We need to talk about David

theprof

short answer to your statement is no!
All of the things you're not interested in are what keep the club afloat.
Think of the NRL and the clubs in Aus.They all have multiple businesses operating under the banner of the club to keep them financially viable. That's what the Nix are trying to build so they are not solely reliant on the football product.
Football is the visible product and as fans our #1 concern, but as a business the owners have other areas that are important.

Yep i get all that, but all that stuff was started because of the football. Whats the use of all the extras if your shop front is rubbish. 
Who is going to want send their kids to an academy whose senior team is rubbish and few of their  other teams are challenging.
We are no longer the only option to play professionally but seem to just carry on as if we are.

And it’s all that outside noise which leads to bad decisions and time/resources not devoted to football matters which could be profitable (I.e. OFC pro league and qualification for FIFA tournaments)

A better comparison would be the Warriors rather then Australian NRL clubs which make a lot of dosh from their league clubs (gaming and hospitality)

AucklandPhoenix

And it’s all that outside noise which leads to bad decisions and time/resources not devoted to football matters which could be profitable (I.e. OFC pro league and qualification for FIFA tournaments)

A better comparison would be the Warriors rather then Australian NRL clubs which make a lot of dosh from their league clubs (gaming and hospitality)

How do you know your assertion in the first line? You don’t. 

In fact, academy students seemed quite happy to not have to shuttle all over town to study and be part of the football academy.

I think Mr Gill needs to be answering a few questions. 

I can’t stop thinking about all that talk in the off season that last season wasn’t good enough, they have done a comprehensive review, everything overhauled - recruitment, pre season, more oversight at all level etc etc. 

Only to dish up the same if not worse this season. 
What was actually changed if anything?Who is in charge of all of this? If it was my business I’d certainly be demanding answers 

Well I know that their bid for entry to the OFC league was sharke

So either someone is an idiot when they prepared it or they had their eyes of the ball.

martinb

AucklandPhoenix

And it’s all that outside noise which leads to bad decisions and time/resources not devoted to football matters which could be profitable (I.e. OFC pro league and qualification for FIFA tournaments)

A better comparison would be the Warriors rather then Australian NRL clubs which make a lot of dosh from their league clubs (gaming and hospitality)

How do you know your assertion in the first line? You don’t. 

In fact, academy students seemed quite happy to not have to shuttle all over town to study and be part of the football academy.

Domey and Gill simply dont know what theyre doing. If they did, Chiefy wouldnt have been retained last season. That's all there is to it. 

Rudan told them to hire Talay. Talay told them to hire Chiefy. They did what they were told. They werent strong enough to tell Chiefy to leave. Chiefy said "I'll do better next season" and they said great, sounds good to us, saves us from having to do anything. 

The fact is Chiefy would be still in the job had he not resigned, the fact that the club's management did not want to speak on it today proves it and proves that he was not close to being sacked at all.

It also shows you that they have no clue what to do going forward as they were lucky previously to have coaches tell the club who should replace them.

Twindeling crowds, the mens Team a but joke, the Phoenix brand in shatters. I think the Morrison has to change things, he hopefully knows that his managers suck.

number8

Twindeling crowds, the mens Team a but joke, the Phoenix brand in shatters. I think the Morrison has to change things, he hopefully knows that his managers suck.

 I agree, financially and the womens side (for now) are the only positives. the rest sucks and in most clubs around the world the mens team is the one that matters the most.

observerfromuh

The fact is Chiefy would be still in the job had he not resigned, the fact that the club's management did not want to speak on it today proves it and proves that he was not close to being sacked at all.

It also shows you that they have no clue what to do going forward as they were lucky previously to have coaches tell the club who should replace them.

This actually isn’t true. It was a resign or be fired option. 

AucklandPhoenix

Well I know that their bid for entry to the OFC league was sharke

So either someone is an idiot when they prepared it or they had their eyes of the ball.

martinb

AucklandPhoenix

And it’s all that outside noise which leads to bad decisions and time/resources not devoted to football matters which could be profitable (I.e. OFC pro league and qualification for FIFA tournaments)

A better comparison would be the Warriors rather then Australian NRL clubs which make a lot of dosh from their league clubs (gaming and hospitality)

How do you know your assertion in the first line? You don’t. 

In fact, academy students seemed quite happy to not have to shuttle all over town to study and be part of the football academy.

We know that Christchurch won a FIFA bidding process by saying how important it was to have professional football in the South Island. You know where they aren’t going to play. 

How important it was to be close to where the players live. Which is why it was important for there to be a Vanuatu connection with the South Island because it was close to where players from Vanuatu lived.

Half the public statements contradicted the other half. 

All of which has got nothing to do with how opening a school has meant they can’t have been doing a proper job with the football. 

Just admit you don’t know what you are talking about. 

Who is better? Eze or Cosgrove? Did having an academy play much of a factor in that decision? Did it matter if the academy students had math in a classroom near the field or at a college a hour away? That’s what you were saying. 

I’d honestly support you being interim coach if it meant we didn’t have to listen to you just making stuff up to vibes infer things about the Nix.

It’s fine to have a difference of opinion on Chief’s competence or be annoyed by Gilly saying we had short memories, but in one breath you ask
how our sponsorships work and in the next you say they’re bad or we’re doing them badly or whatever. 

Do you really think last season and this season were the same? 

We saw a squad this season designed to cover most of the flaws of last season. Dan Edwards being injured has been unfortunate. But we’ve had increased cover elsewhere. 

We saw a plan to play attacking football. This had some success. But Chief in the last six weeks has thrown the baby out with the bath water to a degree by trying to do too much, being unable to roll with the large number of positives from this period and also been let down by some individual errors by players who should have been better. 

Last season we had an unbalanced squad. We played a horrible brand of football. We couldn’t score goals. We didn’t create chances. We relied on 17 year olds to be our main guys. 

This season we’ve got the golden boot so far. And Armiento has been a fun player to watch. Nagasawa had had plaudits up until yesterday, with his goal involvements one behind Carlo. (Apparently now Cassidy is basically as good according to the other thread which seems to be the Chiefiest thing from last season to me, but perhaps I have a short memory?) I’ve definitely enjoyed watching us play on many occasions this season. Night and day. 

Chief had a go, but Auckland were able to turn the screws on us twice after being surprised by our resistance in the first game. That’s a tough derby to be judged by.

We’re low down because the league is good this season and we missed out on points through missed penalties, slips, a keeper error and a few others or we’d be in the six. And overall our defense has not matched the reputations of the players in or in front of it, whoever’s fault that is. Though too many changes in personal and tactics doesn’t help.

We rolled the dice and it didn’t work. But it certainly wasn’t the same as last season.

If, and it is likely, it was a quit or be fired situation, the Nix don't get any credit for being willing to fire Chiefy after the game yesterday. Things simply couldnt go on, it was that bad, him staying was untenable. 

That's not a tough call, a brave proactive decision, or anything like that. They had no choice. Likewise, Chiefy doesnt really deserve much credit for resigning last night either.

Love to know where everyone is gettting the good news that financially things are rosy and positive?

Crowd next week will likely be below 3k unless they do a free deal.

I call bullshark

observerfromuh

number8

Twindeling crowds, the mens Team a but joke, the Phoenix brand in shatters. I think the Morrison has to change things, he hopefully knows that his managers suck.

 I agree, financially and the womens side (for now) are the only positives. the rest sucks and in most clubs around the world the mens team is the one that matters the most.

We know the finances are good because its the one thing the rest of the teams in the league are actualy jealous of.

Really?

And don’t say a club that has gone broke and no longer plays in the league.

Otherwise it’s a bit like Christopher Luxon saying that the world is jealous of our economy because it’s doing better then some basket cases in Africa.

Source please

Otherwise self invented bull shark 

you are the literal worst.
the level of exectation that evceryone provides a source for every comment/statement except yourself - you constantly make assertions about the club/Dome ec yet rarely providwe a creditble source!

the clubs financial stability is one thing that has been widely commented on by the league and APL.

and because I cant be arsed sourcing every story from the internet here is googles AI breakdown.

Welnix is a consortium of seven Wellington-based businessmen that has owned the Wellington Phoenix A-League club since 2011, taking over from the financially troubled Terry Serepisos era. 

Stabilized Club Operations: Under Welnix, the Phoenix was considered financially stable, providing much-needed stability off the field and managing the club effectively after its 2011 takeover.

While Welnix brought stability to the Phoenix, the club has historically operated within an A-League landscape where most clubs, excluding a few, have struggled with profitability.

Stuff
+4

I’m not the one saying that other clubs are jealous of our finances am I?

Then you try to back it up by plunging into AI. Have a look at the dates on the AI professor. 2018 is the most recent. That’s eight years ago.

However, you want a source

How about David Dome stating in an interview that every other business that the owners have been successful in has been successful apart from the Nix? And that he wonders how they can continue to put money in?

Good enough for you?

Sorry theprof i cant agree i wouldnt say we are in any way financially stable think you may find  the Welnix guys are continually having to top up the coffers. Domey is pretty open about it being a constant battle and what the owners put in should be considered philanthropy.

please note - my statement pertains to the owners being financially stable ie the Welnix. Which means they can continue to fund the football club. 
We all know and agree that the football team itself is a cost to the owners. 

My point has always been that Dome as GM of the company is responsible for a lot more than just the operation of the football club and that they are doing well.

theprof

please note - my statement pertains to the owners being financially stable ie the Welnix. Which means they can continue to fund the football club. 
We all know and agree that the football team itself is a cost to the owners. 

My point has always been that Dome as GM of the company is responsible for a lot more than just the operation of the football club and that they are doing well.

On that last point we do agree had Domey not been doing that part of his job im sure Morrison and his fellow owners would have got rid of him along time ago.
Think some are giving Domey to much credit for his influence on the football side.

ballane

LT01

Calling for leadership to go after a couple of bad seasons for the mens side when many other facets of the club are going well is a bit premature in my opinion, but the pressure is on them now. I'm keen to see how they react to this, who we get in next year coaches and players, and what steps are taken to get us back into finals football and to even up the derby chasm that has opened up with Auckland. Fail on that front, and there needs to be revolution.

Think its a stretch to say "many other facets of the club are doing well" 
Isnt  the main thing a football club should doing is fielding winning teams. Apart from our womans team nearly all our other teams fail to do that. Our reserve teams are rarely competitive and how many of our whst is it 8 Academy teams actually challenge to win titles.
Im afraid we are based on mediocrity and until that attitude changes us tragic fans will just have accept out sharkty lot.
COYN You bet i will be there next game isnt thst what fans do. Dosnt mean i cant be well PO with how its turned out.
To be honest couldnt give a shark about the Charter School or how great the Academy is i support the club to hopefully watch winning football teams not the shark thats continually dished up to us 

"Apart from our women's team"?

If the rest of the club were playing like shark but the top men's team were riding high, I don't think people would be this down on it

ballane

theprof

please note - my statement pertains to the owners being financially stable ie the Welnix. Which means they can continue to fund the football club. 
We all know and agree that the football team itself is a cost to the owners. 

My point has always been that Dome as GM of the company is responsible for a lot more than just the operation of the football club and that they are doing well.

On that last point we do agree had Domey not been doing that part of his job im sure Morrison and his fellow owners would have got rid of him along time ago.
Think some are giving Domey to much credit for his influence on the football side.

Agree that Dome has heaps more on his plate than just the football which is not surprising given he is the GM. To call for his head imo would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. The accountability for the absolute on field cluster should absolutely be with the Director of Football. Sean Gill imo should follow Chief out the door for allowing this absolute cluster under his watch. He may have been a decent operations guy but way out of his depth as a DOF. 

At this point, calling for Domey's head is nothing but emotional insurance in case Chiefy being gone doesn't result in the Nix doing better.

Domey is on the football commitee with Gill and is involved in all big footballing decisions. He isnt blameless when it comes to how much of a shambles the men's team has been, you cant just point the finger at Gill. 

Of all the "back to the future" calls around how to move forward ... what is Tony Pignata up to these days? He'd be a great get if we needed a new GM/CEO and he is the nostalgic type so it appealed. 

I have no doubt he could turn us around. He'd probably appreciate the chance to work with a functional ownership group too... rather than what he dealt with in our formative years.

Pignata is currently the CE of Football Tasmania.

You're right Dome isn't blameless for what happens on the field in that he hired Gill and Italiano - or was part of the group that made that decision, he also would be involved in signing off player signings. But beyond that the responsibility of on field performances lies with Gill, Italiano and his assistants.

imanixsupporter

Domey is on the football commitee with Gill and is involved in all big footballing decisions. He isnt blameless when it comes to how much of a shambles the men's team has been, you cant just point the finger at Gill. 

There is no public evidence that he definitely is, people can assume so. Going back some time he wasn't (Hickey, Chote and 2 members of the board not incl. Morgan https://www.odt.co.nz/sport/football/football-global-hunt-nix-coach ). Gill you would think given his position as DOF. 

Bullion

imanixsupporter

Domey is on the football commitee with Gill and is involved in all big footballing decisions. He isnt blameless when it comes to how much of a shambles the men's team has been, you cant just point the finger at Gill. 

There is no public evidence that he definitely is, people can assume so. Going back some time he wasn't (Hickey, Chote and 2 members of the board not incl. Morgan https://www.odt.co.nz/sport/football/football-global-hunt-nix-coach ). Gill you would think given his position as DOF. 

Gill said the Domey was on the Football Comittee when he was on Fever FM at the end of last season

I think someone in this club (or everyone) need to a lot of self-reflection as to how we got to the situation we are in.. Pointing fingers is all well & good, but end of last year there was a "review" process that took place, what was the conclusion of that?  Who did the review? Did they review each other? was it self-reflection? IMO I dont think anyone needs to "go" but I would be in favour of an external review of all operations, a clear subjective view that can come to conclusions.

Elite sports team do it all the time  AFL 2024: Melbourne Demons to undergo external review after culture and on-field problems, Simon Goodwin future, latest news  (Melbourne won the afl premiership in 2021, then off-feld issues plagued them, including lack of leadership off & on the field & wests tigers did the same  NRL 2023: Wests Tigers review, Benji Marshall, Justin Pascoe, Lee Hagipantelis, news, David Furner, Western Suburbs Magpies, highlights ). Surely this wont be far fetched for the Nix to do? There might be some hard answers in here, and peoples egos will be hurt but it could unearth some answers? 

It does feel like there is lack of accountability within the club, and the way they treated the fans last year who were hurting with last years performances with Italiano's contract extension (making fun of a fans banner by memeing it "Chiefy in" & saying fans have short memories) a culture of arrogance has potentially crept in? 

Ultimately as fans we want answers, and deservedly so, I am not sure changing a coach will change much.. but what do I know.

100 per cent Dome is on the football committee. It was stated by either he or Gill on a fan pod at the beginning of the season.

With the fan group pods drying up, it would be really good if the Spooney’s of this world had a deep dive with David Dome on the current inner workings of the Nix.

The problem I have with Dome was the constant whining about crowd sizes and not being not behind the team. All the emotional blackmailing the actual fans not the casual which probably never read GM interviews.
And the delivering two years of the worst football with crowd sizes halfed. This should have been the easiest two years to sell and create buzz with the games against Auckland. Who ever makes the final decision at the club or gave advise should go. They had the time to turn things around a year ago and missed it.
I doubt it good for the business, ticket sales, kits, sponsors this is all a hard sell. Nobody is buying those things because they have a school.

It’s interesting that this year he has been quite on the subject.

Probably around the time this thread was made 😂

Blessings 

number8

The problem I have with Dome was the constant whining about crowd sizes and not being not behind the team. All the emotional blackmailing the actual fans not the casual which probably never read GM interviews.
And the delivering two years of the worst football with crowd sizes halfed. This should have been the easiest two years to sell and create buzz with the games against Auckland. Who ever makes the final decision at the club or gave advise should go. They had the time to turn things around a year ago and missed it.
I doubt it good for the business, ticket sales, kits, sponsors this is all a hard sell. Nobody is buying those things because they have a school.

do people care about goals, style, or wins more? I don't think its goals because before this weekend we had scored the 2nd most goals in the league, and then on style we tried to play a similar way after finishing 2nd but had a bad season (various reasons from squad changes and absences) and people complained about style that season but less so the season before. So is it style or is it just winning?

I actually agree with you on this one - there’s a lot of speculation about how things work inside the club, and while we aren’t their shareholders it would be great to see them fill the information vacuum as much as commercial considerations allow.

It might not relieve any of the frustrations we feel, but at least we’d be better informed.

Simon B

AucklandPhoenix wrote:

With the fan group pods drying up, it would be really good if the Spooney’s of this world had a deep dive with David Dome on the current inner workings of the Nix.

I actually agree with you on this one - there’s a lot of speculation about how things work inside the club, and while we aren’t their shareholders it would be great to see them fill the information vacuum as much as commercial considerations allow.

It might not relieve any of the frustrations we feel, but at least we’d be better informed.

We have a FRG meeting coming up sort some questions out im happy to pose them.
Just remember there are some things they wont disclose and i wont be able to ask every question that may be posted. I dont think we can expect to be told the inner workings that some may want dont think there are many football clubs who disclose much about what they do or how they may go about it.

As i said happy to submit them to see whats said.

Bullion

number8

The problem I have with Dome was the constant whining about crowd sizes and not being not behind the team. All the emotional blackmailing the actual fans not the casual which probably never read GM interviews.
And the delivering two years of the worst football with crowd sizes halfed. This should have been the easiest two years to sell and create buzz with the games against Auckland. Who ever makes the final decision at the club or gave advise should go. They had the time to turn things around a year ago and missed it.
I doubt it good for the business, ticket sales, kits, sponsors this is all a hard sell. Nobody is buying those things because they have a school.

do people care about goals, style, or wins more? I don't think its goals because before this weekend we had scored the 2nd most goals in the league, and then on style we tried to play a similar way after finishing 2nd but had a bad season (various reasons from squad changes and absences) and people complained about style that season but less so the season before. So is it style or is it just winning?

It‘s winning with style!
Everyone remembers the last minute King Kenny goal, nobody remembers the last goal of our last win, at least I can‘t remember.
I always say, I never mind a team losing when they play their best.

In all this I am more Dome out than ever, where has been since Saturday night. 

Also telling that if Chiefy hadn't resigned the club would have done nothing.

Bullion

number8

The problem I have with Dome was the constant whining about crowd sizes and not being not behind the team. All the emotional blackmailing the actual fans not the casual which probably never read GM interviews.
And the delivering two years of the worst football with crowd sizes halfed. This should have been the easiest two years to sell and create buzz with the games against Auckland. Who ever makes the final decision at the club or gave advise should go. They had the time to turn things around a year ago and missed it.
I doubt it good for the business, ticket sales, kits, sponsors this is all a hard sell. Nobody is buying those things because they have a school.

do people care about goals, style, or wins more? I don't think its goals because before this weekend we had scored the 2nd most goals in the league, and then on style we tried to play a similar way after finishing 2nd but had a bad season (various reasons from squad changes and absences) and people complained about style that season but less so the season before. So is it style or is it just winning?

It's about winning. Style comes second.

There has been a tonne of criticism about Arsenal's "style" and how they win matches this season. I promise you not a single Arsenal fan will give a fudge if it leads to a league title.