Some really good bright moments from some of our younger players last night, but importantly can we acknowledge how damn classy the all black kit looks out on the pitch under lights?
As much as it pains me to say it, but if you'd offered me a highly competitive and quite entertaining 1-0 loss to Australia earlier in the week I would've taken it.
The painful part last night of course, was for all our good work in the final third - the build up, the passing, and the chances created, was that we still ended up with a big fat duck egg. Definitely a case of coulda, shoulda, woulda. Waine starts up top in Auckland 100%. Grieve might also be a good bet as he's got the quality to go direct, but still play off of Woodsy when needed. We need to be able to mix it up, and he's nippy and technical enough to cause problems for the Aussie backline.
As for defending, well it looked at times as if we were cats on a hot tin roof, very uncertain when the Aussies were in possession and scrambling (to good effect mind you) to get the ball clear. I think that comes down to game time as well, building partnerships and trusting in one another with the game plan we have.
For mine we start with Tuiloma, Reid and Boxall on Sunday, although at some stage I do want to see what Kyle Adams brings to the table, given he is the next cab off the rank so to speak. Nothing against Pijnaker on this, I just think he's not as reliable as we need one to be at this level - Yet. He did some good things last night with interventions and breaking up play, but then would look unsure or indecisive not long after. Payne doesn't start, and I'm up in the air on who we go with down the right since we've only got Roux and Ingham in for this window
If we don't get this squad together on a more regular basis, as far as I'm concerned it will be as criminal as anything NZF have managed in their bumbling existence. We just can't have the likes of Just, Cacace, Singh, Stamenic, Bell, Garbett, Grieve, Waine, Old, Thomas sitting in the international wilderness. It's absolute madness to think we won't be seeing anything until well after the new year, if at all for the next wee while.
All said an done, looking forward to Sunday. We can definitely roll this average Aussie outfit. Just after a clinical edge up top and a bit of polish and we'll do them over in front of a bigger crowd than they managed last night!
Actually, might be tempted to go Adams for Boxall in Auckland. If we're not going to be playing for a while it might be good to see what he's got to offer from the get go rather than a small cameo towards the backend (depending on the match circumstances of course).
the usual calls of "we'll never get any better if we don't play more" I get that it must be tough to convince any team outside Oceania to play us on a regular basis, but we dont even play Oceanic teams that often. A regular series against Aussie is a must, to have only played 65 times in 100 years is a disgrace! I put that on both aussie football and NZF. NZF needs to be pushing for friendlies against the like of Aussie, Japan, Indonesia etc on a regular basis, they are close enough to play home and away series on a two yearly cycle. Playing and winning those "friendlies" is the only way we get better.
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
over 3 years ago· edited over 3 years ago· History
2ndBest
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
I don't think it's a surprise that Pijnaker is playing for a team in the Ireland PL. Not exactly a high level.
Stensness would've gotten a lot of chances with us, what a shame.
The irony of having quality midfielders coming through like Garbett, Bell and Stamenic while having absolutely no CBs...it's reverse 2010.
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
I don't think it's a surprise that Pijnaker is playing for a team in the Ireland PL. Not exactly a high level.
Stensness would've gotten a lot of chances with us, what a shame.
The irony of having quality midfielders coming through like Garbett, Bell and Stamenic while having absolutely no CBs...it's reverse 2010.
Yeah outside of the older guys like Boxall, Reid and Smith we’ve got: Tuiloma, Pijnaker, Kyle Adams and I guess Fin Surman, Tim Payne and George Stanger?
Not exactly mind blowing depth there, bloody Stensness could’ve been a nailed on starter within a year or two.
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
Your defense point was my exact takeaway from last night. In 2026 we will have a midfield selected from Bell, Stamenic, Garbett, Singh all aged 24-27 (hopefully plus Thomas aged 31), yet outside of Libby and maybe Tuiloma (Who at 27 is somehow younger than Tim Payne?) I don't see many defenders coming through who provide a solid base for those guys (Agree that Pijnaker doesn't seem up to it).
It seems like for the last 20 years we've had a CB who is a lifter, one of those players that makes everyone around them play better and organises the defence, first Hay, then Nelly, then Reid. But it doesn't seem like we have anyone who is going to take over that mantle, and it will be gutting if such an exciting midfield goes to waste without a solid defence to back it up.
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
Your defense point was my exact takeaway from last night. In 2026 we will have a midfield selected from Bell, Stamenic, Garbett, Singh all aged 24-27 (hopefully plus Thomas aged 31), yet outside of Libby and maybe Tuiloma (Who at 27 is somehow younger than Tim Payne?) I don't see many defenders coming through who provide a solid base for those guys (Agree that Pijnaker doesn't seem up to it).
It seems like for the last 20 years we've had a CB who is a lifter, one of those players that makes everyone around them play better and organises the defence, first Hay, then Nelly, then Reid. But it doesn't seem like we have anyone who is going to take over that mantle, and it will be gutting if such an exciting midfield goes to waste without a solid defence to back it up.
Praying that Surman has a breakout season soon and then establishes himself in the Championship. Apparently he's Welsh and might have a British passport so surely Swansea or Cardiff are on the cards one day. There's also Marley Leuluai at the Man City academy but he's only 15/16 years old so still very, very early days and a long time before he's even in the conversation.
over 3 years ago· edited over 3 years ago· History
Friar Tuck
valeo
2ndBest
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
I don't think it's a surprise that Pijnaker is playing for a team in the Ireland PL. Not exactly a high level.
Stensness would've gotten a lot of chances with us, what a shame.
The irony of having quality midfielders coming through like Garbett, Bell and Stamenic while having absolutely no CBs...it's reverse 2010.
Yeah outside of the older guys like Boxall, Reid and Smith we’ve got: Tuiloma, Pijnaker, Kyle Adams and I guess Fin Surman, Tim Payne and George Stanger?
Not exactly mind blowing depth there, bloody Stensness could’ve been a nailed on starter within a year or two.
Stensness was never really a New Zealand player, more so an Australian who used the FIFA citizenship to benefit himself up to the point he no longer needed to. He's lived in Norway longer than in New Zealand. He obviously wanted to play for his actual country, no issue with that, just need to move on. All these players born/brought up overseas are like this; I doubt Stanger dreamt of playing for New Zealand being born/bred Scottish. Herdman is similar, as would Dibley-Dias or whichever (grand)son-of approaches NZF before the next U20 World Cup. Even then it would be kicking the can down the road in terms of the real issue about developing players.
The real issue is a lack of pathways. If you aren't a rich kid who's parents can spend thousands on 'academies' then you fall behind. If you don't have a secondary passport then it makes it much harder to get signed elsewhere. If you can't afford to self-fund trials overseas then you get stuck stagnating in amateur football. If you don't play for the 'right' club you don't get a look in at youth level. There's only one professional team in the world that will play New Zealanders, and when you add in five visa players, half a dozen Australians (why?) and already contracted players, there's maybe one or two spots, which typically go to in-house players. It was a bit funny hearing Hay talk about how Reid paved a way for New Zealanders to reach the top level, when even Reid isn't a local product. So I guess Reid's example is to go to a footballing country as young as possible to avoid inevitably falling behind.
I suppose to take a pessimistic view, does it really matter? The OFC nations are below National League level, so even local players should breeze past them. In that case the team should still be able to win OFC Nations' Cups, and now qualify directly for a World Cup. We'll never be able to really compete at a World Cup, so it is what is. We've secured a comfortable niche at the top of OFC, if players play in Ireland or Australia or Denmark or even locally, what's the difference?
over 3 years ago· edited over 3 years ago· History
Was at the game last night. Not the best seats, row 1 in the Away section, looking through the keeper's net!. Garbett free kick flew over our heads.
But some quick takeaways (admittedly had a few beers) -
1. Thought ref did a good job 2. Our buildup play is great. Composure and decision making of Cacace, Bell, Garbett, Just & Stamenic (in his cameo) quality stuff. 3. Thought De Jong, miss aside was okay. Threw himself about, and freed up Wood a bit. 4. Seems awhile (one League Cup goal aside) since Woodsman scored in open play. 5. Garbett is feisty. Love it. Plenty of lip to the older Socceroos. 6. Our team looked young. The Socceroos starting 11 (Mabil aside) all seemed older, harder edged. I'll have to find time to go through ages of their starting 11 - but looked a little like, men verus kids (even with Libby's facial hair!). Which gives great hope for the future. 7. Pijnaker still making 1-2 big errors per game, which I guess is why he is still in Ireland. If he can cut those out - he'll be a real asset to AWs with that left foot. And yeah lets hope Surman can develop into a top drawer defender. He's off to a promising start. 8. Payne really had his hands full with Mabil that first half running towards our end. No surprise he scored the goal. But he won't get that same space in Qatar. 9. But what this AWs team is really missing is Singh (and to a lesser extent Thomas & Lewis). What Singh brings is unique in NZ Football's history. That killer pass, great cross of a left foot, seeing the space that no one else does. He played last night, and AWs would have had a far greater goal scoring threat. Without him it's just going to continue to be quality build up play without the killer ball. Relying on Wood to lay it off to someone for an opening, or yes a defensive error by the opposition (as happened with Wood's ruled out goal verus CR).
Singh starts regularly and this team, could really do something. Good news is I think his injury will come right soon. Not so optimistic on Thomas.
Oh & yes FFS lets hope we get a Gold Cup (2023) or Copa America (2024) invite. Fudgeen anything please.
Even better a combined East AFC/OFC Nations League (that maybe incorporated some AFC & OFC WC qualifyng somehow - as happens in the UEFA Nations League) that had, actual home games.
But any hopes of biennial series against Socceroos, Japan or whoever is just dreamland stuff. They have very busy AFC schedules, and are always aiming to play big South American teams (Aussie tried to bring Argentina & Brazil to Australia last year) or European teams in their few free windows. They are not interested in playing the lowly AWs regularly - unless that was in some Nations League setup. All the talk about NZ playing Australia more this week, has come out of NZ - nothing at all out of Oz (players, FA or media)
Honestly the FA would have wanted a bigger drawcard team than the AWs as their World Cup farewell game in Aussie. But at least they stuck to the centenary celebrations.
PS. Crowd of only 25,000 a poor effort from QLD. Admittedly it had been raining heavily earlier in the day and was a midweek game, with a late 10pm finish for the school kids. But yeah if they had played in Melbs or Sidney would have been double that.
over 3 years ago· edited over 3 years ago· History
theprof
Good afternoon,
Is the rumor true that NZ and Jamaica will be invited to the Copa America 2024?
What I meant to ask is it true there is a rumour (in Argentina) that AWs will be invited to 2024 Copa. Still nearly 2 years away.
Qatar are invited to 2023 Gold Cup, but from memory that clashes with 2023 Asian Cup (venue to be decided later this year, after China withdrew) - so maybe AWs could replace Qatar in the Gold Cup.
Despite naming just six starters from their World Cup playoff against Costa Rica in June, the All Whites put up a good fight at Suncorp Stadium, matching Australia with 12 shots on goal and 50% of possession.
Arnold, who enjoyed former mentor Guus Hiddink's cameo as assistant coach, made five changes to the side that started against Peru in their World Cup qualifier.
But there were no major experiments, with the many fresh faces included in the 31-strong squad lining the bench with a rematch on Sunday in Auckland their target.
Empoli talent Liberato Cacace proved a menace on the left edge for New Zealand without finding the net, while Newcastle United striker Chris Wood was physical up front in a friendly that had plenty of spark 100 years on from the teams' first meeting.
Arnold conceded after the match that his team lacked energy, but provided context around the difficulty of playing matches at home for players based elsewhere in the world and looked ahead to the rematch on Sunday.
"I thought we lost the physical battle — the New Zealanders were quite physical — but it's important to remember that the boys just arrived," he said.
"Milos Degenek arrived yesterday morning. Flights out of London were difficult, there were cancelled flights because of the Queen's funeral.
"I wanted to reward the boys who gave us a lot of sacrifices and got us through the [qualification] campaign, and obviously that's the older group.
"But [Sunday] is for the kids. So what did I learn tonight? They're still working hard. There are some that need to get playing. I rewarded the ones for the campaign that we got through, but now it's about what's in front of us."
Sounds like none of the Socceroos starting 11 from last night will fly to NZ, so their squad in Auckland will basically drop to 20 players. Cam Devlin to debut?! Should be fun for those there.
Feel confident that we'll beat at home with a whole new 11 from them and we'd probs play our stronger lineup with Stamenic, Reid, Waine, and Tullimoa coming in.
Sounds like none of the Socceroos starting 11 from last night will fly to NZ, so their squad in Auckland will basically drop to 20 players. Cam Devlin to debut?! Should be fun for those there.
Kinda disrespectful. Sulkily kick out at us in a tight game and then run scared from getting it back. Hope they get totally pumped in Qatar.
The younger guys may actually be a stronger team though or at least be better in some respects, and not playing in front of the expectations of a home crowd might free them up as they won’t be hearing their fans frustrations directly too.
Guys I respect in that team are Mooy (but he’s past his best), Leckie and Ryan. Even those guys don’t stack up so much compared to the Duke, Cahill, Schwarzer, Bresciano, Emmerton, Kewell, Neil, Aloisi, Jedinak…even Craig Moore and I’m sure other guys I’ve left out because they used to have a lot of players in the top flight. They were very poor in qualifying and lucky to get through.
Still it means the Auckland game is probably going to be more exciting if it’s Devlin and co.
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
I don't think it's a surprise that Pijnaker is playing for a team in the Ireland PL. Not exactly a high level.
Stensness would've gotten a lot of chances with us, what a shame.
The irony of having quality midfielders coming through like Garbett, Bell and Stamenic while having absolutely no CBs...it's reverse 2010.
Yeah outside of the older guys like Boxall, Reid and Smith we’ve got: Tuiloma, Pijnaker, Kyle Adams and I guess Fin Surman, Tim Payne and George Stanger?
Not exactly mind blowing depth there, bloody Stensness could’ve been a nailed on starter within a year or two.
The centre back thing is a worry, obvioulsy we had Nelsen and then Reid, whoever played alongside them looked good. Hopefully we can find another center back of their quality soon.
over 3 years ago· edited over 3 years ago· History
LG
I'm picking a 19k crowd that will actually make a lot of noise and rattle Aussie with it.
Tickets sold was already a 25K a few days ago. Good weather Sunday might get 40K?
Edit - and Arnold is using these games to finalise his World Cup squad. He's already got a few guys injured at the moment I think like Harry Suottar (spp). He's well within his rights to pick whoever he wants for Eden Park, and help finalise his squad for the big picture - Qatar.
But for sure opens the door for a NZ win by picking 'kids'. AWs likely even favourites now with that plan. Though guys like Devlin & Cummings if they play will be desperate to impress Arnie. Who doesn't want to go to a World Cup. Could be spicey.
over 3 years ago· edited over 3 years ago· History
Np
Distribution fell off a cliff after subs. De jong and Ingham are questionable starters. Actually thought Bell held the midfield better despite some mistakes - he's barely played so maybe rusty. We don't have much depth at full backs nothing we can do about that.. not being able to score is a real problem.
I think Bell is well out of form and has been since the Olympics. He was average against both Peru and CR. I think he was somewhat guilty of overcommitting and not staying on his feet, leading to the goal.
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites
Sautner put that down to the unique weather on the day and he did his best to ease Hay’s concerns about the pitch by saying the playing surface was designed to handle multiple events within a short timeframe.
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
I’m no fan of his either. Playing in Ireland and not standing out should rule him out of the squad. There are other decent young kiwi defenders playing at this level who you’d think are more deserving. I still think had Boxy been on the park instead of him we would be off to Qatar for the WC.
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites
Reckon that game mirrors that of the past year or so. For all the good work we can do in midfield, when was the last time you saw our midfield create a clear cut chance? Everything seems to be relying on a blunder from the opposition and pot shots from distance.
Need to get Singh fit, find a way of creating better opportunities inside the box, get Wood more involved and develop a RB.
Have a little bit of concern about our centre backs in the next cycle too. Reid is gone. Boxall is 34 and Smith is 32. Can either push through for another 3.5 years? I've never understood the love people have for Pijnaker. Sure he can do a decent diagonal ball but when you're hitting it to Ingham and De Jong it's a bit pointless. Last night and the game vs Costa has really highlighted how far off the pace he is. Gifted them 2 clear chances last night and lost his marker for the Costa Rica goal.
I’m no fan of his either. Playing in Ireland and not standing out should rule him out of the squad. There are other decent young kiwi defenders playing at this level who you’d think are more deserving. I still think had Boxy been on the park instead of him we would be off to Qatar for the WC.
What other players do we actually have that are better than Pijnaker?
Reid, M Boxall, Smith, Tuiloma are all definitely better but with the exception of Tuiloma, all on the wrong side of 30.
Other than them we’ve got Kyle Adams, N Boxall, Finn Surman and George Stanger playing pro and Aaryan Raj, Taylor Schrijvers, Adam Mitchell and Sam Brotherton playing local.
Surman is the only one you could definitively say could end up better than Pijnaker, but he’s still so early in his career that it’s hard to say for certain. I’d like to have a proper look at Kyle Adams too, he could be quality but the USL can be tricky. I really like the look of Raj as well but hard to say how good a teenager in the national league really is.
Other than them there’s the US college guys (Paul Richnow, Luke Johnson, Adam Hillis, Jaylen Rodwell, Boyd Curry, Finn O’Connor, Liam Moore, Ronan Wynne etc etc etc) and the extremely young/completely unproven Leuluai.
Personally I can’t say any of them really stand out as better options than Pijnaker, which is a bit of a pain since Nando’s been off his game for a bit now. He’s a super classy player on his day but 1-2 big mistakes per game will cost us in the long run.
over 3 years ago· edited over 3 years ago· History
It's way too early to just write Pijnaker off. Still young, and Rio Ave thought enough of him to sign him long term.
He has some genuinely classy moments, and good physical size. He needs to cut out those bad errors. But that shell shocked early goal against CR, a number of AWs were at fault.
Understandable that both Reid & Tuiloma were rested last night so, Nando starts. You could accuse Hay of some favouritism since they go back to that Handy Prem winning ES side. But yes for the moment, there is no stand out better young CB.
Hopefully AWs go comfortably 2-0 up against a young Socceroos team on Sunday, and Hay rolls on Adams for 20 mins for a look.
Pijnaker and Payne had fantastic distribution on Thursday. Their passing ability is superior to Tuiloma and Boxall. Nando has the talent to be a very very good LCB. Just need to be patient. He will start making massive leaps soon.
