Was - Phoenix Transfer Speculation

3999 replies · 239,887 views

over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Again Riccardo, only Mulligan out of those three doesn't curently have a deal so they aren't realistic targets unless they fancied picking a fight to come here.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Yeah Keat and Boxhall are probably options in 1-2 seasons. Keat is one I'd really like to see back here eventually, Wellington boy came through the system, always a good advertisement for the game in the region

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

playwithFire wrote:

i wonder if people would rather sign Simon Elliot, or an aussie with the exact same skill level, but ten years younger?? That would interest me.

We couldn't afford an Aussie 10 years younger with Elliott's skills.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Yeah that's a premier league midfielder!

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

This. /

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I wouldnt mind Keat coming back, but he needs to give his MLS career a real go before coming back.

I reckon the fringe AW's like Bright, and Henderson could be potential targets? Not as necessarily first team players, but a chance for them to jumpstart their career, and also be under the eye or RH.

Think Killen has gotta be back soon, needs two seasons with the nix

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

Are there any genuine kiwi targets out there anyway?

I've mentioned Killen but he could well be on comparitive mega-bucks in China, Rory but he still fancies a tilt in the UK it seems, Elliot we've tried, not sure Boyens is quite up to it - beyind that it's a pretty short list of guys who have already played for us or probably arent up to A-League level.

There are Kiwis scattered across various leagues around the world, but then it comes down to the issues of A) are they available? and B) are they up to standard or merely another signing to fill a gap?

A few current or former All Whites spring to mind like Chris James (shame he dropped off the radar, thought by now he'd be running the AW's midfield), Kris Bright (wasn't flash at Shrewsbury and is now in Hungary?) and then the ones we've tried already such as Mully & Christie.

Cunningham in Singapore(?) is one that interests me purely coz he's an unknown quantity that has made a career for himself elsewhere away from the NZF set up, but once again, is he up to standard and what'd he cost us?

I'm going to assume Jack Pelter has turned to total mud since his Sunderland days....

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

...playing for Metro. (Pelter)

Bright at Honved. James is playing NSWPL for Apia Leichardt and has shown moments of brilliance but no sign of interest from A-League sides as yet.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Hard News wrote:

...playing for Metro. (Pelter)

Bright at Honved. James is playing NSWPL for Apia Leichardt and has shown moments of brilliance but no sign of interest from A-League sides as yet.

Tinkler is/was at AL with James?

Theres plenty of Kiwis in the aussie state leagues like Knox, Fleming etc who have played in NZFC but if they aren't outshining aussies there why should the phoenix sign them?

Brent Fisher is another one whos seemed to have dropped off the radar

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

maybe we should bring back O'Dor....

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

...and Messam at APIA as well.

Quite a number in Melbourne now too. Think O'dor is still at South Melbourne.
Hard News2011-07-26 00:20:58

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Hard News wrote:

...and Messam at APIA as well.

Quite a number in Melbourne now too. Think O'dor is still at South Melbourne.

APIA = WPFC reserves. Theres our youth team issue solved

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

Surely we want players like Keat to have a long and distinguished career in the States or Europe. Coming back to the Phoenix in 2 years time means he has failed.

All I do is make the stuff I would've liked
Reference things I wanna watch, reference girls I wanna bite
Now I'm firefly like a burning kite
And yousa fake fuck like a fleshlight

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Former Canterbury United, NZ u-20 and University of Tulsa (USA) defender Rhodri Payne from Christchurch is at South Melbourne, where Steven O'Dor is captain these days.

Socceroos legend Eddie Krncevic has replaced Vaughan Coveney as coach.

Rhodri PaynePlaying Number:3Age:29Position:DefenderSMFC Debut: 2007

2011 Player Sponsor:
Lucky Chrisomalidis

Steven O'Dor (Captain)Playing Number:4Age:24Position:DefenderSMFC Debut: 2005

2011 Player Sponsor:
Star21

Big Pete 652011-07-26 02:36:35

Big Pete 65, Christchurch

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Frankie Mac wrote:

james dean wrote:

Yeah Keat and Boxhall are probably options in 1-2 seasons.ï¿½ Keat is one I'd really like to see back here eventually, Wellington boy came through the system, always a good advertisement for the game in the region

ï¿½

Surely we want players like Keat to have a long and distinguished career in the States or Europe.ï¿½ Coming back to the Phoenix in 2 years time means he has failed.

exactly. we're supposed to bring through new talent not bring back players who would serve NZ greater by staying at a bigger club/league. my only exceptions would be for kiwis who are finishing their career etc... or the likes of Chris James who have shown lots of potential but faltered when given opportunities in better leagues.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

I've always said I'd like to see kiwis in the youth spots but talent wise we just don't have the resources to get more kiwis in the side.

Situation is comparable to Wales whose pro sides compete in their larger neighbour's leagues- and the top two teams Cardiff and Swansea don't always have a lot of Welsh players.

Newly promoted Premier League side Swansea have 10 Welsh players out of 28 in the first team squad (about a third) but they are mostly the younger players and that proportion is bound to decrease before the season kicks off with the manager realising he needs to strengthen the promotion-winning team with capable foreign players:

"Swansea City's Brendan Rodgers is happy with progress at the Liberty Stadium, but has admitted he hopes to bring in more players following the signing of Jose Moreira from Benfica."

The Kingz did better in their first two seasons in the old NSL relying heavily on foreign players and Aussies in key positions but with some experienced All Whites too adding some character-

but when the wheels fell off and the money ran out they tended to rely more on very average players (and coaches) from our National League and who clearly weren't up to the required standard...

Big Pete 65, Christchurch

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

In four seasons we've seen Rojas and Barbarouses come through, Smeltz develop into one of the best forwards in this part of the world, and Moss become one of the best keepers. Not to mention Sigmund who is now playing professionally where he was previously in the NZFC. These positive things are a lot to do because the Wellington Phoenix exists.

You could almost through Musa in there, by all accounts he is doing very well for the Under 20s and prior to the Phoenix I don't think he'd been picked in any age grade teams. If he's good enough and available then I'm sure Ricki will look at him again.

For me that's a pretty good strike rate. That's 5 All Whites who's careers have either taken off or significantly improved in 4 years, plus the potential emergence of Musa. Not sure there are too many club teams with that sort of strike rate of turning players into key internationals (or potentially key in the case of the young guys).

Just because we've signed a couple of Aussies this year doesn't mean the Phoenix are doing a bad job. Maybe Chettleburgh will sign and become the next in the production line, maybe it'll be Lovemore. But if they're not good enough to (or Ricki thinks they're not), then next year someone else could stand up and get noticed. If we go one year with no young Kiwis in the squad it's not the end of the world.

Paulinho2011-07-26 08:46:24

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Frankie Mac wrote:

james dean wrote:

ï¿½

Surely we want players like Keat to have a long and distinguished career in the States or Europe.ï¿½ Coming back to the Phoenix in 2 years time means he has failed.

This. Keat in particular seems to be on the up and up, if I was him there's no way in the world I'd ever consider coming back to Wellington at this stage.

Coming back in ten years time may be a little more realistic/beneficial

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Given he stepped up and scored the first peno against Man City I think he's more than 2+ years away from coming to us.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Lots of good comments from virtually everyone.

Is the Phoenix reserve team happening again this season? I think it's vital that a permanent youth system/reserve team occur and be continuously supplying players to the first team. Certain english clubs are famous for it (think QPR, and West Ham, Crystal Palace) and it eventually pays off for them. I think this is the logical way forward for us. Having our own supply of developing and developed players constantly coming through negates the need to import foreign and Australian players that demand too much money and may be flops anyway.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I do hope Nix A keep going this season. The ASB Challenge Cup seemed to work well, and playing for the A's got D-Mac back his mojo. (I miss him.)

Ramming liberal dribble down your throat since 2009
This forum needs less angst and more Kate Bush threads

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

If I had to be honest I'd take a punt that it's at risk in the current financial climate.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Hard News wrote:

Bright at Honved.ï¿½

Bright was released by Honved a few weeks ago, pretty sure he's currently a free agent.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

He's at Portland trialling.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Armann Smari Bjornsson
Free Agent http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ï¿½rmann_Smï¿½ri_Bjï¿½rnsson
Big tall fellow with international experience for Iceland.

And he can do this! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMH_B5rGLJQ

Wibblebutt2011-07-26 12:05:41

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I didn't know Ferrante was Icelandic...

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

milkweedman wrote:

hepatitis wrote:

ref Milkweedman, We've been through all that. It is fine as it is...

Look, if you truely believe that then I doubt you are a New Zealander with bias and a critical football brain.

If Ricki doesn't inject more Kiwis into the squad this season as per my analysis then he has to resign.

We need a fresh New Zealand based perspective on the Phoenix with a plan on implementing and injecting many more New Zealand players into the side over something like a five year plan. Not a results based, bums on seats, win at all costs to get the cash coming in, mentality.

We need a coherent plan with research and analysis based around ramping up both the quantity and quality of KIWI based players into the Phoenix over a continuous and prolonged period of time.

Ironically, if Ricki continues to prove otherwise as I'm sure he will due to his ultra conservative mentality, then bringing in a foreign born coach without a biased opinion of New Zealand players may actually result in such a New Zealand players based plan coming to fruition.

It's not Ricki's decision. He is employed by the Nnix and as a business, the Nix decides what their recruitment policy is.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

To suggest the sack for Ricki though is a bit silly - bringing through kiwi players is clearly not his mandate from the club. I would certainly argue that "results based, bums on seats, win at all costs to get the cash coming in, mentality" is pretty much the mentality of all professional sports teams.

Agree with this. Just having the Phoenix in NZ does great things for the sport here.

If we were to fill the ranks with locals just for the sake of it and the team went backwards as a result then that would be to the detriment of the game in NZ.

There is a track record of the very best players in the NZFC doing better than okay in the A League. Think Kosta, Marco and Siggy, who all stood out in the NZFC. So we should be thinking about who else in the NZFC is bossing everyone else about like those three were.

But otherwise, it's got to be a policy of get the best players we can. Obviously Aussies have an advantage over other non-Kiwis because there is an import limit but they don't count.

There just isn't anyone in New Zealand capable of replacing a Dura, a Muscat, or a Vinnie.

Is there someone capable of replacing a Pavlovic? Maybe, maybe not. I suspect not if I'm honest.

NZ needs the Nix to be a competitive success. That will bring fans and ensure survival. We don't need it to be an incubator for Kiwis who want to be professional footballers. We need to find other ways to do that.

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Robb wrote:

I didn't know Ferrante was Icelandic...

He's not.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

milkweedman wrote:

hepatitis wrote:

ref Milkweedman, We've been through all that. It is fine as it is...

Look, if you truely believe that then I doubt you are a New Zealander with bias and a critical football brain.

Not gonna let that pass. I am a New Zealander. I am biased to supporting my national team. I am a Nix supporter. I am biased to seeing them win. I have a critical football brain that says pick the best team. I would love Kiwis to be in the Nix, if and when they re good enough. If not, get whomever is better.

I prefer to have a team in the finals each season and have a chance to win the title than to have one languishing at the bottom of the table just for the sake of developing talent.

And we have been through this each season. yawn yawn

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I honestly donï¿½t see how the current situation is suitable for the Nix to act as an out and out developer of New Zealand footballing talent. The fact of the matter is that the team has to be competitive and get the best players it possibly can to win games at this level and attract fans. I donï¿½t think anyone can argue, otherwise, that a team of NZ nationals playing and losing would lose fans and crowds quick-smart. This is not a club owned by NZ Football, it is a business entity that must be run to make money. If the situation was different and we had a youth team, that would be different, you only have to look as far as the Warriors to see how a 3 tier system works well in a professional Australasian environment. Itï¿½s been touched on by others here, but the Nix does play a role in the development and retention of NZ players, there are/have been Kiwis in the team that have either come via the NZFC or been attracted home to play their football. You might even argue that there are some Kiwis that were given the opportunity and would not have got that at any other A League club.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

+1 what Smithy and Napier Phoenix said.

It is nice to come on here and read this forum where most people engage brain before keyboard, unlike Oz 442.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

That place was always going to go a little 'The World Game'.

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

SC03 wrote:

It is nice to come on here and read this forum where most people engage brain before keyboard, unlike Oz 442.

Shh. You'll upset Kiwi Chick.

Three for me, and two for them.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

With all this talk about signing Kiwi's one thing that does annoy me is the transfer fees that Brisbane received for Kosta's move to Russia and Victory will no doubt receive when a high enough bid comes in for Marco.

I'm sure that the long term goal would be able to have a viable development system so that contracted youth get enough quality games to improve and set them up for HAL and possibly transfers overseas.

Though the 'Nix need to be competitive to maintain its credibility, and to some degree football's credibility, in the general NZ sporting landscape

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Buffon II wrote:

SC03 wrote:

It is nice to come on here and read this forum where most people engage brain before keyboard, unlike Oz 442.

Shh. You'll upset Kiwi Chick.

That's why I usually stay out of AF

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Bullion wrote:

I agree with this. I think there is no reason we should lose kiwis to other A-League franchises - we want the kiwis in the league to be playing with us

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Interesting as well that there aren't a whole lot of aussies in the MLS. They tend to return home or play in slightly inferior leagues in Asia for more money rather than play at that level.

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Leggy wrote:

Robb wrote:

I didn't know Ferrante was Icelandic...

He's not.

Was a reference to the post above that one. In all fairness, I should've quoted rather than just responded.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

were we not supposed to make a signing from europe midway thru last week??? Have i missed something?

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