I don't think anyone would have thought that a few players would have laid a turd this year. Manny, Lia, and to a lesser extent, Sigmund and Durante. Sanchez has done nil, stein has been starved... It's that bad
Some of the players are the problem.
Expand please? Hardly anyone here seems to think the players are the problem, so I'm interested in fresh insight.
Oh know I think a lot of people do agree that the players are a big problem. Remembering these are the players Rick Hermit recruited over his last 5 years (hopefully his 5 year plan isn't similar to the last 5 years).
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Yeah, giving someone a new name is a really mature way of carrying on an argument. But laying that aside, which players do you have a problem with? Ricki recruited Ifill after all, so he must suck.
Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads
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dude his name is Ricki Herbert - show the man a little respect!
Queenslander 3x a year.
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dude his name is Ricki Herbert - show the man a little respect!
Whoops through out all these posts I think we have been talking about a different person. Sorry
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dude his name is Ricki Herbert - show the man a little respect!
Whoops through out all these posts I think we have been talking about a different person. Sorry
Rick Hermit is the guy that coaches Tony Blockface isnt it?
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so you have no idea who the coach of our team is? what the hell have you been going on about, and as Doloras says Ricki signed Ifill, he's had Smeltz, Rojas, Kosta and a whole host a decent players over the years, we also have Durante is he crap? frankly some of the signings have failed - but then show me a team where this hasn't happened?
Queenslander 3x a year.
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No, Rick Hermit is the drummer for Herman's Hermits. Something tells me he's into something good.
Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads
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Yeah, giving someone a new name is a really mature way of carrying on an argument. But laying that aside, which players do you have a problem with? Ricki recruited Ifill after all, so he must suck.
Yes Ifill was a good signing by Ricki Herbert (got it right that time), dont get me wrong occasionally he can surprise us, but I do expect a little more than the occasional good signing. Don't make me go through the long list of shockers it is a very long list. Over 5 years you do start to lose count. Ill remind you of the early years of Old and Christie, they have come a long way since.
Then their was the our version of Maradonna, Toto. Except he just lacked the skill and vision (and some how also managed to be a lot fatter than Maradonna). His biggest achievement of the year was putting on an extra 10 kilos, my understanding is the club paid him good money for that extra weight.
Kosta was a fantastic signing, to bad he never played.
Look Im not going to go on as I don't think most people want to listen to me and also listen and be reminded of the very long list of bad signings. Ill agree every club has them, we just seem to have a lot more, and we also seem to hold on to them
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You have a point but its subjective based on the definition of bad signing...
Grumpy old bastard alert
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Kosta played, just not too often he was competing with the likes of Smeltz for a spot though, like all clubs there will be some players that work and other s that don't for mine the players we hurridly signed to get a team together in the first 3/4 seasons did ok, this seaosn we had more time but still had some contracts to see out, next season whn most of the old contracts are done we should have more time and money to make sure it's done right, provided the owners don't get in the way.
Queenslander 3x a year.
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so you have no idea who the coach of our team is? what the hell have you been going on about, and as Doloras says Ricki signed Ifill, he's had Smeltz, Rojas, Kosta and a whole host a decent players over the years, we also have Durante is he crap? frankly some of the signings have failed - but then show me a team where this hasn't happened?
Quite correct I have no idea who the coach is I thought this was NBA team Phoenix Suns website. Stop being so sensitive.
Kosta never played and Rojas was picked up through the yellow fever scholarship.
Look I do agree that Herbert has made some good signings over the years, and that is the least I would expect from a professional football coach. But that doesn't change the fact the current squad lacks a lot of depth in certain areas and we have a lot of players that just arent up to it.
Im sorry but I judge a coach and his selection not on some individuals over the years but his current squad. And his current squad is no where near what it needs to be to compete in the top half of the league. And im sorry but that definitely is a reflection on Herberts choices and selections he made in recruiting.
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Kosta played, he even started a couple of times, read up on your team history before you make dumb comments. and his current squad on papaer isn't that bad - yes there are a few players who aren't up to it, but a lot of our failings have been down to our good players ie Ifill, manny, dura, sigmund, simply not playing well enough.
Queenslander 3x a year.
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In fairness everyone thought we had a top 2 squad. Players, staff, fans. No one could have predicted the improvement in football through the league this year and so many of our players falling flat at the same time
Grumpy old bastard alert
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I have a genuine (not rhetorical) question for the posters here who don't think Ricki should go, either now or at the end of the season, and for those who say they don't care either way: under what circumstances would you definitely think he should go?
Open player revolt is one example.
The only form you will see an open player revolt in football is on the pitch. You have the odd case of players not in the squad slagging off a manager, but it is very rare to see someone who is playing week in, week out to be bleating in the press about what an idiot the manager is. Even if it does happen, it will be one player and they will be talking to foreign publication and the whole thing will be put down to a translation problem.
What does happen is players stop trying 100% and end up on the wrong side of some big scorelines. I think that there is some evidence that this is already happening at the Phoenix.
All I do is make the stuff I would've liked
Reference things I wanna watch, reference girls I wanna bite
Now I'm firefly like a burning kite
And yousa fake fuck like a fleshlight
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Kosta played, he even started a couple of times, read up on your team history before you make dumb comments. and his current squad on papaer isn't that bad - yes there are a few players who aren't up to it, but a lot of our failings have been down to our good players ie Ifill, manny, dura, sigmund, simply not playing well enough.
For god sake he played a couple times when we had injuries, I barely call that playing and i definitely wouldn't call it good use of a good signing. It was very clear early on that Herbert didn't see him as an integral part of the team. If Herbert thought he was such a good signing why didn't he select him in the All Whites squad for the World Cup, and he would have tried a little harder to keep him instead of letting him take off to Brisbane for a trial and eventual signing by the roar.
I understand your points Prof, but would you agree that to be a good signing would also mean it is a player that is a regular feature in the side? Not 21 appearances (most from the bench) over 3 years.
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so you have no idea who the coach of our team is? what the hell have you been going on about, and as Doloras says Ricki signed Ifill, he's had Smeltz, Rojas, Kosta and a whole host a decent players over the years, we also have Durante is he crap? frankly some of the signings have failed - but then show me a team where this hasn't happened?
the problem is that Ricki has been directly responsible for every player that the Phoenix has signed. I don't have the numbers, but I would suggest that over the 5 years that would be somewhere in the region of 50 players. Naming 4 or 5 really good ones is as pointless as naming 4 or 5 really bad ones, but do you think that on the whole player recruitment over the life of the Phoenix has been good?
All I do is make the stuff I would've liked
Reference things I wanna watch, reference girls I wanna bite
Now I'm firefly like a burning kite
And yousa fake fuck like a fleshlight
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If rumours are correct it could be about to get a whole lot better at 9am this morning.
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In fairness everyone thought we had a top 2 squad. Players, staff, fans. No one could have predicted the improvement in football through the league this year and so many of our players falling flat at the same time
Not sure that it's the improvement in the league that has seen us falling this far down. I feel the biggest problem we've encountered this season is that the senior players the club's relied on to turn us into perennial play-off contenders have hit a wall - which is not surprising given the age of most of those players. But there's also an element of bad luck - I guess you could anticipate 1 or 2 getting to that point, and a squad can absorb that, but when it's more than half your starting line-up, and you have a lot of donkey on the bench, things go pear-shaped really quickly.
I do think Ricki probably needs to go as a coach, not because he's terrible and, according to some, the root cause of all our problems, but because he and this group of players have basically gone as far as they could have, and have come to the end of their cycle. Bringing in a new coach won't change things immediately or dramatically (we'll still have lots of dead wood in the squad to get rid of over the next season or two), but will bring a new perspective and a more positive feel around the club, which is sorely needed at the moment.
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Well reasoned. I can at least agree with that
Grumpy old bastard alert
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In fairness everyone thought we had a top 2 squad. Players, staff, fans. No one could have predicted the improvement in football through the league this year and so many of our players falling flat at the same time
Not sure that it's the improvement in the league that has seen us falling this far down. I feel the biggest problem we've encountered this season is that the senior players the club's relied on to turn us into perennial play-off contenders have hit a wall - which is not surprising given the age of most of those players. But there's also an element of bad luck - I guess you could anticipate 1 or 2 getting to that point, and a squad can absorb that, but when it's more than half your starting line-up, and you have a lot of donkey on the bench, things go pear-shaped really quickly.
I do think Ricki probably needs to go as a coach, not because he's terrible and, according to some, the root cause of all our problems, but because he and this group of players have basically gone as far as they could have, and have come to the end of their cycle. Bringing in a new coach won't change things immediately or dramatically (we'll still have lots of dead wood in the squad to get rid of over the next season or two), but will bring a new perspective and a more positive feel around the club, which is sorely needed at the moment.
Totally agree.
I don't think Ricki is terrible either - just not quite good enough.
I like tautologies because I like them.
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It's only one small step but credit where credit's due...
A big well done to Ricki and Welnix for the Hernandez signing.
The really exciting thing is its potential to now attract some other quality players here.
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In fairness everyone thought we had a top 2 squad. Players, staff, fans. No one could have predicted the improvement in football through the league this year and so many of our players falling flat at the same time
Not sure that it's the improvement in the league that has seen us falling this far down. I feel the biggest problem we've encountered this season is that the senior players the club's relied on to turn us into perennial play-off contenders have hit a wall - which is not surprising given the age of most of those players. But there's also an element of bad luck - I guess you could anticipate 1 or 2 getting to that point, and a squad can absorb that, but when it's more than half your starting line-up, and you have a lot of donkey on the bench, things go pear-shaped really quickly.
I do think Ricki probably needs to go as a coach, not because he's terrible and, according to some, the root cause of all our problems, but because he and this group of players have basically gone as far as they could have, and have come to the end of their cycle. Bringing in a new coach won't change things immediately or dramatically (we'll still have lots of dead wood in the squad to get rid of over the next season or two), but will bring a new perspective and a more positive feel around the club, which is sorely needed at the moment.
This sums it up perfectly for me. Ricki has been great for the Phoenix, and is (in his own style) a decent coach, but it's time for something fresh. And I don't buy into the whole "but who is there better out there" argument. We heard lots of that in the last days of TS, but it turned out there actually was someone else out there. And I firmly believe that there is another coach out there willing to take the Nix foward. For my money I'd rather take a punt on a young coach coming up through the systems (probably Australian) than stepping on the A-league coach merry-go-round.
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In fairness everyone in NZ thought we had a top 2 squad. Players, staff, fans. No one could have predicted the improvement in football through the league this year and so many of our players falling flat at the same time
Fixed that for you. In Oz some had predicted we would finish last, most struggling to make the 6.
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Great that Welnix have finally opened their wallets, I highly doubt that Hernandez would have come cheap. Perhaps they are finally learning that they can't run the club on as little money as they thought they could.
Yellow Fever - Misery loves company
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Yeah, giving someone a new name is a really mature way of carrying on an argument. But laying that aside, which players do you have a problem with? Ricki recruited Ifill after all, so he must suck.
Just to reply to this. This season for me was the big season for RH. Full off-season with stable owners giving him the salary cap to work with. In the past he's been hit (Ifill, Durante, Muscat) and miss (Gao, Chen, Toto...) but you were never really sure how much the dramas with Terry affected that.
So what did he achieve with the off-season? Signed Brockie (has scored lots of goals, has his issues, but on the whole a decent signing), Moss (good signing, unfortunate injury), Huysegems Smith Sanchez & Totori (all imports now struggling to make the starting line-up), Fenton & Boyd (promising youngsters admittedly, but not setting the world on fire as we first hoped), Boxall (promising but haven't seen enough of him). I.e. 2 good (both kiwis who the Nix have an advantage getting), 4 bad (all imports), 3 promising (again all kiwis). On the whole, the signings offered lots of promise but have failed to deliver, as evidenced by where we are on the table.
Added to that, we obviously didn't bed in any sort of gameplan during the offseason, then drastically decided to change direction mid-season (and I think it's now fairly well proven that this was Ricki's decision to change styles).
Which gives Ricki a final mark of "not achieved" for me.
P.S. Sorry that this is in the owner thread, but it was replying to the question.
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Great that Welnix have finally opened their wallets, I highly doubt that Hernandez would have come cheap. Perhaps they are finally learning that they can't run the club on as little money as they thought they could.
We don't really know. When he was at Melbourne he wasn't an official Marquee player. Ricki may have used one ninth of the salary cap on one player. Or Hernandez may be cheaper than you think, after all India must be one of the weakest professional leagues in the world, he wanted to come back to the a-league and other teams may not have trusted his work rate or simply offered less. Or yes they may have decided they need better results so will spend a bit but I suspect the salary cap mantra is still in effect.
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Ifill was a good signing by Ricki Herbert (got it right that time), dont get me wrong occasionally he can surprise us,
So what do you think of KFC-Man?
Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads
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Ifill was a good signing by Ricki Herbert (got it right that time), dont get me wrong occasionally he can surprise us,
So what do you think of KFC-Man?
I think its a good signing. We might be able to put out a half decent midfield now. Lets just hope we get some of his form he showed for Victory. I also hope our hoofball style football doesn't limit him
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welnix and Ricki have certianly shown they are trying to strengthen the attacking side of the midfield, hopefully it works and we see a vast improvement next year. Will be curious to see who Henandez replaces in the import spaces.
Queenslander 3x a year.
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Ricki: [calmly] I'm just contemplating the ifs.
Durante: [nervous] I don't wanna hear 'bout no motherfucking ifs. All I wanna hear from your ass is, "You ain't got no problem, Dura, I'm on the motherfucker. Go back in there, chill them playas out and wait for the cavalry, which should be coming directly".
Ricki: You ain't got no problem, Dura. I'm on the motherfucker. Go back in there and chill them playas out and wait for Hernandez, who should be coming directly.
Durante: [pauses and becomes calm] You signing Hernandez?
Ricki: Oh, you feel better, motherfucker?
Durante: [laughing] Shit, you fat goose, that's all you had to say!
Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads
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Great that Welnix have finally opened their wallets, I highly doubt that Hernandez would have come cheap. Perhaps they are finally learning that they can't run the club on as little money as they thought they could.
They have been doing it the last month to be fair. Interesting comments from Durante.
"Terry [Serepisos] was a fantastic owner and a really passionate guy who obviously came under quite a bit of financial issues. It was sad to see him go, the players were really close with him but the new owners have stepped in with financial security and a vision for the football club to develop youngsters and academies which is fantastic.
"That’s going to be a great future for the club and it helps the players as well knowing the club is very stable, and hopefully that attracts other players from other clubs and countries knowing that the club is financially stable."
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The players are just going through some growing pains. Party time under Terry is over. Welnix are more po-faced but at least they can afford to pay you. Word from training is that the Hernandez signing has already brought back a bit of excitement.
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Signing Hernandez is only part of the story here. No use having a player like that if you can't use him properly. The tactics, formations and selections are going to have to be bang on otherwise its a waste of a recruit. Hernandez is a good start and the owners deserve a pat on the back. But one player alone will not make the difference. I hope the owners continue to be bold in their quest for a more attacking, possession based style.....and that includes making tough calls on the coaching side at the end of the season as well.
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austin10. Try lifting the corners of you mouth up. Hold them there for 5 seconds.
There. How did that feel?
Repeat each day several times.
No need for thanks or a cookie.
"Phoenix till they lose"
Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion.
Genuine opinion: FTFFA
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I'm really happy to sign Hernandez...I think its a great signing. He has a great pedigree. I also was happy when signed Huysegems...he has a good pedigree as well. I just don't want to see Hernandez and hoofball on the same park otherwise he will be as effective as Hysegems has been.
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Think Carlos and Stein will work well together. If Carlos can put goals on a plate for Danny Allsopp, he can do it for Stein too.
a.haak
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