ASBP 2014/2015

I have not been blaming the Phoenix, it's you guys who just don't get it. I've been saying all along that it's NZF's lack of interest in its own national league that's at issue. I used all the talk of putting a Nix reserve team in the ASBP to prove a point. IT WASN'T A DIG AT THE PHOENIX, you really must get over your hyper-sensitivity.

The trouble with talking about anything where the Phoenix is mentioned on this forum and being a ACFC supporter is it's like mentioning Palestinian refugees in a debate about the middle east. The mere mention of the word and you're accused of anti-Semitism. regardless of what's being said. Crikey it's hard work getting through to some of you.

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Well it's all the fault of British, and the Americans just keep perpetuating it. Why can't they stay out of NZ football?

Its always the Chews !

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the ASB Prem highlights show back in 2005-06 may have been a little ragged around the edges, and they had a right muppet voicing over the games, but the overall thing didn't look THAT bad on TV... there was one shocker when a cameraman was stuck on the sideline so that the guys on the bench jumped in his way every time there was onfield action, but overall there was decent coverage of the key goal action etc each week, and all games were covered for not a huge amount of money (in industry terms).

Sure, I'm a bit biased, but I still think it was OK and worth being on air, all said and done... and no huge reason why something similar (or better) couldn't be done again...

Just look at 'Grassroots Rugby's success. That magazine-type format would work fine for the ASB IMO.  Also, the Sky hour-long prog on the ACFC Under-17 Easter tournament was good viewing (with Dennis Kotsanos once again MC).

See, it doesn't have to be dark pessimism that the ASBP isn't worth it. It's a damned good little competition and deserves some form of TV coverage. Sure it currently has a low profile and plenty of detractors but there are also football supporters who enjoy it and it should be invested in. It's time the NZF fronted up on behalf of its own national league. Now I've said this without mentioning you-know-who so it's not a you-know-who dig, so deep breath and relax JV and Tegal.

Still don't see why NZF should be fronting up to pay to have the ASB prem on TV. If the product is good in anyway it should have found itself a home on one of the free to air channels by now. The guys running the franchises should be the ones pushing to have there little comp on TV. Facts are no one wants it, Things might change now the nixs have a res side playing it in.

The introduction of sommet sports might also help it along. 

And BM, I'm quite relaxed. All I've ever asked you to do is back up your claims. Something you're still yet to do as far as I can tell. You tend to just cleverly change tact rather than directly answer my question. 

???

Arf!

Best post ever from someone who is constantly whinging about how his own club doesn't get enough respect on another club's forum.

And an ACFC as Palestine metaphor thrown in there as well.

Outstanding work BM.

That's not what I said, I'm talking about the whole ASBP not getting the respect and support it deserves. Also the Palestinian metaphor was not about ACFC. Come on you guys, make an effort. Some of you leap to the strangest conclusions. Also, isn't this thread about the ASBP?

I wish it bloody was about ASBP 2014/15, instead of the constant schoolyard carping. Canterbury, Otago and hawkes bay will/do have new gaffers. Any other coaching changes?

The franchises need to run the ASB Premiership......

NZ Football in a nutshell Global Game. Self destructive, agenda driven, it's my ball, my mates, all about ego and f*ck all to do about the game. At least it keeps us sad gits entertained when her in door's not up for it.

Unfortunately, because of the nature of TV and the place football holds in NZ, there is not going to be interest because of guys like Sommet and the internet epl cowboys that puts a 'better quality' product to the masses in their home.

I actually don't think we are too far apart BM but you seem to think we are. Remember, I go a long and watch a few of Waitakere and ACFC games so I'm linked in.

See bottom of previous page re-need for club based ASBP

That must be around 1982?

1980 National Soccer League table.  

Jesus that's a blast from the past. Diamond United? I've not seen that name in a long while. Used to play in orange with blue trim?

I really don't think the old 70s and 80s club based national league is viable now because of the sheer cost. Remember most clubs struggled to survive financially and quite a number - like the once mighty Mt Wellington, North Shore United and CHCH United are now only a shadow of their former selves. I think it has to be a franchise-based national league but to be really competitive it needs serious investment and promotion. Currently only ACFC, CU and HBU are truly viable.

Sorry you don't find the ASBP emotionally engaging Tegal, I actually do. I guess that's the difference between us. But then I have the luxury of supporting ACFC who do the business. I have nothing but admiration for the regulars who turn out to support the struggling sides. Still there's always a dream that any side could crack the O League, just like Team Wellington have next season. 

Yeah agree with you about the club based national league BM, my ideal situation would be a better ASBP for sure. 

I do turn out to see TW when I can, just the same as I turn out to see club football when I can. There is just a lot more emotion and I get a lot more enjoyment out of seeing club football at the moment. I'd love to see the ASBP teams being the best players from every club in each region, rather than just one winter club playing in a summer league. That'd engage me a lot more. 

I think most of what you have said is right - but you can't quote cost as an issue, some of those clubs you mentioned above paid silly amounts for players and when sponsorship or funding fell over they did too - it's not something you see happening but by the time it has it's too late - and to be honest if grant money dried up would ACFC be viable, do they have a backup plan? 

Well, that's kind of a good point. If pokie funding for the ASBP was centralised you could set aside a fund for the O-League qualifiers to pay for their campaigns (amongst other things, like marketing/promotion). Don't forget there's $3m sloshing around the ASBP at the moment.

That possibility has probably gone south now that the Nix reserves look like joining in though.

Fair point, I can understand why people often have more attachment to a local club than a franchise. I've always followed Central United and now add ACFC to that. I must confess ACFC is a much more attractive option - not least because of the standard of play, the fellow supporters and the summer weather. I also think the O League is growing in stature and interest. I hope football fans get out and support Team Wellington next season in the O League. If ACFC miss out lets make sure it's another NZ side that takes the O League.

By viable I was referring more to their set-up - solid core support and good ground with covered stand. I hope TW are going to be able to put in a decent O League performance and locals get out to support them. I just don't think Miramar's open ground is a good enough facility for this growing league. Perhaps they can use Newtown Park? I guess Wellington has a problem in that it doesn't have a compact (10,000), centrally located specifically football stadium well protected from the elements that could suit both the Nix and TW's needs. At least Auckland has Trust Stadium (5,000 seat covered stand) and North Harbour (10,000 covered main stand).

Newtown park is not ideal with the covered stand 30m back from the pitch. So upgrade of DFPark  western side - paid for by the regional council would be good(pipe dreams)

It's interesting how much more excitement there seems to be around the Chatham Cup - which is definitely having a renaissance - vs the ASBP.  I'm going off the franchise model I have to say, not that I'd go back to the old free for all national league - but what about a national champions league (so winter leagues act as qualifiers through to a 14 or 18 game summer national champions league (no playoffs) and O League).  Probably a million reasons why this doesn't work but would be interested to hear them.

The reason I don't think the franchise works is because I don't think that it is actually possible to have 8 equal-ish teams when you look at where the players are drawn from.  Otago will never put up a strong team unless they import a load of players - that seems pointless to me and also beyond what the whole regional thing was supposed to achieve.  I actually think it's the regional goal which has actually made the whole thing a bit of a mess.

Theoretically wouldn't that level out as the league expands though? Another team or two in Auckland dilutes their player pool and would make otago more competitive. 

You've got a good point. One of the strengths of ACFC is it's largely drawn from one winter club set-up - the Croatian-backed Central United. The same facilities, the same hard core supporters plus added summer fans. Canterbury and Hawkes Bay seem to have viable franchise models but most of the others are struggling for support. Lets be honest, TW is struggling to attract interest in Wellington. Perhaps it would be better if some of the other sides in the ASBP were drawn from clubs but the question is - are any of the winter clubs big enough to financially support a national league side? I doubt it. If an ASBP side can garner cross town interest it has a chance as seems to be happening in CHCH and Napier. I still think the franchise model can work - but it needs investment and promotion from NZF which our so-called national body seems very reluctant to provide.

If South Auckland United is given a chance in the ASBP then it'll be interesting to see if it's largely NZ-Fijian base turn out as they do in considerable numbers whenever a Fijian team is in town. Likewise, if the squabbling clubs on Auckland's north shore could ever get their act together I don't see any reason why a North Shore franchise couldn't work. On the other hand I think Waitakere are going to struggle to attract funding and players now they're not in next season's O League. I wouldn't be surprised to see WU go the way of YHM which would be a shame. 

Quite frankly I'm not optimistic for the long term survival of the ASBP because of NZF incompetence/indifference. ACFC's in good health but it's getting tougher each year to win the O League because the island teams are getting serious investment. Without the lifeblood of the O League prize money the ASBP would struggle. Two seasons without it and I would fear for its survival. Perhaps by letting the ASBP be a convenient means for the Nix to have a reserve side playing each week that would force others (notably Welnix and NZF) to at least take an interest.  

With NZF declaring a profit of $6.1 million for 2013 would now be a good time to ask them to hand back the near $100k they have taken from ACFC's latest O League winnings and put that money instead into the ASBP pot? Also could they stop topping up the inflated entry fee charged to ASBP franchises so they make a profit of some $20,000 on each entry fee?

I know it's asking a for a complete sea change to have NZF invest in their own national league but the plundering of the past has to stop. Why NZF could actually do some promotion too. Wouldn't that be nice?

spend scarce money on promotion so that 5 more fans get along and watch? There has to be a return on any marketing surely.