Phoenix Ownership - Rob says FTFFA

http://content.radionetwork.co.nz/weekondemand/radiosport/21830.mp3 

6.10mins and onwards.

Banner for the next game: WE ARE WGTN ?

 I am interested in the relationship between mainstream media coverage, actual crowds, sponsorship and team following/popularity.

Call me paranoid, but I am constantly seeing news items on TV3 sports about the NZ Breakers as a regular item rather than as special news. Do not get me wrong, I wish them all the best and I have a passing interest in basketball too. But my question is, how many people turn up to their games, how many people actually "follow" the NZ Breakers? I know it is hard to estimate, but I'd be surprised if that was more than those supporting The 'Nix.   And I wonder if the same principle applies to the Warriors.

So here it is - following the same principle of one New Zealand team in an Australian competition, why is the Phoenix coverage in mainstream media, and I mean the main TV news and the Radio NZ,  like snippets, updates, pre-games news, and of course post-game analysis, so paltry in comparison with the other two other examples (the Breakers, the Warriors), one of whom is a competition leader/winner (NBL) , and the other a competition loser/ wooden-spooner (NRL). 

It cannot be just explained by lack of media savvy regarding football itself, because the EPL is constantly covered, esp on Radio NZ National, while the A-League does not get a mention apart from maybe the short mention on Monday morning of the result from Phoenix game on the weekend. I am still puzzled by this, and welcome a discussion or a thread of it's own, if there's enough interest.

More turn up to the Breakers than the phoenix. They sell out every week at 9000 odd people. 

No they don't.  They only play at Vector a couple of times a season.  Normally they play at the NSEC which is around 4000 when packed.

Friday was a major promo game for them against last years finalists and their main Rrrrrrrivals.  Also it's easy to sell a team when you have bought the best one in the league.

As for banner.  Why decide now?  I'm sure our PR clusterfuck will give us another half dozen stories by the next match.

O really? I was just going by information they fed me at the game. 

Looking at wiki, they get between 6000 and 8000 at vector normally. and 4000 at NSEC as you say. 

I'd say that puts them at least on par with us. 

Maybe we should tell Gareth that!

I've moved on from what Gareth actually said now, though it still annoys me, to a point where I am miffed about the lack of reaction to the reaction. From the owners admissions, they read the forums. How can any of them have come on here and not sensed that maybe an apology, or a retraction of the terminology used, was the best way to manage it? Gareth has done a couple of things publically since, hasn't retracted it. If he has been told to keep his mouth shut then the others sense the trouble he is causing, but they still haven't apologised?

I'm not fussed by the whole Wellington thing. As long as they play in Wellington colours it doesn't really bother me.

"What's in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet."

Or not in this case?

 I thought that was more of Telfer butting his nose in than anything real

He doesnt seem to get that all the teams are city based

 That statement by Downy and Gareths comments in an earlier interview about we did it for New Zealand.Make a mockery of Welnix claiming they did it for Wellington.Along with some of the other rubbish we have had recently im afraid it really does make me question if these guys really are the saviours they have been painted to be.

I look forward to Gareths comments and actions this season when the Hurricanes dont met expectations.

Nothing in it.

 Yeah probably.  At the time I was screaming at the radio.

I think the host was great and could have skewered him properly if he'd wanted to.  A few points:

- I think it's interesting that he claims that his media image in completely uncrafted and that he doesn't believe in PR, yet he has a clear PR strategy for making his campaigns as media friendly as possible and which revolves almost entirely around his own image.

- his strategy for engaging the public in his campaigns (hit them right in the ribs with an argument and see what they think of it I think he termed it) I think is entirely counterproductive.  He needs to take extreme positions to engage yet those initial opinions make real debate very difficult.  The idea that this cat stuff has opened up a conversation as he claims is fanciful - the ONLY story here is rich NZ economist wants to kill all cats. That's done nothing to advance the debate which he now claims doesn't address the substance of his argument and once again he blames the media, a clear sign of weakness.  Campaigns like this are entirely about influencing the conversation - if you lose control of the message that's not the media's fault, that means your strategy has failed.  

I think it's interesting that a guy who is so interested in policy and spends so much time and money developing a presence and platform for his ideas has had so little traction.  Climate change, social welfare, fisheries, macroprudential regulation - as acknowledged by the host, without the hook of an extreme opinion he had very little true traction on these issues nationally, he's not influencing the debate.

- when I said I thought it was embarrassing I was specifically talking about his rant at the dompost and Paul Thompson.  When he started accusing the dom of having "an agenda" I thought that was pretty telling - ultimately he cannot control what people write about him and that I think irks him.  When he was pressed on their so called agenda he said, they just want attention which is a weak response.  They are a newspaper, that is absolutely what they are aiming to achieve but the reality is that aside from 6000 hard core fans the rest of the city agrees with the Post and not Gareth.  His final point that the dompost shouldn't criticise unless they want to write cheques to back the team is as ridiculous as it sounds.  

A grown up, serious about how the club is perceived would acknowledge the club need the dompost on side more than the dompost need the Phoenix, man up, and sort out the relationship between the two.  Instead he comes out with more antagonistic stuff because ultimately he cares more about his own image than that of the club.  He thinks he's the story here, not the wellington phoenix

- when presented with what he called personal attacks (bored rich guy from Kerre Woodham) he says he'll only address the substance of the argument, but he himself has attacked a number of dom post journos personally and continues to do so just as he has done to many others who have criticised his cat campaign

- finally, I have to give it to him, he has managed to convince many that his plans for the club are entirely thought out, planned and part of some grand strategy.  But I'll be honest - I'm not the first to do it but I think it's important more of us do, I'm calling bullshit on his grand plan to turn around the club.  All I see is a club being run into the ground.  The ONLY strategy I can see is a plan to cut the remaining $1m a year from the deficit and for Gareth to keep his name in the headlines (and while I'd probably love to have people hanging on my every word if I had his profile, let's not confuse this with something he is doing for the good of the club).  Absolutely nothing is being done to improve any aspect of the club other than finances.  Our performances on the field are borderline pathetic, and we're the suckers who are listening to this charlitan and ultimately will be the ones left without a team to support.

Basically, I'm sick of the Gareth Morgan show and I'm sure I'm not the only one.  

Oooh nice sig Doloras *famous by association*

ummm lets see the team's identity, plus the chance of stying in the a-league. Dropping the wellington loses the home identity, adding NZ to it could potentially jepordise the a-league contract - I'm pretty sure the liscence is for Wellington Phoenix not the Phoenix or NZ Phoenix. The last trip to Auckland proved to me that ongoing "away" home trips to auckland in particular aren't going to be the moneyt spinners that Gareth wants and I can't see dropping Wellington from the name being that effective either - all it will do is piss of the 5k fans that love their local team!

Just "The Phoenix" like "The Hurricanes"?

Yep, that was the exact example brought up in the interview. 

Interesting that no owner or coach the Nix have ever had are good enough for JD. Of course, we've only had one coach, but any bets that when we finally (aww, cute kittie), the new coach will strike JD as "pathetic", "embarrassing", "a waste of space" within six months?

Wow, JD, good rant. When you decide you dislike someone you really give it 110%.

That's real ballsy "calling bullshit on his grand plan to turn around the club". You do realise it's not just Gareth's plan don't you?

You're essentially saying you know better than the collected wisdom of the entire Welnix ownership group and Board.

So, yeah, something certainly does smell like bullshit around here.

T_x, am I hallucinating or did you and I both worry 18 months ago about what a board of people who knew nothing about football would do in charge of the Nix?

Personally. I think the Welnix plan is flawed to the core. The idea of owning a professorial football team in this day and age and having it turn a profit is unrealistic. If you want to own a professional football team you have to be rich enough and realistic enough to understand that successful football team most likely equates to loss making business. The sums of money involved are simply outrageous.

Can you point out where he has said this? All I remember saying is that he doesn't want to hire a PR person. Which, for me, is fair enough.  It means he owes the issues, and probably gets more publicity from it.

I think that you missing the point that he bases his argument of research and facts, rather than blind ideology. Taking an extreme position would never work. Too easily dismissed. The real problem here is the superficial and sensationalist reporting from many, not all, journalist.  Their inability to comprehend basic issues and arguments is really, really poor.  The fact that you think the story is that all cats should be killed highlights that.

Well In the past couple of weeks there have been two factually incorrect articles. No truth to them at all. That is can be construed as either a deliberate agenda to create sensationalist stories/headlines to sell papers, or really poor journalism/editing. And I don't just think that applies to the Phoenix.

No, he's called out those journalist who have misreported. (ie. Sam for his story on Gareth walking on the pitch).

Wowsers

If he wanted to ruin the club, why take over it? Why not just let it die a few years ago when Terry went broke?

I think that is a bit of a  flaw in your conspiracy.