mariners had four players under 22 on the park last night and an 18 yo on the bench...
 
We've got young players eager to show how good they are - Rojas, Pavlovic and Crowther(?). I'm willing to bet that the majority of your young fellows have done this in the Youth League before being thrown in at senior level.
Don't forget, your youth internationals are playing better teams in tournaments, and coming from a larger talent pool as well. One of our youth sides recent failed to get past Tahiti for a World Cup.
 
I agree with you that an injection of youth into our side might be a solution, but at this stage, it isn't necessarily going to be Kiwi. We're already going down that road with Pav, but Ricki is quite conservative and doesn't have a record of throwing in young guys. (Kosta, Rojas, Draper...)
wolfman2010-11-15 03:09:53


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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Was at the game on Sat and I really got the impression that the nix players just aren't enjoying themselves. And not just because they were losing.

 
So lets have a couple of fun game s- Yellow Fever 11's vs the Phoenix 6 (reckon that would give the yellow fever team a good chance ) - play for fun, start enjoying the game and maybe make it a semi regular bit of fun
 
Ok won't solve any of the big issues but would be a bit of a laugh and get some smiles back for the players and fans. 
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

the enjoyement factor has to come from the players - we sued to see players like Daniel and Ifill smiling and loving their footy....even Daniel when he took the corner in front of YF on saturday diodn't even bother gesturing to the crowd.....something has changed dramatically for the worse...and for me it will take mroe than a win to sort it.

Queenslander 3x a year.

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
theprof wrote:

the enjoyement factor has to come from the players - we sued to see players like Daniel and Ifill smiling and loving their footy....even Daniel when he took the corner in front of YF on saturday diodn't even bother gesturing to the crowd.....something has changed dramatically for the worse...and for me it will take mroe than a win to sort it.


not being critical, just a thought though i dont necesarily beleive it, because we by far are the best supporters in the a-league. But do any of you think it might have anything to do with playing infront of the same crowd for 3 years, listening to the same chants that most other a-league supporters groups have every other game? it must start getting dull to the players hearing the same things all the time
 
and i by no means beleive that is why, its just a thought, maybe we could work on more specific club unique chants?
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Phoenixlova wrote:
theprof wrote:

the enjoyement factor has to come from the players - we sued to see players like Daniel and Ifill smiling and loving their footy....even Daniel when he took the corner in front of YF on saturday diodn't even bother gesturing to the crowd.....something has changed dramatically for the worse...and for me it will take mroe than a win to sort it.





not being critical, just a thought though i dont necesarily beleive it,�because we by far are the best supporters in the a-league. But do any of you think it might have anything to do with playing infront of the same crowd for 3 years, listening to the same chants that most other a-league supporters groups have every other game? it must start getting dull to the players hearing the same things all the time

�

and i by no means beleive that is why, its just a thought, maybe we could work on more specific club unique chants?


Switch to the other end of the ground,chant the words backwards. Then we'll win the league.

Or just move the team to Christchurch.

Allegedly

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Tony P wrote:
Gentlemen I am as disappointed and frustrated as all of you. Last year we had a great season and we all enjoyed the ride. Things have gone a little sour so far. But to call players donkeys etc is not on. Let's support the team, things will turn around. Confidence is low and it is a massive part of the game. We will bounce back and in the meantime lets stay united as one. That's what is so great about our fans and this club.
 
This was quoted by Sam W in the stuff article linked on the home page (WC hangover).
 
It looks a bit funny in the story - hints at some desperation to me.
 
 

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
zinidane wrote:
.
Some of the more pertinant coments were along the lines of "the nix have no attack down the centre....always go wide....too predicable"


It is interesting how we are attacking wide and then defending narrow - Central Coast had us on that.

Might be time to switch it up a bit and try playing Ifill centrally just behind Greeny?  Roll up the 4-2-3-1?
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
giddyup wrote:
Why can't we play two up front, this whole 4-3-3 bollocks is ripping us off we're not quick enough for that we show no urgency going forward and we have nothing going through the middle of the park and Jade North isn't a Right backs arsehole play him in the centre of defence ffs oh and we don't need to start with three defensive midfielders it's crippling our creativity not that we have much at the moment (imo)


Second this. 4-4-2 start Mac and Greenie together up front. If we are going to continue playing wide and lobbiong crosses this acutally might work. If Mac doesn't perform or behaves in a donkey like fashion then sub him for Pav and give the guy proper go, he could be another Kosta get good with us and bugger off because we never play him.

Playing 3 defensive midfielders doesn't work out on attack and doesn't seem to help defensively and stunts the opportunity for fast breaks.

I'm not sure what to about the defense, there isn't much to do until Lochy gets back other than never play Hearfield as a right back again.

In Midfield start Leo, Elliot, Lia and Ifil. Lia had good game against CCM (if anyone did). Have Ward on the bench ready to provide some central go foward with a switch to diamond.

My 2c right there, in need of a win hopfully we'll see a dramatic return to form and we'll all understand Riki's subs.

"Yellow Fever are fantastic – I have to say that"

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Nolan wrote:
zinidane wrote:
.
Some of the more pertinant coments were along the lines of "the nix have no attack down the centre....always go wide....too predicable"


It is interesting how we are attacking wide and then defending narrow - Central Coast had us on that.

Might be time to switch it up a bit and try playing Ifill centrally just behind Greeny?  Roll up the 4-2-3-1?
 
If this is the game plan, you'd think they'd practise crossing.


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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
George Kostanza wrote:
good god, if i see another post about how it would be great to have Kosta still at the phoenix and how it's our loss, i'm going to rumble.   The guy gets to play his natural game at the Roar, he was stiffled here by how Ricki wants to play. He is better off there.
agreed! wasted talent here!! no game time and not appreciated, AND fits way better with the roar game plan.
(opps will that make you rumble georgie )
 
but come on, eveyone can express how much we miss him surely?
 
 
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
LisaKi wrote:
George Kostanza wrote:
good god, if i see another post about how it would be great to have Kosta still at the phoenix and how it's our loss, i'm going to rumble.   The guy gets to play his natural game at the Roar, he was stiffled here by how Ricki wants to play. He is better off there.



agreed! wasted talent here!! no game time and not appreciated, AND fits way better with the roar game plan.

(opps will that make you rumble georgie )

�

but come on, eveyone can express how much we miss him surely?


�

�



He might be better off at the Roar, but are we better off without him? I don't think so.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
That's just twisting logic to suit your argument.

Allegedly

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Tegal wrote:
That's just twisting logic to suit your argument.


Thats your opinion.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
We'd be worse off without ricki,until we found a replacement.

We were worse off without Tony p,until a replacement was named.

Kosta was a squad player at the nix,we've got other squad players. We're no worse off now.

Twisted logic,not opinion.

Allegedly

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I agree with you Tegal about us not being worse off, because if he was still here he may well still be a benchwarmer because I couldn't see him playing ahead of Greenie or Ifill.

The only exception is the ironic fact that he has scored against us in both games this year, the first one being the winner and the second being the first goal which arguably gave Brisbane more momentum. This is more of a cruel irony, than a valid argument in this case, however
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
No Lochead Fan here, but our two worst games last year, Perth and Melbourne away were without him, andthis year in his absence....well need say no more!
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think what the point people are trying to make about Kosta leaving, is no one saw his potential until he was playing for an opposition side. Thats a worry when the management cant even spot talent under their own nose. Its not like the Phoenix have a big youth development plan, so when talent comes along like that you have to look after it. We obviously didnt. But its fantastic Brisbane have and has now bolstered the depth of the All Whites.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think what the point people are trying to make about Kosta leaving, is no one saw his potential until he was playing for an opposition side. Thats a worry when the management cant even spot talent under their own nose. Its not like the Phoenix have a big youth development plan, so when talent comes along like that you have to look after it. We obviously didnt. But its fantastic Brisbane have and has now bolstered the depth of the All Whites.
.
Except the gaffer did not want him for the AW's a couple of months ago. Rickie prefers the big bangers up front.....suites  the style of play he wants. Kosta would be great in a "ball on the deck, faster style" of play but the AW's currently don't play like that.....so he won't fit. Ditto for the Nix
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Agree, the only problem is the Phoenix dont have 3 giants playing up front like the All Whites do.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Agree, the only problem is the Phoenix dont have 3 giants playing up front like the All Whites do.


I'm starting to think this is the difference actually, Ricki's gameplan suits this far more than greenacre lol. So the solution is obviously to sign Killen or try get smeltz back since he's not really scoring  :P (not an actual solution)










raynes2010-11-16 13:33:30
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I for one would like to vote for a ball on the deck,faster style of play.
Betcha Greenie et al wouldnt say no either
Still plenty of time for us to come good.
 

                                                                        COYN    

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
hamezilla wrote:
I for one would like to vote for a ball on the deck,faster style of play.
Betcha Greenie et al wouldnt say no either
Still plenty of time for us to come good.
 
 
Me too, but the problem is that we don't really have the players to play that sort of game. There isn't a huge amount of pace in our team, unfortunately.

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jag wrote:
hamezilla wrote:
I for one would like to vote for a ball on the deck,faster style of play.
Betcha Greenie et al wouldnt say no either
Still plenty of time for us to come good.
 
 
Me too, but the problem is that we don't really have the players to play that sort of game. There isn't a huge amount of pace in our team, unfortunately.
So we havent got much pace, apparently we dont suit a short passing game, and we dont have the size to take advantage of pumping it long. What tactics does that leave us?
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jag wrote:
hamezilla wrote:
I for one would like to vote for a ball on the deck,faster style of play.
Betcha Greenie et al wouldnt say no either
Still plenty of time for us to come good.
 
 
Me too, but the problem is that we don't really have the players to play that sort of game. There isn't a huge amount of pace in our team, unfortunately.
So we havent got much pace, apparently we dont suit a short passing game, and we dont have the size to take advantage of pumping it long. What tactics does that leave us?
 
Luck.

What's sight without sound? Love without peace? Copulation without conception?

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jag wrote:
hamezilla wrote:
I for one would like to vote for a ball on the deck,faster style of play.
Betcha Greenie et al wouldnt say no either
Still plenty of time for us to come good.
 
 
Me too, but the problem is that we don't really have the players to play that sort of game. There isn't a huge amount of pace in our team, unfortunately.
 
Not forgetting the lack of passing ability which at times is absolutely woeful. Elliott aside (and he really only impresses when hitting 30-40 yarders) we seem to lack the ability to create through the midfield with accurate, incisive intelligent passing. Don't know the stats but the number of assists from our creative midfielders (do we possess such a beast?) would be relatively low in comparison to the rest of the league I would think. I have been impressed by the quality of a lot of the goals we are conceding, particularly the ability of opposition teams to set chances up with creative midfield play. has long been a problem in new Zealand football and the Phoenix are paying the price for playing a simplistic version of the game accordingly. Tricky Ricki needs to come up with a cunning plan to help lift the team that better suits there abilities. This might be a stretch given that ability is fairly limited in key areas of the pitch. Greenacre is doing remarkably well for the sh*t service he is getting and spends far to much time trying to create chances by acting as the first line of defence than is reasonable, all down to poor passing/option taking as we move forward, often the consequence of a woeful ill advised long ball out of defence. Siggy is the worst culprit, often becasuse he makes himself available in an isolated spot, soon as he gets the ball everyone stops working almost as though they are resigned to the fact he's going to lump it and being a guy who hates to dissapoint, he does.
 
There, sorted .

What's sight without sound? Love without peace? Copulation without conception?

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think what the point people are trying to make about Kosta leaving, is no one saw his potential until he was playing for an opposition side. Thats a worry when the management cant even spot talent under their own nose. Its not like the Phoenix have a big youth development plan, so when talent comes along like that you have to look after it. We obviously didnt. But its fantastic Brisbane have and has now bolstered the depth of the All Whites.


That is exactly my point.
Did Everton say Rooney does not fit our style let him go.
They knew how good he was and sold him for big money.I bet we did not get a cracker.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Leggy wrote:
I think what the point people are trying to make about Kosta leaving, is no one saw his potential until he was playing for an opposition side. Thats a worry when the management cant even spot talent under their own nose. Its not like the Phoenix have a big youth development plan, so when talent comes along like that you have to look after it. We obviously didnt. But its fantastic Brisbane have and has now bolstered the depth of the All Whites.


That is exactly my point.
Did Everton say Rooney does not fit our style let him go.
They knew how good he was and sold him for big money.I bet we did not get a cracker.
 
Pretty sure he was off contract, so not sure the Phoenix were entitled to ask for a transfer fee.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
sthn.jeff wrote:
No Lochead Fan here, but our two worst games last year, Perth and Melbourne away were without him, andthis year in his absence....well need say no more!
Agreed, its the impact of then having to play someone else out of their preferred positiona nd disruptingt the defensive combinations.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Ronaldoknow wrote:
Jag wrote:
hamezilla wrote:
I for one would like to vote for a ball on the deck,faster style of play.
Betcha Greenie et al wouldnt say no either
Still plenty of time for us to come good.
 
 
Me too, but the problem is that we don't really have the players to play that sort of game. There isn't a huge amount of pace in our team, unfortunately.
 
Not forgetting the lack of passing ability which at times is absolutely woeful. Elliott aside (and he really only impresses when hitting 30-40 yarders) we seem to lack the ability to create through the midfield with accurate, incisive intelligent passing. Don't know the stats but the number of assists from our creative midfielders (do we possess such a beast?) would be relatively low in comparison to the rest of the league I would think. I have been impressed by the quality of a lot of the goals we are conceding, particularly the ability of opposition teams to set chances up with creative midfield play. has long been a problem in new Zealand football and the Phoenix are paying the price for playing a simplistic version of the game accordingly. Tricky Ricki needs to come up with a cunning plan to help lift the team that better suits there abilities. This might be a stretch given that ability is fairly limited in key areas of the pitch. Greenacre is doing remarkably well for the sh*t service he is getting and spends far to much time trying to create chances by acting as the first line of defence than is reasonable, all down to poor passing/option taking as we move forward, often the consequence of a woeful ill advised long ball out of defence. Siggy is the worst culprit, often becasuse he makes himself available in an isolated spot, soon as he gets the ball everyone stops working almost as though they are resigned to the fact he's going to lump it and being a guy who hates to dissapoint, he does.
 
There, sorted .
100% agree - IMO one of the the best halves of football we played this year was the first half against the Melbourne Victory when we controlled posession and the midfield and I can't figure out what the hell Nick Ward has done to get offside with Ricki Herbert.
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over 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Leggy wrote:
I think what the point people are trying to make about Kosta leaving, is no one saw his potential until he was playing for an opposition side. Thats a worry when the management cant even spot talent under their own nose. Its not like the Phoenix have a big youth development plan, so when talent comes along like that you have to look after it. We obviously didnt. But its fantastic Brisbane have and has now bolstered the depth of the All Whites.


That is exactly my point.
Did Everton say Rooney does not fit our style let him go.
They knew how good he was and sold him for big money.I bet we did not get a cracker.
 
Pretty sure he was off contract, so not sure the Phoenix were entitled to ask for a transfer fee.


Plus, unless they've recently changed, A-league rules stipulate that one A-league club can't purchase a player off another A-league club.
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