Wellington Phoenix Men

Vs RRRRRIVALS Sunday 23rd 9:30pm

534 replies · 2,861 views
over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Back to gameday

Surely Ricki will just park the bus and have Daniel as a one man forward line to break the defence on the counter attack? Can't seeing it being an overtly attacking nux...
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
                            Paston/Warner
 
           ???           Siggy   Dura    Lochy
 
 
                                       Muscat
                Wardy                                     Leo
 
                                       Dirty S.
                          Greenie                    Daniel
 
Is this formation likely? Also, what if Ricky played Siggy at RB and Griffith at CB? I wouldn't really advise it since a certain Shane Judas is gonna be up front.

VUW AFC - Victoria University Football for life

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
As much as I love Manny in midfield, i think with the way the back four has performed it is best to leave that untouched at the moment. Perhaps throw Lindsay into a holding role in front of Siggy and Dura??
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Ricki was saying Cameron Lindsay may get a start in midfield, so I guess that means Muscat is staying at RB.
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I suppose a positive way of looking at this is that injuries etc will force Ricki to try new players and combinations and it's probably good to do it early on in the season.

Edit: Umm, exactly what Rosco said at the top of this page.
Junior822011-10-18 10:10:23

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
i would think Lindsay's involvement may be cut short now that ward's back, but you never know?

I would personally go:

               Warner
Muscat Siggy Durante Lochhead
        Lindsay       Ward
Bertos      Sanchez        Daniel
              Greenacre

Bench: Imray, Griffiths, Tsatalios, Smith.


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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
sthn.jeff wrote:

patrick478 wrote:
There is no chance Tim Brown will be available next week, FFA rules arn't on our side with this one. Ward got a straight red for being the last player, which he was clearly not, and therefore an appeal for an 'Obvious Error' will be upheld.

�
Love your optimism!!! I for one am not so sure despite dubious nature of card


Seems like my optimism paid off!

Yellow Fever - Misery loves company

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
patrick478 wrote:
sthn.jeff wrote:

patrick478 wrote:
There is no chance Tim Brown will be available next week, FFA rules arn't on our side with this one. Ward got a straight red for being the last player, which he was clearly not, and therefore an appeal for an 'Obvious Error' will be upheld.

 
Love your optimism!!! I for one am not so sure despite dubious nature of card


Seems like my optimism paid off!
 
Well played!
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Junior82 wrote:
I suppose a positive way of looking at this is that injuries etc will force Ricki to try new players and combinations and it's probably good to do it early on in the season.

Edit: Umm, exactly what Rosco said at the top of this page.


Great minds etc etc
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
Scottishbhoy wrote:
does this clash with the RWC

�

Yes.�

Chances of 4Kings showing the game?
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Mysky is gonna get a good work out Sunday night.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Azevo wrote:
tigers wrote:
justice done on the Ward decision

well it would be if that ref is fined or suspended


Was pleased to hear that, am not pleased that it seems as though the ref is not punished..


What a wonderful distinction - Gillett first A-League ref ever to be publically spanked for incompetence.

Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads



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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Doloras wrote:

Azevo wrote:
tigers wrote:
justice done on the Ward decision

well it would be if that ref is fined or suspended


Was pleased to hear that, am not pleased that it seems as though the ref is not punished..
What a wonderful distinction - Gillett first A-League ref ever to be publically spanked for incompetence.


Gillett - The Worst a Ref can Get!

"Ive just re-visited this and once again realised that C-Diddy is a genius - a drunk, Newcastle bred disgrace - but a genius." - Hard News, 11:39am 4th June 2009

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
But this was already known that referees got dropped but not broadcast. When you think about out it, how else did the younger Gillett do the semi last year? Cause he did the business and the big wigs like Beath, Williams, Breeze etc all ststuffed up and missed out.

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Doloras wrote:

What a wonderful distinction - Gillett first A-League ref ever to be publically spanked for incompetence.


Now, the FFA just need to change their rules on yellow cards, they should be able to be appealed just like reds, especially when Mark Sheilds says the decision was just plain wrong. Big thumbs up to the FFA for being open about this matter, transparency on a matter as crucial to the league as the refereeing is great.patrick4782011-10-18 13:34:26

Yellow Fever - Misery loves company

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Or even a compromise, that a yellow can be appealed only if it leads to a sending off or a suspension.

Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads



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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Doloras wrote:
Or even a compromise, that a yellow can be appealed only if it leads to a sending off or a suspension.


That's what I was thinking, just didn't manage to type it out correctly. I totally agree, however I think it would only work for yellows that lead to a sending off. Otherwise, you would have clubs appealing yellow cards left right and center, just so they wouldn't count towards a players yellow card tally for the 5/8 yellow card suspensions.

Yellow Fever - Misery loves company

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Objectively, how do you implement that. At A League there is footage which saved us in this case. How do you do that when its Wharfies v Greeks in Capital League?
 
The answer is you can't. You can only appeal if its wrong in law. i.e. you get yellow carded for time wasting when in fact it was a bad tackle. Brownie got carded for time wasting which while technically correct, is very much lacking in application and common sense.

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
My belief is that the judicial process is set by each FA, in our case the FFA. It is an FFA rule that yellow's cannot be challenged in the A-League, and therefore the FFA could change their rulings.

The thing is, Mark Shields said that the decision to send Tim Brown was not right, therefore if the Phoenix could appeal the card, it is likely it would be overturned.

Yellow Fever - Misery loves company

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
patrick478 wrote:
My belief is that the judicial process is set by each FA, in our case the FFA. It is an FFA rule that yellow's cannot be challenged in the A-League, and therefore the FFA could change their rulings.

The thing is, Mark Shields said that the decision to send Tim Brown was not right, therefore if the Phoenix could appeal the card, it is likely it would be overturned.
 
Pretty sure it's a FIFA ruling..

a.haak

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Yeah but there are probably a hundred yellow cards dished out every weekend that are considered harsh so how is your point relevant? I've seen a kid yellow carded for telling someone to 'f**k off c**t'. Does that mean that should be reversed and made into a red?
 
I've seen Lia and Manny go into tackles and get yellow and wonder what the hell the referee was watching. The avatar above with Siggy smashing Kruse, if he gets cautioned for that, should the Socceroos have the right to appeal that and turn it into a red? We'd scream blue murder about it being left on the field or typical whinging Aussies.
 
I think you need to be very careful what you wish for because we have some players (Brown, Lia, Manny, Siggy) that play at the edge...

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
How about something like Doloras said, where yellow cards can only appealed if they are one of the two yellow cards that result in a red card being shown, and only for an 'Obvious Error', which was the reasoning behind Ward's being expunged.

Yellow Fever - Misery loves company

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I know what I wrote above is playing devils advocate and going the other way but then so is the whole conversation around it.

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
It would need to be the 2nd yellow then cause any player thats on a wrongfully awarded yellow and is dumb enough to put himself in a position to earn a 2nd, deserves it in my opinion

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Besides,you could extend it,what if the first yellow was the dubious one? You'd have to have the ability to appeal both. If you can appeal the first yellow,it's a little inconsistent to not appeal all yellows.

It's also a lot easier to clearly tell what is a sending off offence. You'd have a hard time overturning a yellow.

Allegedly

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
patrick478 wrote:
How about something like Doloras said, where yellow cards can only appealed if they are one of the two yellow cards that result in a red card being shown, and only for an 'Obvious Error', which was the reasoning behind Ward's being expunged.


It's 'Obvious error of fact' - and this is not really applicable in Brown's case. There's certainly a case to be made that Brown's actions on the throw-in delayed the re-start of the game (i.e. he was in the position to re-start the game, and then didn't do so), so the card wasn't the result of a refereeing error, but the referee's interpretation of Brown's actions (which a different referee may, or may not have, interpreted differently).

But I'm firmly with JV on this - leave yellows alone, otherwise you're opening a can of worms.
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
el grapadura wrote:
patrick478 wrote:
How about something like Doloras said, where yellow cards can only appealed if they are one of the two yellow cards that result in a red card being shown, and only for an 'Obvious Error', which was the reasoning behind Ward's being expunged.


It's 'Obvious error of fact' - and this is not really applicable in Brown's case. There's certainly a case to be made that Brown's actions on the throw-in delayed the re-start of the game (i.e. he was in the position to re-start the game, and then didn't do so), so the card wasn't the result of a refereeing error, but the referee's interpretation of Brown's actions (which a different referee may, or may not have, interpreted differently).

But I'm firmly with JV on this - leave yellows alone, otherwise you're opening a can of worms.
 
Agreed. And not to forget all yellows may prove costly with a suspension further on down the line.
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
A-League disciplinary rules:
only provide for right of appeal against direct red cards.
 
In other leagues, appeals against yellows can be made in specific circumstances, example:
FA Rescind Brodie's Yellow Card:
 
You can also find numerous instances of referees themselves rescinding yellow cards retrospectively, example:
 
The latter is not the result of appeal but the ref realising after reviewing that the booking was an error. I'm not sure that the FFA provide the latter as a means of recourse within their rules, unlike the English game, but even if they do the ref needs to initiate it.
 
 
 
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Interesting the Riley one. So he could watch the replay afterwards and decide to change his mind. If thats the case, then why are replays banned in the ground? Surely that is no different than making a decision, looking up, realising its wrong and reversing it.

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I remember a certain red card mistake for Vaughn Coveny a few seasons back. The ref downgraded that immediately though since he just pulled the wrong one.
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jeff Vader wrote:
  then why are replays banned in the ground?
 
That's for our benefit, to prevent us from taking umbrage with a decision and demonstrating our rage in an ungentlemanly manner bolstered with the certainty that seeing the replay has given us. This way, we have to get home and watch the replay before starting our righteous seethe.
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I have liked Sanchez's start at the Phoenix. One thing is that he looks to support our wide players and offers himself as a passing option. Wouldn't mind if we free one of our deeper two mids to do the same so in effect have 433 with one DM (or 4141 if you like) and have 2 CM supporting the wide players (winger and FB) on their side. I think it would definitely help with us retaining possession.

Bertos and Daniel switching sides and attacking from outside in created a lot of space for our FB's to get forward into, Bertos also looked better as he struggled to get outside of Byun but could create space for Lochhead and link with Sanchez when he swiched. So IMHO for Glory:

-----------Paston
Muscat/?--Siggy--Dura--Lochhead
-----------Muscat/?
------Ward--------Sanchez
Daniel------------------Bertos
----------Greenacre

Obviously ? marks on who replaces Tim in midfield, whether we have someone as a straight swap or someone to replace Manny at RB if he shifts into DM.
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Bullion wrote:


Obviously ? marks on who replaces Tim in midfield,
 
No one can replace Tim in Midfield!!!!!!!
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Gillett is actually secretly a nix supporter...
 
He knew that if he didn't give Ward the red he would have to give him a second yellow for his late lunge from behind.
 
If he gave ward a 2nd yellow, thre would be no room for the suspension to be rescinded, but if he gave a red which clearly wasn't... well ward would be free to play.
 
And free to play he is.
 
Thank you Gillett, your willingness to help cheat for the nix has helped soften our injury crisis.
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Bullion wrote:
I have liked Sanchez's start at the Phoenix. One thing is that he looks to support our wide players and offers himself as a passing option. Wouldn't mind if we free one of our deeper two mids to do the same so in effect have 433 with one DM (or 4141 if you like) and have 2 CM supporting the wide players (winger and FB) on their side. I think it would definitely help with us retaining possession.

Bertos and Daniel switching sides and attacking from outside in created a lot of space for our FB's to get forward into, Bertos also looked better as he struggled to get outside of Byun but could create space for Lochhead and link with Sanchez when he swiched. So IMHO for Glory:

-----------Paston
Muscat/?--Siggy--Dura--Lochhead
-----------Muscat/?
------Ward--------Sanchez
Daniel------------------Bertos
----------Greenacre

Obviously ? marks on who replaces Tim in midfield, whether we have someone as a straight swap or someone to replace Manny at RB if he shifts into DM.


Yip agree with this. I would be more inclined to leave manny at RB for this one and throw the new guy in at DM.

our fullbacks are gonna be tested this week with Andrezinho and Dodd both dangerous, and I dont want another Musa situation.

However at DM, players have be known to go missing and leave our back four exposed, and there isnt as much pressure to perform there I feel, so a fresh face would be good and in my eyes, they can only do their chances good


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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Sign Reid, do this
-----Paston/Warner-----
Muscat-Siggy-Dura-Lochy
----Liday-----Reid
Ward---Sanchez---Bertos
--------Greenie-----

Warner/Imray, Smith, Daniel, Tsattaios/Downey/Griffiths
I reckon that's a bus you can park and even counter attack off.
Without another presence in midfield this will be hard.
Reid seems like a god given replacement for Lia, come on Ricki, injury replacement this easy doesn't come around all the time.asmodeus_822011-10-18 17:56:05

"Yellow Fever are fantastic – I have to say that"

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jeff Vader wrote:


Yeah but there are probably a hundred yellow cards dished out every weekend that are considered harsh so how is your point relevant? I've seen a kid yellow carded for telling someone to 'f**k off c**t'. Does that mean that should be reversed and made into a red?
�
I've seen Lia and Manny go into tackles and get yellow and wonder what the hell the referee was watching. The avatar above with Siggy smashing Kruse, if he gets cautioned for that, should the Socceroos have the right to appeal that and turn it into a red? We'd scream blue murder about it being left on the field or typical whinging Aussies.
�
I think you need to be very careful what you wish for because we have some players (Brown, Lia, Manny, Siggy) that play at the edge...


JV your comment about Brown,Lia, Manny and Siggy are very true.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Must admit I am liking the look of Dirty Sanchez.....the guy looks like he has a football brain. You don't always have to be real flashy as a attacking mid to be affective. Playing smart, making the right pass at the right time to the right person can sometimes work as well as dribbling, slalom style through a maze of defenders.
 
He looks like he might well grow into a very handy player for us. we have lots of good wide attacking layers...we just needed one person with the skill and vision to link up through the central midfield and bring it all together....Sanchez could be the man.
 
Sign Paul Ried....I have always admired that guys skills. He is a very busy player with good vision and good work rate. Could be the perfect foil beside Muscat in midfield...all we have to do now is find a proper solid right back. Downey is not the answer....he defended like saloon doors preseason!!!
 
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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Yeah im bloody happy with Sanchez so far. Hes given us that extra option central, and we have been playing a few balls down the middle to him or greenacre, where greeny often lays it back to sanchez who can distribute wide. These sort of central down the middle attacks is what we have been lacking.

Ive decided Muscat may be our RB for the rest of the season - especially if we sign Reid or someone similar, as Ricki has many options there.
Also like the suggestion of starting ward out wide. That is if we have another cm option


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