Central League 2

Bigboot wrote:

 bigfudge wrote:

 LT01 wrote:
Is trimming to eight teams an option? 

I really don't think they need to. Just from what I've gathered throughout this year, Gisborne United would love to go up, same as Whanganui, same as Greytown, same as Havelock North. The issue is just whether they allow CL2 teams or not. The pool of ambitious clubs with first teams not already in CL or CL2 is thin in Wellington which is another factor that will impact this. Outside of Greytown, the only other club side in the Cap region i can think would probably be Welly United that habours aspirations of making it back to CL.

Wellington United are a long long way away from CL football

theprof wrote:
it's gonna take a bit for the United men to get out of Cap1, gonna need a lot of investment, something similar to what was done with the women a few years back.

 

reubee wrote:

 Tyler wrote:
Options being discussed and agreed. I believe the options are. 

1- keep CL2 as is (first teams only from Capital and Central).

2- keep CL2 but allow ressies teams in there based on current placements from Capital prem. Think would mean Olympic ressies go in.

3- scrap CL2 and send the Central teams back to Central. Would mean the Capital CL2 teams would go to Cap Prem. 

I'd vote 3
I think there is too much travel fatigue, as you go down the pyramid there should be less travel.
The National League System in the UK  has a 1-2-4-8-16 model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_League_System#Organisation:~:text=pure%20pyramid%20in%20a%201%2D2%2D4%2D8%2D16%20was%20the%20goal .  With our geography and population distribution, we should have a 1-3-6-12 model which would mean no CL2 but a CL2 North, CL2 South.  

Step 1: National
Step 2:Northern, Central, Southern
Step 3:NL2 North, NL2  South, CL2 North, CL2 South, SL2 North, SL2 South 
Step 4:Northland, Auckland, Waikato, Bay of Plenty, Taranaki, Hawkes Bay, Manawatu, Wellington, Tasman, Canterbury, Otago, Southland

Depending on the teams and distributions, that might mean a team in the middle geographically such as TK could be in CL2 North one year and CL2 South the next.  In a worst case scenario of 11 Capital and 9 Central, you might go with a CL2 East and a CL2 West.
 
For reserve teams, a regulation for reserve teams to be a minimum number of divisions apart, I'd probably say 2 steps apart, so a National league reserve team could be as high as step 3, a Northern, Central, Southern reserve team to be as high as step 4.

bigfudge wrote:

 reubee wrote:

 Tyler wrote:
Options being discussed and agreed. I believe the options are. 

1- keep CL2 as is (first teams only from Capital and Central).

2- keep CL2 but allow ressies teams in there based on current placements from Capital prem. Think would mean Olympic ressies go in.

3- scrap CL2 and send the Central teams back to Central. Would mean the Capital CL2 teams would go to Cap Prem. 

I'd vote 3
I think there is too much travel fatigue, as you go down the pyramid there should be less travel.
The National League System in the UK  has a 1-2-4-8-16 model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_League_System#Organisation:~:text=pure%20pyramid%20in%20a%201%2D2%2D4%2D8%2D16%20was%20the%20goal .  With our geography and population distribution, we should have a 1-3-6-12 model which would mean no CL2 but a CL2 North, CL2 South.  

Step 1: National
Step 2:Northern, Central, Southern
Step 3:NL2 North, NL2  South, CL2 North, CL2 South, SL2 North, SL2 South 
Step 4:Northland, Auckland, Waikato, Bay of Plenty, Taranaki, Hawkes Bay, Manawatu, Wellington, Tasman, Canterbury, Otago, Southland

Depending on the teams and distributions, that might mean a team in the middle geographically such as TK could be in CL2 North one year and CL2 South the next.  In a worst case scenario of 11 Capital and 9 Central, you might go with a CL2 East and a CL2 West.
 
For reserve teams, a regulation for reserve teams to be a minimum number of divisions apart, I'd probably say 2 steps apart, so a National league reserve team could be as high as step 3, a Northern, Central, Southern reserve team to be as high as step 4.





 

This is just Fed League which is what Central Football was trying to avoid with the introduction of CL2. In theory it makes complete sense.

One of the issues is the gap between the ambitious sides in the Central Federation and the local club sides is just too big. That's why CL2 works (for Central Football at least), becuase it allows the ambitious sides to play at a good level and against good opposition, and lets the local clubs play at East and West Prem. 

There are plenty of difficult challenges for Central sides to overcome and CL2 has undoubtedly helped.

I love the sound of you idea, but it would probably just turn into 4-5 clubs form the Central Region, and then a bunch of Welly sides having to be 'North'. 

observer wrote:

 bigfudge wrote:

 reubee wrote:

 Tyler wrote:
Options being discussed and agreed. I believe the options are. 

1- keep CL2 as is (first teams only from Capital and Central).

2- keep CL2 but allow ressies teams in there based on current placements from Capital prem. Think would mean Olympic ressies go in.

3- scrap CL2 and send the Central teams back to Central. Would mean the Capital CL2 teams would go to Cap Prem. 

I'd vote 3
I think there is too much travel fatigue, as you go down the pyramid there should be less travel.
The National League System in the UK  has a 1-2-4-8-16 model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_League_System#Organisation:~:text=pure%20pyramid%20in%20a%201%2D2%2D4%2D8%2D16%20was%20the%20goal .  With our geography and population distribution, we should have a 1-3-6-12 model which would mean no CL2 but a CL2 North, CL2 South.  

Step 1: National
Step 2:Northern, Central, Southern
Step 3:NL2 North, NL2  South, CL2 North, CL2 South, SL2 North, SL2 South 
Step 4:Northland, Auckland, Waikato, Bay of Plenty, Taranaki, Hawkes Bay, Manawatu, Wellington, Tasman, Canterbury, Otago, Southland

Depending on the teams and distributions, that might mean a team in the middle geographically such as TK could be in CL2 North one year and CL2 South the next.  In a worst case scenario of 11 Capital and 9 Central, you might go with a CL2 East and a CL2 West.
 
For reserve teams, a regulation for reserve teams to be a minimum number of divisions apart, I'd probably say 2 steps apart, so a National league reserve team could be as high as step 3, a Northern, Central, Southern reserve team to be as high as step 4.





 

This is just Fed League which is what Central Football was trying to avoid with the introduction of CL2. In theory it makes complete sense.

One of the issues is the gap between the ambitious sides in the Central Federation and the local club sides is just too big. That's why CL2 works (for Central Football at least), becuase it allows the ambitious sides to play at a good level and against good opposition, and lets the local clubs play at East and West Prem. 

There are plenty of difficult challenges for Central sides to overcome and CL2 has undoubtedly helped.

I love the sound of you idea, but it would probably just turn into 4-5 clubs form the Central Region, and then a bunch of Welly sides having to be 'North'. 

The best three Cap Prem teams would beat most if not all of the CL2 teams so it would make sense to keep CL2 with four possibly five newly promoted teams to make the league better.

If Western Suburbs win their NL playoff in September the 5 teams from CL will go to NL and 5 teams from CL2 will go to CL. That leaves room for 5 promoted teams to CL2 and it would make sense to have the top 3 CP teams plus 1 each from West and East to get promoted to CL2. I don't see a problem with reserve teams playing in CL2 if they are worthy of a spot in that league due to their league positions - not just beacuse their 1st teams are in NL.

If WS lose the playoff then only 4 teams move up and the powers that be will have to calculate some form of playoff forn the affected teams. It would have made sense to have all of these permutations set out at the start of the season.

spottswood wrote:
Watched the PNM vs Hutt game. A real game of 2 halves. Hutt could have been 3 up at the half and played excellent football. Second half a complete turnaround and Marist really should have won it. Overall impression, I think the Hutt are a way better team than their league position suggests and if Marist don't make the top 4, I'll be shocked.

Bigboot wrote:

 spottswood wrote:
Watched the PNM vs Hutt game. A real game of 2 halves. Hutt could have been 3 up at the half and played excellent football. Second half a complete turnaround and Marist really should have won it. Overall impression, I think the Hutt are a way better team than their league position suggests and if Marist don't make the top 4, I'll be shocked.

I’m not so sure about Lower Hutt. I’ve seen them play a few times and I don’t think they are better than any teams above them. They are definitely a team that can beat anyone on their day though.

PNM have drastically improved since the start of the season, this coming weekend may decide whether their promotion is possible or probable. Game of the round – North Wellington vs PNM

Bigboot wrote:
After predicting the results of the remaining fixtures (including the Seatoun v Palmerston North Marist catch-up game), and creating a bit of suspense for the final matchday, here is my predicted final table:

 

1. Taradale AFC – 35 pts (DLWW)
   Still the team to beat. They have a tough looking run-in with Seatoun and PN United, but their home form and consistency should see them get enough points to take out the league. I’m picking a slip up at home to Seatoun and away at DV.
2. Palmerston North Marist – 34 pts (WLWDW)
   A massive final few weeks. They have five games left and a lot of them are against teams around them. I think they pick up enough results, but the Seatoun and North Wellington games could decide whether they lift the trophy.
3. North Wellington – 34 pts (LWLW)
   Probably the side with the best opportunity to finish strongly. Four very winnable games, although the trip to Palmerston North and Seatoun away will test them. Could easily finish higher. I’m also picking Tawa to have their number this weekend.
4. Seatoun – 33 pts (DWWDW)
   A brutal run home starting with Taradale away, but plenty of opportunities to make up ground with games against the teams around them. The midweek Marist game and final round against Lower Hutt could decide their season.
5. Tawa – 31 pts (WWLW)
   A tough run home with three games against teams fighting for the top four. I think they will topple NW this weekend, but I think they just miss out - unless Wests do them a favour and there are 5 promotions.
6. Palmerston North United – 27 pts (WLWL)
   The dark horse. They have the easiest looking fixture list on paper but need to find consistency. If they win their last four, they could jump all the way into the promotion spots.
7. Lower Hutt City – 22 pts (LWL L)
   A difficult finish with three games against sides above them. They will be competitive but probably struggle to collect enough points.
8. Stop Out – 21 pts (WLWL)
   Always capable of a surprise result, but I think they finish in the lower half. Wins against the teams below them to finish the season with some positivity.
9. Wainuiomata – 12 pts (LLLL)
   Have shown improvement but the final fixtures are challenging. Might just pip DV on goal difference to avoid the wooden spoon.
10. Douglas Villa – 12 pts (LWLL)
    A tough season, but they remain a dangerous side at home and could still have a say in the promotion race. I’m picking an upset at home to Taradale.

The top four is going right down to the wire. A couple of results in those head-to-head games could completely change everything — which is exactly what makes the final few rounds so exciting.

1. Taradale AFC – 33 pts (LDW)
   Draw was predicted last week, but think they are too one-dimensional and could slip up further.
2. Seatoun – 33 pts (WWDW) Predicted the draw last week. They have some great momentum. Poor goal difference. 
3. Palmerston North Marist – 32 pts (LWDW)
   Definitely a slip up last week. Still some tough fixtures remaining
4. Tawa – 31 pts (WLW)                  Huge win last weekend. A perfect finish could be in contention for the title, one slip up and they are 4th I predict.
5. North Wellington – 28 pts (WLW)
   Missed out last weekend, also a tough run in. Next two weeks are make or break.
6. Palmerston North United – 26 pts (LWL)
   The coach subs himself on, gets sent for a reckless challenge and then they concede an injury time goal. Two points lost - Has the coach just cost them promotion?
7. Lower Hutt City – 24 pts (WDL)
   Huge result away to PNM. Taradale and Seatoun will definitely be nervous playing these guys. 
8. Stop Out – 21 pts (LWL)
   Could make it tough for Tawa and PNM.
9. Wainuiomata – 13 pts (LLL)
   Great fight back to grab a point. Still inconsequential. 
10. Douglas Villa – 12 pts (WLL)
    Their cup final next week and something to prove. 1 v 10. 

Tyler wrote:
I thought Nth Wellington were going to head to the top but they’ve wobbled as well.

What an interesting league this is! PNU continue their awful run.

No central league next week so might get along to watch Seatoun. 

bigfudge wrote:

 Tyler wrote:
I thought Nth Wellington were going to head to the top but they’ve wobbled as well.

What an interesting league this is! PNU continue their awful run.

No central league next week so might get along to watch Seatoun. 

Seems like depth is still hurting PNU. I see their coach came off the bench and got sent off! 

Really thought NW would push on but yet another wobble. Their poor start to the season may of cost them.

Bigboot wrote:

 bigfudge wrote:

 Tyler wrote:
I thought Nth Wellington were going to head to the top but they’ve wobbled as well.

What an interesting league this is! PNU continue their awful run.

No central league next week so might get along to watch Seatoun. 

Seems like depth is still hurting PNU. I see their coach came off the bench and got sent off! 

Really thought NW would push on but yet another wobble. Their poor start to the season may of cost them.

The whole debate about paying players is an interesting one. I wonder if the model of overcharging juniors to pay players easily into their 30s is worth it in the long term?

I know that NW have some excellent young players such as Holden, yet they still pay Cunny $xxx per week and keep Holden from starting and developing. 

I doubt the 30+ year old mercenaries or the young up and coming players will play next season if they don’t get promotion. Then what?

Bigboot wrote:
I see that PNU had their coach come on late as a sub, the get sent off, then they conceded in injury with 10 men? 

Any feedback what happened there? Seems like the coach has a few questions to answer there….. 

Doing a little bit of digging, the last game they won was way back in Round 7 when they beat Seatoun at home. Ironically that’s who they are playing this weekend. 

1. Taradale – 30
2. Tawa – 28
3. PN Marist – 28 (15 games)
4. Seatoun – 26 (15 games)
5. North Wellington – 22
6. PN United – 22
7. Lower Hutt – 21
8. Stop Out – 18
9. Wainuiomata – 13
10. Douglas Villa – 10

hotchips wrote:

 Bigboot wrote:
I see that PNU had their coach come on late as a sub, the get sent off, then they conceded in injury with 10 men? 

Any feedback what happened there? Seems like the coach has a few questions to answer there….. 

Doing a little bit of digging, the last game they won was way back in Round 7 when they beat Seatoun at home. Ironically that’s who they are playing this weekend. 

They've had a lot of injuries and he has played quite a bit, even started at least once. He's a bit of a throwback of a defender, throws himself into tackles, loves a big slide presumably got one wrong. I heard he is gone at the end of the season - which I guess based on their drop-off was inevitable.

Point of contact shown below. Live stream of game is on youtube on PNU Academy channel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=rQptIJLXohM&ra=m&fbclid=IwY2xjawTon19wZG9mBWV4dG4DYWVtAjEwAHNydGMGYXBwX2lkEDIyMjAzOTE3ODgyMDA4OTIAAR53KA_3RdBeIIw_sgpPPrd63SO8CY93a6uN-zw8kFgJDE2yo0WocnpkBsQkPA_aem_Aj6GCWpGQde-h_yhylugLg

He does miss the ball, but the contact is only with his trailing right foot on the Wainuiomata player. It's a slightly late challenge, but it doesn't feel like theres excessive force or any studs, so straight red feels excessive. Having dealt with this ref in the past he can strange at the very least to play under.

image.png 93.65 KB

KingzWA wrote:
Sadly Jack Boyd the Seaton Club Patron has passed away.
RIP Jack.

Shambles wrote:
With the league drawing to a close and being so tight who do we reckon has had the best season coaching wise? 

Bigboot wrote:
CL2 Round 16

Alright. A big weekend that could ‘almost’ decide the promotion race, or blow it wide open!

There are five games this weekend, and all five have something significant riding on them.



Douglas Villa v Taradale



Taradale: 29 pts | Douglas Villa: 9 pts
Previous meeting: Taradale 2–2 Douglas Villa



This is a potential banana skin for Taradale. The first meeting finished 2–2, so Douglas Villa have already demonstrated that they can frustrate the league leaders.



However, Taradale are now only four points clear of Tawa and Marist, with both teams capable of winning this weekend. They simply can’t afford another draw.



Taradale should have too much quality, but I wouldn’t expect an easy afternoon.



Prediction: Draw



➡️ Taradale to 30 points




Palmerston North Marist v North Wellington



Marist: 25 pts from 14 | North Wellington: 22 pts from 15
Previous meeting: North Wellington 1–2 PN Marist



This is probably the game of the round.



Marist already beat NW in Wellington and now get them at home. They also have a game in hand, so a win here puts them in an extremely strong position.



NW are in a slightly different situation. They can’t afford to keep dropping points with Seatoun, Tawa and PN United all breathing down their necks.



Marist have the better recent head-to-head result and home advantage. I think they edge it again.



Prediction: PN Marist WIN



➡️ Marist to 28 points




Seatoun v Palmerston North United



Seatoun: 23 pts from 14 | PN United: 22 pts from 15
Previous meeting: PN United 3–0 Seatoun



This is a massive six-pointer.



The table is incredibly tight: Seatoun are fourth on 23, while PN United are only one point behind. A United win would take them above Seatoun and potentially put them right into the top-four race.



The 3–0 result from the first meeting is also a warning sign. PNU clearly know how to cause Seatoun problems.



But Seatoun are at home, and on an unbeaten 5 game run. Meanwhile PN United haven’t won since May 16th (against Seatoun). This is exactly the type of game Seatoun need to win if they’re serious about promotion. With the Marist/NW game also taking points away from one of their rivals, three points here could be hugely valuable.



I expect a much tighter game than the first meeting.



Prediction: Seatoun WIN



➡️ Seatoun to 26 points




Tawa v Stop Out



Tawa: 25 pts | Stop Out: 18 pts
Previous meeting: Tawa 7–0 Stop Out



It’s difficult to look past Tawa here.



The 7–0 result from the first meeting is obviously a massive indicator, although I wouldn’t expect another seven-goal margin.



More importantly, Tawa are now second in the table, just four points behind Taradale. They’ve played one more game than Marist but have a very real chance of putting pressure on the leaders.



This is the sort of fixture promotion contenders have to win.



Prediction: Tawa WIN



➡️ Tawa to 28 points




Wainuiomata v Lower Hutt City



Wainuiomata: 12 pts | Lower Hutt: 20 pts
Previous meeting: 1–1



This is the hardest one to call.



Lower Hutt are sitting seventh but are only three points behind North Wellington and PN United. They’re not completely out of the top-half picture yet.



Wainui are at home and have already shown they can make this matchup difficult, with the first meeting ending 1–1.



I can see another tight game. Lower Hutt probably have more to lose, while Wainui can play with a bit more freedom.



Prediction: DRAW



➡️ Lower Hutt to 21 points



Predicted table after Round 16

1. Taradale – 30
2. Tawa – 28
3. PN Marist – 28 (15 games)
4. Seatoun – 26 (15 games)
5. North Wellington – 22
6. PN United – 22
7. Lower Hutt – 21
8. Stop Out – 18
9. Wainuiomata – 13
10. Douglas Villa – 10

The really interesting thing is that Tawa and Marist could both be on 28, with Tawa having the better goal difference, but Marist with a game in hand. That would put them only two points behind Taradale.


And then you’ve got Seatoun on 26, with North Wellington, PN United and Lower Hutt all still within striking distance. From a Seatoun perspective, this is a massive weekend. Win at home and they’re only four points off the top with the North Wellington game still to come and a game in hand. Lose, and PN United go above and the door remains wide open for PN United, NW and LH.

With no CL, WCL or Cup fixtures in Wellington this weekend I am expecting some extra eyes on a couple of these matches! 

Shambles wrote:
With the league drawing to a close and being so tight who do we reckon has had the best season coaching wise? 

zonknz wrote:
Douglas Villa 1 - Taradale 0. 
Last v First 

Sums the craziness of this league up in one game.

BigRed49 wrote:
When you see how tight and entertaining this season and last season of CL2 has been....what fool would suggest getting rid of the league? Only Capital Football could make such an absurd proposal....

Bigboot wrote:

 BigRed49 wrote:
When you see how tight and entertaining this season and last season of CL2 has been....what fool would suggest getting rid of the league? Only Capital Football could make such an absurd proposal....

While the proposals were developed by Capital Football, the pressure to get rid of it would have come from the National League clubs.

Less than two weeks u til the end of the season, I have read an email that says a decision will be announced before then. 

bigfudge wrote:
Not specifically CL2 related but if they're not in CL2 next season I'll never post on here again.

https://www.shropshirestar.com/sport/football/shrewsbury-town-fc/released-shrewsbury-town-youngster-starts-remarkable-new-chapter-11000-miles-away-8790142

Greytown sign attacking midfielder from Shrewsbury Town U18s. The Keinzley pull needs to be studied. 

Feverish wrote:

 bigfudge wrote:
Not specifically CL2 related but if they're not in CL2 next season I'll never post on here again.

https://www.shropshirestar.com/sport/football/shrewsbury-town-fc/released-shrewsbury-town-youngster-starts-remarkable-new-chapter-11000-miles-away-8790142

Greytown sign attacking midfielder from Shrewsbury Town U18s. The Keinzley pull needs to be studied. 

Not sure they could handle the financial regulations of higher leagues 

bigfudge wrote:

 Feverish wrote:

 bigfudge wrote:
Not specifically CL2 related but if they're not in CL2 next season I'll never post on here again.

https://www.shropshirestar.com/sport/football/shrewsbury-town-fc/released-shrewsbury-town-youngster-starts-remarkable-new-chapter-11000-miles-away-8790142

Greytown sign attacking midfielder from Shrewsbury Town U18s. The Keinzley pull needs to be studied. 

Not sure they could handle the financial regulations of higher leagues 

Not sure that will impact them as much as you think. Plenty of sides have gone big financial-wise in Central League and I've never seen any clubs been pulled up for it.

The article mentions that they have sort accomodation for the player in Masterton which is a tactic CL clubs have used for years. I know that Rupert Kemeys would sort out accomodation and a car for some players when he was with Olympic.