National League / OCL

No habla Espanol - the NZFC bitch fight

1196 replies · 141,694 views
almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
So Auckland City and Central got over $700k between them.

Must be very good at lifesaving.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
managed to save the football career of Mully.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
True humanitarians
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
You guys should be called green fever!!!!!!
So the grants quoted by other posters here to ACFC are far less than the collective prize money handed out to the other 7 ASBP teams, not forgetting the money NZF got which of course has found its way to the Phoenix
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
JordyBean wrote:
... not forgetting the money NZF got which of course has found its way to the Phoenix
 
You can prove that the money paid to the Phoenix to pay the national coaches salary came from the World Club money can you?

How's my driving? - Whine here

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
2ndBest wrote:


As usual Dale you hide behind a pathetic attempt at witty humour
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Auckland City Football Club have not had a grant declined by the Trillion Trust since 1 August 2005 (which is as far back as records on their website go, so it might be longer than that).
 
Trillion Trust grants to Auckland City Football Club since 1 August 2005 (by financial year 1 August to 31 July):
 
2005/06 - $372,116
2006/07 - $333,542
2007/08 - $451,445
2008/09 - $505,641
2009/10 - $481,640
 
During the six months from 1 August 2010 to 31 January 2011 ACFC has received a further $297,792 from the Trillion Trust.
 
Total grants by the Trillion Trust to Auckland City Football Club 1 August 2005 - 31 January 2011 = $2,442,176
 
 
terminator_x2011-04-01 14:30:32

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
JordyBean wrote:
As usual Dale you hide behind a pathetic attempt at witty humour
 
How is he hiding?  You know his name, everyone can see it on his profile.  Hardly hiding.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
JordyBean wrote:
... not forgetting the money NZF got which of course has found its way to the Phoenix


You can prove that the money paid to the Phoenix to pay the national coaches salary came from the World Club money can you?


and you can prove it didnt of course?
Besides is Ricki really on over 200k a year to coach NZ?

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Where does all that money go,if not to the players?

Must have some superb training facilities and academies for youngsters...

Allegedly

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
It should be pointed out there that Triillion trusts relationship with Auckland City has been investigated by Internal Affairs and the relevant authorities and neither party is deemed to have broken any rules or laws of the land.
 
THis is a key point.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
JordyBean wrote:
As usual Dale you hide behind a pathetic attempt at witty humour


How is he hiding? You know his name, everyone can see it on his profile. Hardly hiding.


Hiding because he has no response to the reply to his post!!!

let go of his hand and let him fight his own cornerJordyBean2011-04-01 14:31:39
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Which post didn't I reply to? The one in which you accused me of hiding?
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
It should be pointed out there that Triillion trusts relationship with Auckland City has been investigated by Internal Affairs and the relevant authorities and neither party is deemed to have broken any rules or laws of the land.

THis is a key point.


Exactly HN that is the Key point not that i was aware of that but i guess it makes my point about the cwc prize money all the more relevant
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
2ndBest wrote:
Which post didn't I reply to? The one in which you accused me of hiding?


No the one about the CWC PRIZE MONEY
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
JordyBean wrote:
2ndBest wrote:
Which post didn't I reply to? The one in which you accused me of hiding?


No the one about the CWC PRIZE MONEY
Was that addresed to me, or am I responsable to reply to all your posts?
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Tegal wrote:
Where does all that money go,if not to the players?

Must have some superb training facilities and academies for youngsters...


I dont know how its spent nothing to do with me!!!
But as HN just pointed out IA have no problem how it is spent so i fail to see how ACFC are "cheating" as alleged on this thread
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
terminator_x wrote:
Auckland City Football Club have not had a grant declined by the Trillion Trust since 1 August 2005 (which is as far back as records on their website go, so it might be longer than that).

Trillion Trust grants to Auckland City Football Club since 1 August 2005 (by financial year 1 August to 31 July):


2005/06 - $372,116

2006/07 - $333,542

2007/08 - $451,445

2008/09 - $505,641

2009/10 - $481,640


During the six months from 1 August 2010 to 31 January 2011 ACFC has received a further $297,792 from the Trillion Trust.


Total grants by the Trillion Trust to Auckland City Football Club 1 August 2005 - 31 January 2011 = $2,442,176





Please refer to HN post regarding IA investigation
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
It should be pointed out there that Triillion trusts relationship with Auckland City has been investigated by Internal Affairs and the relevant authorities and neither party is deemed to have broken any rules or laws of the land.
 
THis is a key point.
What about the laws of the ASBP that states it is an amateur comp?
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
If true that means no New Zealand laws were broken. 
 
The question about why an amateur football club needs that much money would still seem to be valid.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
For balance Term.  Can you post the City numbers for the years before?  I believe they made a loss at least one year and that should probably be published for balance.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

This is fascinating.

I'm with JordyBean.  If it's legal and above board, good luck to them.  Other clubs in NZ should up their game.

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
2ndBest wrote:
Hard News wrote:
It should be pointed out there that Triillion trusts relationship with Auckland City has been investigated by Internal Affairs and the relevant authorities and neither party is deemed to have broken any rules or laws of the land.

THis is a key point.

What about the laws of the ASBP that states it is an amateur comp?


Ask IA they dont have a problem with it apparently?
Only people like you do
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
thefever wrote:
If true that means no New Zealand laws were broken.

The question about why an amateur football club needs that much money would still seem to be valid.


As previously stated i have no idea what so ever how ACFC spend there grants
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Well, we can read between the lines can't we.
 
Assumption one: players like Mully aren't playing for free.
 
Assumption two: seeing as DIA have cleared them, they must be getting paid for legitimately gaming-machine funded work.
 
There are lots of things that they could be doing - including coaching, football in schools programmes, and even administration roles can be funded by gaming machine trusts.
 
The club could even be getting funding to reimburse significant expenses like rent and travel costs.
 
Whatever it is the club clearly have a close but not over the line relationship with Trillion.
 
Waitakere have a similar relationship with Cuesport I believe.

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Their
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Here's a question.
 
Is there a single NZFC franchise that is NOT doing what ACFC are doing?
 
TW are - they get NZCT money and they use some of it to pay Stu and some of it to pay Gilly and some of it to pay players.
 
They just don't get nearly as much as ACFC do.
 
I have no idea why.  But that doesn't mean any of it is illegal or dodgy.
 
 
Smithy2011-04-01 14:55:56

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
JordyBean wrote:
2ndBest wrote:
Hard News wrote:
It should be pointed out there that Triillion trusts relationship with Auckland City has been investigated by Internal Affairs and the relevant authorities and neither party is deemed to have broken any rules or laws of the land.

THis is a key point.

What about the laws of the ASBP that states it is an amateur comp?


Ask IA they dont have a problem with it apparently?
Only people like you do
Not sure DIA have any legal enforcement of rules set out by NZF.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
For balance Term.  Can you post the City numbers for the years before?  I believe they made a loss at least one year and that should probably be published for balance.
 
 
Do a register search on "Auckland City FC", or indeed any other NZFC franchise or football club you want to. It's all there.
 
By the way, all I am doing is posting publicly available information from the Incorporated Societies Register and the Trillion Trust website.
 
I have not inferred or implied anything, and definitely not that there's anything illegal going on.
 
If anything, what I find interesting about this is the extent of ACFC's reliance on a single gaming trust (aside from those "boom" years where they have received significant CWC prize money) and their ability to extract significant sums from that trust, relative to that trust's approved purposes. I am not expressing an opinion on that either way, however. As Smithy says maybe it simply illustrates how other NZFC franchises should be attempting to position themselves.
 
Trillion Trust is a nationwide trust so perhaps other NZFC franchises should be applying to them? After all, if ACFC does not have any kind of "special" relationship with Trillion Trust (as has been confirmed by the DIA) then one would expect at least some of those applications to be successful.
 
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
2ndBest wrote:
JordyBean wrote:
2ndBest wrote:
Hard News wrote:
It should be pointed out there that Triillion trusts relationship with Auckland City has been investigated by Internal Affairs and the relevant authorities and neither party is deemed to have broken any rules or laws of the land.

THis is a key point.

What about the laws of the ASBP that states it is an amateur comp?
Ask IA they dont have a problem with it apparently? Only people like you do


Not sure DIA have any legal enforcement of rules set out by NZF.


But surely if DIA had found out that any irregularity has taken place that would put ACFC in breach of league regulations, but they havent, so clearly ACFC havent breached league regulations
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
It is dodgy. They're just making it look not dodgy. It's a common business practise known as "creative accounting".

Its no longer a problem.

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
JordyBean wrote:

But surely if DIA had found out that any irregularity has taken place that would put ACFC in breach of league regulations, but they havent, so clearly ACFC havent breached league regulations
Is it clear though? DIA investigates laws they are responsible for.  That does not include NZFC regs.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Smithy wrote:

This is fascinating.

I'm with JordyBean.  If it's legal and above board, good luck to them.  Other clubs in NZ should up their game.
Yes - exactly - Maybe if all other clubs upped their game then the league would grow, thus attracting further sponsorship thus attracting more punters and lo and behold NZ has a league to be proud of.

Auckland City FC

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

You'd be a very brave person to put money on this.  This isn't sponsorship dollars.  This is trust grants.  All it takes is a slight law change or more rigorous policing in some cases and that whole source could dry up.

Strictly speaking trusts funds use is questionable across large parts of sport.  One set of law changes has already sent people scurrying for cover, another could shut it off completely.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
alireggae wrote:
Smithy wrote:

This is fascinating.

I'm with JordyBean.  If it's legal and above board, good luck to them.  Other clubs in NZ should up their game.
Yes - exactly - Maybe if all other clubs upped their game then the league would grow, thus attracting further sponsorship thus attracting more punters and lo and behold NZ has a league to be proud of.
Careful - you are agreeing with an aussie.
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Quickly, someone tell Matt Nippert we've found another field of Poppies that looks ripe for the lopping.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
2ndBest wrote:
JordyBean wrote:
But surely if DIA had found out that any irregularity has taken place that would put ACFC in breach of league regulations, but they havent, so clearly ACFC havent breached league regulations

Is it clear though? DIA investigates laws they are responsible for. That does not include NZFC regs.


If that is the case (And i dont believe it is and that if DIA had found a breach then that would negate the amateur status) then NZF need to police it then?
And either they have and found no problem or they cant be bothered to
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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Smithy wrote:
There are lots of things that they could be doing - including coaching, football in schools programmes, and even administration roles can be funded by gaming machine trusts.
 
Good point Smithy.
 
Increase in Auckland City Football Club's personnel expenses over the last three years (from ACFC's published accounts):
 
2007/08  $369,907
2008/09  $471,670
2009/10  $743,550
 
Obviously a big increase. It would be good to know how that breaks down and where the money goes so that other NZFC franchises could learn from that and model themselves on ACFC "best practice".
 
 

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almost 15 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:

You'd be a very brave person to put money on this. This isn't sponsorship dollars. This is trust grants. All it takes is a slight law change or more rigorous policing in some cases and that whole source could dry up.


Strictly speaking trusts funds use is questionable across large parts of sport. One set of law changes has already sent people scurrying for cover, another could shut it off completely.


Very good point if this was to happen then pretty much every sporting club in the country would have trouble getting funding not just ASBP or football clubs
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