Coaching Angst - ZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

[QUOTE=Hard News]Really ?

Unless I'm mistaken in the 2nd season at this club we missed the play-offs on the last day while two years behind every other club, now 5 weeks in to the season we've been competitive in most of our matches and unlucky not not to have as many as nine points so we're suddenly so sh*t we should sack the coach ?

Bollocks.

Unlucky this and unlucky that... All teams are unlucky at some point. What matters is overcoming that and still getting a result. I don't think Ricki should be sacked but I am starting to doubt his ability to turn the nix into a serious contender.

Farina turned to Roar into serious contenders, even if they did collapse in the playoffs.

bling blang blah

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

By same logic i turn your post around as a Roar supporter.

Lucky this lucky that. All teams are lucky at some point. What matters is that we will get over it and be wooden spooners next. I dont think Farina should be sacked,but i am starting to think his luck might run out and we will no longer be serious contenders (so maybe we should let him go before this happens)

Ricki Herbert has turned the nix into a non-playoffs team,even if they did play well.

Allegedly

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

We were the home team and didn't press home that advantage, Adelaide were there for the taking IMHO. 2nd half we spent 35 mins doing very little, no penetration and a lot of long balls forward to Greenacre.

The formation and tactics were not working but Ricki didn't change things until the 84th minute, then we got our usual last 5 minutes of suddenly trying to win the game again.

An adventurous coach would have changed the team set up much earlier in that second half to attempt to win the game as it wasn't working for us.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Tegal wrote:

Steve-o and i agreed to disagree and thats fine . Everyones allowed an opinion.

It was the post from sanday that really grinded my gears

Yeah,sincerest apologies for that.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Tegal wrote:

True,we shouldve smashed them 5-0 barcelona styles. Sigh.

Sack ricki.

Why take it to the other extreme?

Nobody has mentioned playing like Barcelona, or winning 5-0. What people, including myself, would like to see once in a while is perhaps a good performance coupled with a comfortable victory, particularly at home instead of always nicking 3 points by the odd goal (although obviously I'd take this over anything less!), drawing far too often, and losing away from home far too often to even think about being finals contenders.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

So you want to win by more than one goal every game? But not quite 5-0

You say we're drawing and losing too often...but we're only 5 games into the season. Not much to work with there. ratio wise - very fine line

I give up.

Allegedly

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

In fact

CCM & Newcastle - drawn and lost most of their games - fire their coach

Perth - lost 3 out of 5 games - fire their coach

Brisbane drawn or lost 4 out of 5 games - fire their coach

Melbourne adelaide and phoenix - drawing and losing far too many to be playoffs contenders - fire the coach

Looks like may as well just play a GCU and sydney grand final next week and flag the rest of the season,no other side is worthy of the playoffs...they draw and lose too much

We're 3 points behind 3rd ffs...and we've dominated in most games this season. I seriously dont know how much more you want except maybe a bit more luck

Allegedly

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Tegal wrote:

In fact

CCM & Newcastle - drawn and lost most of their games - fire their coach

Perth - lost 3 out of 5 games - fire their coach

Brisbane drawn or lost 4 out of 5 games - fire their coach

Melbourne adelaide and phoenix - drawing and losing far too many to be playoffs contenders - fire the coach

Looks like may as well just play a GCU and sydney grand final next week and flag the rest of the season,no other side is worthy of the playoffs...they draw and lose too much

We're 3 points behind 3rd ffs...and we've dominated in most games this season. I seriously dont know how much more you want except maybe a bit more luck

Maybe if we worked that bit harder for the whole game we wouldn't need a bit of luck, maybe if our coach was more adventurous at times we would be even nearer to 3rd place

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Last Season:

After 5 Rounds: 2 points (0 Wins, 2 Draws, 3 Losses) = 0.4 Points per game

Rounds 6 - 21: 24 Points (7 Wins, 3 Draws, 6 Losses) = 1.5 Points per game

At this point last season I remember calling for Ricki's head. He proved me very wrong!

Given that we have 6 extra matches this season and we are actually in a better position as far as points go compared to the previous season I would say shut the f**k up and enjoy the ride!!!

I assume you are not going to attend any Post-Season matches as you don't believe that we will make it that far this season!

"Ive just re-visited this and once again realised that C-Diddy is a genius - a drunk, Newcastle bred disgrace - but a genius." - Hard News, 11:39am 4th June 2009

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Tegal wrote:

So you want to win by more than one goal every game? But not quite 5-0

You say we're drawing and losing too often...but we're only 5 games into the season. Not much to work with there. ratio wise - very fine line

I give up.

Do you deliberately misread my comments to suit your own agenda?

I said it would be nice to win some games comfortably once in a while, and unless my maths is worse than I thought, there is a reasonable variety of results between winning by one goal and winning by 5 is there not?

I'm not just talking about these 5 games, we can go back through pre season and last season - drawing and losing too often. Facts are facts, simple as that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Tegal wrote:

In fact

CCM & Newcastle - drawn and lost most of their games - fire their coach

Perth - lost 3 out of 5 games - fire their coach

Brisbane drawn or lost 4 out of 5 games - fire their coach

Melbourne adelaide and phoenix - drawing and losing far too many to be playoffs contenders - fire the coach

Looks like may as well just play a GCU and sydney grand final next week and flag the rest of the season,no other side is worthy of the playoffs...they draw and lose too much

We're 3 points behind 3rd ffs...and we've dominated in most games this season. I seriously dont know how much more you want except maybe a bit more luck

Why are you, and a few others, so obsessed with comparing us to everyone else? Forget about everyone else, I'm only bothered about what Phoenix are doing, and at this point it's not winning enough games, 1 in 5 is not enough, I don't know how you can even argue that.

If we've dominated in most games as you say, then the 'more' that I want is results! We cannot go on blaming bad luck, at some point you've got to think that maybe we're not doing something right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

C-Diddy wrote:

Last Season:

After 5 Rounds: 2 points (0 Wins, 2 Draws, 3 Losses) = 0.4 Points per game

Rounds 6 - 21: 24 Points (7 Wins, 3 Draws, 6 Losses) = 1.5 Points per game

At this point last season I remember calling for Ricki's head. He proved me very wrong!

Given that we have 6 extra matches this season and we are actually in a better position as far as points go compared to the previous season I would say shut the f**k up and enjoy the ride!!!

I assume you are not going to attend any Post-Season matches as you don't believe that we will make it that far this season!

Do your maths again after round 6 on Sunday and see what it's like then.

We were a little bit unlucky in the end last season but I'm not sure finishing 6th proved anyone "very wrong". We still won only 7 games of 21, lost 9, and drew 5. To me, this = drawing and losing too much and in the 5 games so far this season we have done nothing to improve these statistics despite "good signs", "bad luck", "dominating" and all the other if, buts, and maybes that people are coming up with to defend Ricki.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Stevo, you jumped in the lions den.

Anyway theres people who will take a 'disscussion' to the extreme no matter if there a wrong, right or both.

A few times by page 13 you have to go " what the **** is this thread about"?

Far better than any other, which usually degenerates by page 4 on a good day.

I reckon Ricki's 'a bit' light on it.

According to the resent"how do we rate, 5 games in' poll so do 37.93% here who know so far, we are off the mark again.

We will have Ricki in charge of the Mighty NIX until the end of next season and maybe he'll get a telling off if we fail this year. ( that being < 6th ).

"sack Ricki" won't happen unless we get a really long bad run and are left in the dust of the others.

We all hope that doesn't happen

I like to see Ricki one game throw the watch and notes away and coach in the here and now.

Go Ricki

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Like pulling Diego before half time?
Or not making subs until 80 minutes?

When he pulls someone before half time he was criticised.
When he makes subs around the 60 - 70 mark he is accused of managing by the clock and criticised.
When he makes subs around the 80 minute mark he is accused of not giving his subs a chance.

Sometimes he can't win.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

aitkenmike wrote:

I'm not sure who this is aimed at but I haven't really mentioned his substitutions as being a major problem? I think last week he should've made them earlier, but like you say, he usually does so I don't know what happened there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

aitkenmike wrote:

I've not seen or heard any complaints about the sub before half time. Great move

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Subs issue wasn't directed at you Steve-o (It's not all about you! :P)

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

aitkenmike wrote:

Made the subs about 83 mins, and yes, your right, we didn't win, we got 1 measly point at home...not good enough.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

irnbru14 wrote:

aitkenmike wrote:

Made the subs about 83 mins, and yes, your right, we didn't win, we got 1 measly point at home...not good enough.

better than what CCM are doing against the same team (at home) at the moment.

All I do is make the stuff I would've liked
Reference things I wanna watch, reference girls I wanna bite
Now I'm firefly like a burning kite
And yousa fake fuck like a fleshlight

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

You forget,we should win every single game. Nothing else is good enough,and the coach should be soley responsible

Allegedly

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

whitby fever wrote:

irnbru14 wrote:

valeo wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

We played with1 up front, at home, in the 2nd half. That, for me, is a failure of Herbert.

This is an Adelaide team who have started poorly AND were missing players. They were there for the taking, and we failed to take them.

Ifill, imo, is naturally a wide player and probably feels more comfortable there. He's always going to drift out there anyway. Putting him in the middle in a 4-4-2 on a piece of paper doesn't change that. I really don't think that changing your formation at half time when you have been playing well in the first half is the greatest idea.

We shoudl be starting home games with more than Greenacre up front and hoping the players behind can get up to support him quick enough, we should be taking the game to the opposition more than we did on Friday night.

Personally I think pushing Ifill further forward to play just off Greenacre as an auxiliary forward, instead of an attacking wide midfielder, would at least be a start, and I think Ifill is perfectly capable of playing right up front with Greenacre.

I agree with you, the experiment with Bertos playing central did not work and he is either not comfortable in that role or he had a real off day.

Bertos/Daniel on the outside in a 442 and Greenacre/Ifill up front does it for me.

Starting with two up front does it for me, too. Goals win games. Goals come from an attacking mindset. Ricki should start by pencilling in his front two, then fill in the rest.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Tegal wrote:

You forget,we should win every single game. Nothing else is good enough,and the coach should be soley responsible

Well twisted, again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Tegal wrote:

You forget,we should win every single game. Nothing else is good enough,and the coach should be soley responsible

Yes yes, well done

We should be TRYING to win every game, moreso at home.

I personally think Ricki is happy to accept a point too often, seen it a few times now, where we could have gone for it but have sat in and settled for 1 point instead of the 3 we could and should be trying to get, especially at the Westpac.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Hopefully Herbert learns from the tactical mistakes against Sydney and we get forward and earn ourselves at least a point today. Cannot see it happening though. A loss will see us sharing bottom place with NQLD by the end of the round. Big game today

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Interesting to note that the smothering type of defence we played tonight was almost the same as the All Whites played against Jordan.

It seems to work so lets keep using it in both teams.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Our defense has come good and to be fair, we were told it would take about 5 games for this team to click.

Game 5 we were robbed and game 6 we piss on Melbourne in everyway in their backyard except on the scoresheet. Wouldn't have called that 2 months ago. He's given Rojas a run and I'm seeing a bit more steel in this side. Sure we were poor against Sydney and in the opener, but we have had 2 'poor' performances in 6 games. We've outplayed Perth, Brisbane, Adelaide and now Melbourne and had we put that extra goal in against the 3 draws where we deserved the win, we'd be sitting pretty.

For me, the issue is finishing and we are certainly creating shots of target (20 tonight) so where we have had a creativity issue in the past, it appears* to be solved. When you objectively look at it, its just the finishing that has let us down in these draws where we have been the better side. It'll come and I'm not worried by it. Its just patience.

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I didn't see the game in the weekend, but did we play 1 up front (with Ifill/Bertos in the hole behind Greenie) or a traditional 2?

All I do is make the stuff I would've liked
Reference things I wanna watch, reference girls I wanna bite
Now I'm firefly like a burning kite
And yousa fake fuck like a fleshlight

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Frankie Mac wrote:

I didn't see the game in the weekend, but did we play 1 up front (with Ifill/Bertos in the hole behind Greenie) or a traditional 2?

1 up again, a bit isolated (Greenacre) again 2nd half.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

So, same old, same old today.

Good first half, should have been 3-0 up, but then in the 2nd half we allow them back in the game and barely look like winning it! Annoying that the goal came in the last seconds but it had been coming and we got what we deserved really.

Once again we persist with 1 up front - IT IS NOT WORKING. All the evidence you require is to look at the 'goals for' column in the league table.

3 points next week is an absolute must or we are falling too far behind already.

Three 1-1 draws in a row FFS! Not good enough.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Agreed Stevo, we have to stop leaving greenacre up there on his own, we should have learned form last season with Smeltz, look at what happens when we have three up there, we score...why change a scoring formula?

Queenslander 3x a year.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Hard News said that Ifills sub was due to injury. In saying that, does that mean we need to have a set striker on the bench for home games? ie Costa or Chen?Torne2009-09-20 18:10:11

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Torne wrote:

News said that Ifills sub was due to injury. In saying that, does that mean we need to have a set striker on the bench for home games? ie Costa or Chen?

Ifill looked injured to me.

We need another striker on the pitch IMO, not on the bench!

Ifill drifts around everywhere and I certainly don't count him as a striker, much more of an attacking midfielder. He is definitely NOT partnering Greenacre, and that's what Greenacre needs for me.

I don't know why we don't just try 4-4-2, this 4-5-1 (it isn't a 4-3-3) is a piece of nonsense at home. It's fair enough away from home, but far too cautious at home.

Don't forget if Bertos hadn't scored his late wonder goal v Perth that would have been another 1-1 draw!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Was not coaches fault. Get a life.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Michael wrote:

Was not coaches fault. Get a life.

Well done on your concise argument.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

i don't really care about the coach but surely defensive football towards the end to keep the result is a managers decision. P.S I know theres no one better so im not suggesting a coach change.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

Michael wrote:

Was not coaches fault. Get a life.

ï¿½

Well done on your concise argument.

Any logical argument in this department goes round in circles.

Unless you know the full story of players fitness and injuries, then you cannot blame Ricki in the slightest.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

clark007e wrote:

i don't really care about the coach but surely defensive football towards the end to keep the result is a managers decision. P.S I know theres no one better so im not suggesting a coach change.

Unless you know the capabilities of every coach in the world, this simply can't be true.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

whats up with retreating in the second half?!?! Who were we playing, Barcelona?

Not happy about the complacency we showed in second half, seems like we need to go a goal down to give ourselves a kick in the arse

Botafogo - Rio de Janeiro and Wellington Phoenix, my two teams til death do us part.

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Michael wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

Michael wrote:

Was not coaches fault. Get a life.

Well done on your concise argument.

Any logical argument in this department goes round in circles.

Unless you know the full story of players fitness and injuries, then you cannot blame Ricki in the slightest.

Eh? What has fitness and injuries got to do with anything?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

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over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

The fact that Ifill was subbed maybe Steve-O.

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